SM57 vs. e609

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enferno

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hey all.

i'm not here to ask any questons, offer any opinions, just to post 2 sound clips. same song, one take recorded with a 57, double tracked and panned hard left and right. the other with an e609, double tracked and panned hard left and right.


i'll let your ears do the rest.


by the way, no compression, eq, ior any other kind of processing was done other than panning.




Shure SM-57:


Sennheiser e609:


i just relized that the e609 was 5 bmp slower.


EDIT: I used the pre-s on my alesis studio 32, recorded it with a m-audio delta 1010lt into cubase sx 2.0.2. i'm using a gibson sg gothic wtih stock pickups, into a digitech metal master into a digitech rp-50 into a roland cube 60.
 
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bigwillz24 said:
E609 but it sounds like the sm57 is mic farther away from the source.
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the sm57 is actually about 2 iches closer. it's right on the grille. i backed the e609 off a bit so it won't get so much bass/proximity effect
 
yeh thats what i was gona say, the sm57 sounds quieter and noisier on purpose to make it seem worse than the other one...but i actually like the overall sound of the 57 better when you turn the volume up.
 
sorry , i didnt mean to accuse you of doing that...i was just saying thats what it sounded like.
 
any test whare the placement between the two competeing mics isn't controoled very closely, is really just not fair.

if you adjust for sound then were listening to your placement, not really the differances in the sound of the mic.

also, care must be taken that the volumes are the same, a louder signel will very often be choosen as the "better one"
 
how is this really relevant? how often will you ever have a single electric guitar playing by itself in the midst of a mix? and in those cases, how often will you settle for "just" an sm57 or e609? i'll always have something else (mic-wise) hung in conjunction with the close mic for those "solo guitar" segments.

i find both mics to be very useful. they each have their own tone, and one usually "mates" better with a particular amp/guitar than the other for what's needed in the track. and besides, isn't it how the guitar sound interacts with the rest of the tracks in the mix that is ultimately important? sometimes you want your guitar to sound thin, distant and shrill when solo'd. you don't always want full range on an electric guitar--in fact, i'd argue that you rarely want that.

if you presented us with 2 mixes of the same song, with the only difference being the mic used on the guitar track (with the track recorded at the same time by both mics), i think then that might be a more effective comparison.

not to bust your chops or anything.....i do appreciate your efforts and everything......i just rarely find this sort of thing useful as a close-mic'd electric guitar rarely sits on its own in a mix.....


cheers,
wade
 
mrface2112 said:
how is this really relevant? how often will you ever have a single electric guitar playing by itself in the midst of a mix? and in those cases, how often will you settle for "just" an sm57 or e609? i'll always have something else (mic-wise) hung in conjunction with the close mic for those "solo guitar" segments.

i find both mics to be very useful. they each have their own tone, and one usually "mates" better with a particular amp/guitar than the other for what's needed in the track. and besides, isn't it how the guitar sound interacts with the rest of the tracks in the mix that is ultimately important? sometimes you want your guitar to sound thin, distant and shrill when solo'd. you don't always want full range on an electric guitar--in fact, i'd argue that you rarely want that.

if you presented us with 2 mixes of the same song, with the only difference being the mic used on the guitar track (with the track recorded at the same time by both mics), i think then that might be a more effective comparison.

not to bust your chops or anything.....i do appreciate your efforts and everything......i just rarely find this sort of thing useful as a close-mic'd electric guitar rarely sits on its own in a mix.....


cheers,
wade
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the purpose of a shoot out of this nature is not to show whick mic will always be the choice in any given situation. It is to, in a controoled manner, show the differances between the mics so that you have an idea of what the mic sounds like in the future, aideing mic coice in specific situations.


i for one, don't like the sound of a 609 solo pritty much ever, but i use it all the time in conjunction with other mics because of the sound it adds to the over-all charcter. in short, i already have an idea of how it will affect any given sound.
 
giraffe said:
the purpose of a shoot out of this nature is not to show whick mic will always be the choice in any given situation. It is to, in a controoled manner, show the differances between the mics so that you have an idea of what the mic sounds like in the future, aideing mic coice in specific situations.


i for one, don't like the sound of a 609 solo pritty much ever, but i use it all the time in conjunction with other mics because of the sound it adds to the over-all charcter. in short, i already have an idea of how it will affect any given sound.
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Know your tool set, excellent. What Trim values and on/off axis did you use? Even though I am a fan of the 57 microphone, I liked the fullness of the 609. I do feel the 57 could do better. I always find that every microphone, even the same model, has an angle or trim or positional preference all of it's own. It's a good shoot out because we can simulate different conditions on our equipment. I love the 609 microphone as a tool, and I love the sm57, but I know that the 57 could have done a tad better than it did. Give it shot. Exploit the proximity effect a tad.
 
giraffe said:
It is to, in a controoled manner, show the differances between the mics
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So......what, exactly, was controlled here? you've got a room that none of us have been in, seen or heard. you've got two separate takes of a song with mics in more or less arbitrary placements. you've got 2 tracks panned hard left and right, regardless of however *that* might affect the sound. AND the takes themselves are admittedly at different tempos. what was controlled here? maybe the guitar? do we even know that it, the amp or the effects remained at the same level throughout?

if you're looking at this with a scientific eye, there's WAAAAY too many variables at play here for the word "controlled" to even begin to cross a scientific person's mind. sorry, that doesn't wash to me.

giraffe said:
show the differances between the mics so that you have an idea of what the mic sounds like in the future, aideing mic coice in specific situations.
Click to expand...

all this showed was the difference in these mics, in different placements, on his amp, in his room, with two completely different takes.

this has no bearing to me, in my room, with my amps and my guitars. these mics could have been a V69 and a U47 for all it matters. neither of them sounds like an sm57 or an e609 on my amps in my room......and it's what a mic sounds like on my amps in my room that matters when it comes to "aiding mic choice in specific situations".

giraffe said:
in short, i already have an idea of how it will affect any given sound.
Click to expand...

as do i.....but that's b/c i've used the mics first-hand. not b/c i've listened to someone else's arbitrary clips. i really fail to see what the usefulness of this exercise is, beyond "here's two completely different takes of a guitar part, what do you think?".


anyone who choses a mic based on a "test" like this would be just as well off buying a mic blindly, as this is NO indication of how said mic will perform for *you*.


cheers,
wade
 
giraffe said:
i for one, don't like the sound of a 609 solo pritty much ever,
Click to expand...

oh, and i meant to add.....i too generally don't like the sound of an e609 when solo'd.....but in the context of a mix, it quite often gives me *exactly* what i'm looking for, when trying to balance the guitar with the bass with the drums with the other guitars with the keys with the vocals. several times the e609 has given me straight out what would have taken significant eqing on an sm57 to get. and i'd rather not have to eq if i don't have to.

and, at least to me, it's what the guitar sounds like in the context of the mix that matters.


cheers,
wade
 
this test is less than ideal, i was defending the usefulness of shoot-outs in genral, not specifically this one.

but, if you put both these mics on an amp in a controoled manner, never having heard the amp or been in the room you can still discern a few things.

like, 609 bright, even harsh sometimes, scooped mids and low mids. less bass than it gets credit for.
57 more proninent in the mids, not as bright, "fuller" sound in compairison.

things worth knowing.
 
OUCH! You guys are being a little tough on him aren't you? I personally like to have afew clips to listen to now and then. That being said, I liked the tone of the '57 better. But it did sound farther away from the source.
 
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