Mic Pre's for drums

J

jonrusso99

New member
I currently have 2 focusrite liquid channels which are my main pre-amps and will probably use them for most applications. I have been using a Presonus Digimax (8 channel pre) for drums. After hearing how bad the digimax sounds compared to the higher end pres Im thinking about upgrading my drum pres.
Is there a standard for drums as far as tube vs Solid state. Should all the drums be sent through the same type of preamp? I'm currently thinking about the ISA 428 for toms but have no idea for kick and snare (im planning on using my liquid channels as overheads.) I'd like to have a good tube for other purposes as well since those are what the liquid channels have the most difficulty in replicating.
Any suggestions?
 
I just upgraded my Digimax, becuase I realized it wasn't quite "doing it" for me either. I got a Sytek 4 channel preamp and I love the difference. I use it for overheads, kick and snare. I still use the Digimax for toms. The difference was very noticable. People also love the Great River for drums and I think the guys at rec.org are pretty into Sebatron as well.
 
If you are looking for a good tight high end pre for drums, nothing beats API for that application. If you need to conserve a little on budget, than the Sytek is also a good box. For overheads I have always been a fan a something a littl warmer to smooth them out a bit. Something neveish (great river, vintech etc...) or even a Chandler or a Daking preamp for drum overheads. I can't say enough about API on kick and snare though. Really gives them a sort of explosion.
 
API without a doubt.OR Focusrite Red.....but for drums ,especially Rock drums, API...The Daking 52270 for the overheads...thats a nice sound!Really, any pre that will effortlessly provide depth-of-field will work well for the overheads.
 
There are 2 channel API clones available from Brent Averill. There are still alot of places that are offering a free 6 space lunchbox if you buy any four API modules as well. If you filled that out with two preamps, 2 comps and 2 of the 4 band (or 3 band) EQ's that would be an incredible kick snare punch. Not to mention those API comps and EQ's work awesome on just about anything, and the preamps will still leave you some great stuff for other tracks as well. Plus, you can fill the rack out later if you can't do it all at once piece by piece. Also, API holds it resale value really really well should you for some silly reason ever actually want to sell them.
 
You are talking about the 3124 4-channel preamp right?
Or just saw their 8-channel.

Also where is a good place to get one?

p.s. (How do you include the quote from a previous entry in a post)
 
The 3124 is a single rackspace 4 preamp unit. What I was refferring to was a non rackable "lunchbox" style case with power supply. They are a bout 4 rack spaces tall. The channels go vertically inside them. The only advantage here is that you can put 6 channels in it and you can choose between preamps, compression, and the various EQ's they offer. Whereas with the 3124 it only comes in a 4 preamp version.
 
jon, I listened to some of your music from the link in the mic thread a week ago or so. You guys do heavy stuff. I agree on the API and think you'll find API doing some serious justice to a lot more tracks than just drums on your music.

Also, a great and relatively less expensive complement to API are the Sebatron pres. The vmp-2000e works well for rock drum OH's. The Sebatron pres have sort of a softening effect. They temper harsh transients from cymbals really well and help put the kit just a bit behind in the mix.
 
[/QUOTE]
jonrusso99 said:
You are talking about the 3124 4-channel preamp right?
Or just saw their 8-channel.

Also where is a good place to get one?

p.s. (How do you include the quote from a previous entry in a post)
Click to expand...
xstatic said:
The 3124 is a single rackspace 4 preamp unit. What I was refferring to was a non rackable "lunchbox" style case with power supply. They are a bout 4 rack spaces tall. The channels go vertically inside them. The only advantage here is that you can put 6 channels in it and you can choose between preamps, compression, and the various EQ's they offer. Whereas with the 3124 it only comes in a 4 preamp version.
Click to expand...
He means like a... API 500-6B with 512C preamps and etc.

