Glitches in audio playback on my laptop through Firewire bus

Whoopysnorp

Whoopysnorp

New member
I have a laptop and a desktop, and I use the same 500 GB external hard drive and Fireface 800 audio interface with both. Both machines also use the same OS (Windows XP Pro) set up in basically the same way. On my desktop, I use an aftermarket Firewire PCI card with (I think) a TI chipset, and this setup works beautifully. I can play back sessions containing many tracks with no problems at all. However, on my laptop, I get occasional glitches in playback even with low track counts and latencies/buffering set high. The laptop is a Dell Inspiron 1526 and I believe the FW controller is by Ricoh. Does that not seem to indicate that the laptop's FW bus is not up to snuff? Is there anything I can do to improve performance, or will I have to add an aftermarket Firewire card? It really sucks to be in the middle of a good take and all of a sudden have your backing track in your headphones be totally off from where it should be...
 
Ricoh is known to be a really dodgy chipset. Among other things, the Linux guys can't seem to keep an isoch channel from randomly closing last I looked. Might be what's happening on Windows, too, not sure. Such a failure shouldn't even be possible, so I'm not sure what's going on. :D
 
Found a tool that was very helpful in nailing down part of the cause of the problem: http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

On my machine, disabling the onboard audio and wireless card via Device Manager had the most significant effect in lowering my overall latency. I am still getting a spike every 20-30 seconds but it seems to be working OK in spite of it.
 
Whoopysnorp said:
Found a tool that was very helpful in nailing down part of the cause of the problem: http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

On my machine, disabling the onboard audio and wireless card via Device Manager had the most significant effect in lowering my overall latency. I am still getting a spike every 20-30 seconds but it seems to be working OK in spite of it.
Click to expand...

You might try changing the PCI bus latency timer settings. It could be that one device is hogging the PCI bus. You might also have an IRQ conflict, so you should also try to redo the IRQ steering. Don't ask me how to do any of those things. I don't run Windows.
 
boingoman said:
Maybe you could open task manager and see what process is responsible for that spike.
Click to expand...

I was trying to see if anything spiked in Process Explorer (which has more robust analysis of running processes than Task Manager) but it wasn't. I booted into my Vista partition to see if I got the same spike every 15 seconds, and I did, which makes me think it's a hardware issue. I am currently in the process of installing a super-stripped-down version of XP on what used to be my Vista partition (I've given Vista two chances and found it unsatisfactory both times...but I digress). We'll see if that solves anything. Otherwise I might have to mess around with IRQs.
 
Yeah, I think you're right...I've never used it before but I guess it's time to learn.

Even with the ultra-streamlined Windows XP install with no drivers installed yet, the spike occurs every 15 seconds. I hope this machine doesn't turn out to be unsuitable for audio work...
 
I got a richos in my dell laptop
its fine for rme cards but I have mass trouble with others..ratt traced it down to a wireless tray utility that was running even though firewire was off
forcing it to unload got rid of my dpc spikes
 
Good info...thanks! I don't have time to start running RATTV3 right now, but looking around on the net has given me an idea of how to interpret the logs when I do run it.
 
How much RAM? Sounds like Windows is paging stuff to disk on a regular basis. Get as much as you can - get 3 gig RAM and you'll have some 2,4-2,5 gig to work with.
 
Hey, whoopysnorp (coolest username ever), when I bumped up the shared memory for video mine ran a lot better. Watch RAM usage and CPU usage in Task Manager. If they're not high, your PCI bus might be clogging up. For me, it was the video.
 
The machine has 2 gigs of ram with ~200 MB or maybe a bit less allocated to video. My CPU usage idles between 0 and 3 percent and my RAM usage normally idles between 19 and 25 percent (obviously that's when I'm not running any audio apps). So increasing the amount allocated to video might actually increase my performance?
 
Whoopysnorp said:
The machine has 2 gigs of ram with ~200 MB or maybe a bit less allocated to video. My CPU usage idles between 0 and 3 percent and my RAM usage normally idles between 19 and 25 percent (obviously that's when I'm not running any audio apps). So increasing the amount allocated to video might actually increase my performance?
Click to expand...

It did for me because the small RAM for video meant more traffic on the PCI bus. Instead of sending one big thing to the video adapter it had to send a bunch of little ones across the bus.
 
Still having no luck solving this...I've disabled every piece of hardware and killed every process that I feel isn't essential to my system functioning; I've doubled the amount of RAM dedicated to video; I've restricted my min and max page file size to be the same (3200 MB). I still get the DPC spikes every 15 seconds no matter what. RATTV3 doesn't seem to point to anything useful; the log looks basically the same as the log from my desktop, which has an extremely low DPC latency at all times. If it helps, here it is (I hope the formatting doesn't get messed up):

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Counts by driver for: BROWNTOWN
|
| From: SAT APR-5-2008 3:5:40.55
| To: SAT APR-5-2008 3:9:3.22
| Runs: 3
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cumulative Histogram for: afd.sys (\SystemRoot\System32\drivers\afd.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 0, 3
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 9
TOTALS, 0, 0, 12

Cumulative Histogram for: HTTP.sys (\SystemRoot\System32\Drivers\HTTP.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 0, 11
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 1
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 5
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 6
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 7
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 1
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 0, 1
TOTALS, 0, 0, 32