PS... click on the "QUOTE" button on the bottom right of the post to inclued the quote.
 
xstatic said:
There are 2 channel API clones available from Brent Averill. There are still alot of places that are offering a free 6 space lunchbox if you buy any four API modules as well. If you filled that out with two preamps, 2 comps and 2 of the 4 band (or 3 band) EQ's that would be an incredible kick snare punch. Not to mention those API comps and EQ's work awesome on just about anything, and the preamps will still leave you some great stuff for other tracks as well. Plus, you can fill the rack out later if you can't do it all at once piece by piece. Also, API holds it resale value really really well should you for some silly reason ever actually want to sell them.
Click to expand...

which places offer a free lunchobx?

cheers
 
MOFO Pro said:
Just curious... what do you think of them... I'm tempted
Click to expand...

The liquid channels certainly sound better than what Ive been used to (ART MPA and Digimax) but that was a given. I haven't had a chance to really test them yet on things like vocals and acoustic guitars.
Since I have no experience with any of the orignals I cant really say whether they match well or not.
So far I'm having trouble hearing differences between all of them. But my ears are still in the training stages.
Ill do a post once i have greater experience. But order one from sweetwater or musiciansfriend and give it a try, you can always return it (double chack that before you buy)

Thanks for the help guys I think ill give those API's a try. One more thing, would it be good to stick with them on everything (except maybe the overheads) Or is it a good idea to get some variety and use the API on kick and snare and something else on toms?
 
Damn, one more thing acually. Can I get away without the external compressors for the drums, or are they a necessity going in? I've got waves compressors and might get the UAD1 for soft plugs.
 
Either Sonic Circus or Vintage king or Mercenary should have the API deal still.

API's would sound incredible on toms as well, and for certain styles of music would probably be my choice for overheads. In general though I love the API sound on drums, but a less aggressive smoother sound on the Overheads. If you wanted some more flavors you could look into some of the OSA preamps as well.

As far as drum compression goes, I prefer not to compress drums on the way in, or else just a little. I have just never been a fan of much compression on individual drum tracks. I personally like to squash the drum buss a bit though, just not the individual tracks. This means that you would have to either mix analog to use hardware comps, or do it with plug-ins. I love the UAD La2a on drum busses with a little Pultec to brighten it up a bit. I haven't tried the Fairchild emulation yet. part of the reason i like to compress the drum buss instead of the individual tracks is because I love the big huge punchy drum sound. This often means lots of mics and tracks with individual EQ's per track. The 2 buss compression (in my opinion) allows me to make the tracks huge and seperate (panning, EQ etc....) but then use the 2 buss comp at the end to kind of reseal the kit so the end effect is a huge kit that sounds whole and not like a bunch of mixed pieces.
 
Ditto the 2bass compression.....Not compressing going in will make this an easier task to accomplish.Lately I've been compressing only the drum tracks and leaving the overheads out and bussing them separately.It leaves me the option of perhaps an EQ across the over sub or perhaps an aural enhancer(which can work well for heavier cymbals and cymbal usage)....The drummer I use most of the time has light soft cymbals so they sound a bit strident when compressed with the kit.Though this can be a nice effect in a certain song format.On the last record I went to a friends ProTools room and mixed there.Larger room area,Latest ProTools rig,tons and tons of plugs,control surface.....nice.I got to where I actually liked some of the plugs more than the hardware...less noise and much more adjustment....The UAD package is great and I also like the LA-2A in it....I didnt get to the Fairchild but nexttime...the bass is going in there and never leaving.Having so many choices allowed me to use my separated drum bussing really efficiently with two types of reverbs on the drum busses also.A complimentary sheen for both.Horsepower rules!

An interesting find last year...the ART VLA makes a great drum buss compressor....at least mine does.Its all it gets used for these days.
 
Great mixing suggestions! I'll definitely try compressing the bus instead of individual tracks. Would you comp it like you would an indivual drum? What are the numbers approximately? I usually use about .15ms attack, 50ms release with a ratio of about 3-4. Does that sound about right in general?

Anyways I think Im going to go with a pair of the 4 channel APIs (if I can find enough $$). Its a little cheaper that way and I don't really need the comps. Ill let you know what I think once I give them a try.
 
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