Cumulative Histogram for: i8042prt.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\i8042prt.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 1, 0
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 16, 0
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 85, 3, 0
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 6825, 3, 0
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 1864, 262, 0
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 1120, 448, 0
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 2814, 1342, 0
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 151, 61, 0
12, 30.00us to 39.99us, <40.00us, 17, 12, 0
13, 40.00us to 49.99us, <50.00us, 6, 0, 0
14, 50.00us to 59.99us, <60.00us, 5, 0, 0
15, 60.00us to 69.99us, <70.00us, 1, 0, 0
TOTALS, 12888, 2148, 0

Cumulative Histogram for: ipnat.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\ipnat.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 0, 4
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 0, 0, 3
TOTALS, 0, 0, 7

Cumulative Histogram for: ipsec.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\ipsec.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 4
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 4
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 6
TOTALS, 0, 0, 14

Cumulative Histogram for: netbt.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\netbt.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 28
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 67
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 36
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 12
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 0, 7
TOTALS, 0, 0, 150

Cumulative Histogram for: rdbss.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\rdbss.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
1, 1.00us to 1.99us, <2.00us, 0, 0, 14
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 0, 4370
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 1198
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 249
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 83
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 34
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 11
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 0, 5
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 0, 2
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 0, 10
TOTALS, 0, 0, 5976

Cumulative Histogram for: srv.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\srv.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 3, 0
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 17, 17
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 83, 6
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 33, 3
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 12, 4
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 1, 5
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 1, 2
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 0, 1
TOTALS, 0, 150, 38

Cumulative Histogram for: tcpip.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\tcpip.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 43, 0
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 1424, 0
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 3516, 0
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 1157, 0
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 359, 0
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 116, 0
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 101, 0
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 38, 0
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 74, 0
TOTALS, 0, 6828, 0

Cumulative Histogram for: TDI.SYS (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\TDI.SYS)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 45
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 793
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 669
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 198
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 81
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 0, 53
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 0, 36
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 0, 64
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 0, 0, 1
TOTALS, 0, 0, 1940

Cumulative Histogram for: Wdf01000.sys (\SystemRoot\system32\DRIVERS\Wdf01000.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 2, 0
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 4, 0
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 9, 0
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 36, 0
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 516, 0
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 454, 0
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 120, 0
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 919, 9
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 0, 77, 4
12, 30.00us to 39.99us, <40.00us, 0, 2, 5
13, 40.00us to 49.99us, <50.00us, 0, 7, 0
14, 50.00us to 59.99us, <60.00us, 0, 2, 0
TOTALS, 0, 2148, 18

Cumulative Histogram for: watchdog.sys (\SystemRoot\System32\watchdog.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
1, 1.00us to 1.99us, <2.00us, 0, 0, 31
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 0, 9
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 21
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 11
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 2
TOTALS, 0, 0, 74

Cumulative Histogram for: ntkrnlpa.exe (\WINDOWS\system32\ntkrnlpa.exe)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
1, 1.00us to 1.99us, <2.00us, 0, 442, 25
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 8221, 289
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 2082, 121
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 2001, 264
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 3930, 297
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 2688, 52
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 1196, 93
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 1603, 93
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 1538, 33
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 0, 4037, 126
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 0, 14, 31
TOTALS, 0, 27752, 1424

Cumulative Histogram for: atapi.sys (atapi.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 2, 0
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 1, 0
8, 8.00us to 8.99us, <9.00us, 0, 54, 0
9, 9.00us to 9.99us, <10.00us, 0, 76, 0
10, 10.00us to 19.99us, <20.00us, 145, 317, 0
11, 20.00us to 29.99us, <30.00us, 501, 49, 0
12, 30.00us to 39.99us, <40.00us, 8, 134, 0
13, 40.00us to 49.99us, <50.00us, 0, 11, 0
14, 50.00us to 59.99us, <60.00us, 0, 5, 0
15, 60.00us to 69.99us, <70.00us, 0, 4, 0
17, 80.00us to 89.99us, <90.00us, 0, 1, 0
TOTALS, 654, 654, 0

Cumulative Histogram for: NDIS.sys (NDIS.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
2, 2.00us to 2.99us, <3.00us, 0, 0, 164
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 145
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 77
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 72
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 13
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 1
TOTALS, 0, 0, 472

Cumulative Histogram for: Ntfs.sys (Ntfs.sys)
#, Range, Label, ISR Count, DPC Count, DPCTmr Count
3, 3.00us to 3.99us, <4.00us, 0, 0, 4
4, 4.00us to 4.99us, <5.00us, 0, 0, 20
5, 5.00us to 5.99us, <6.00us, 0, 0, 18
6, 6.00us to 6.99us, <7.00us, 0, 0, 2
7, 7.00us to 7.99us, <8.00us, 0, 0, 1
TOTALS, 0, 0, 45
 
Firewire glitches

Whoopysnorp said:
Found a tool that was very helpful in nailing down part of the cause of the problem: http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

On my machine, disabling the onboard audio and wireless card via Device Manager had the most significant effect in lowering my overall latency. I am still getting a spike every 20-30 seconds but it seems to be working OK in spite of it.
Click to expand...

I am having the same problem with a PCI card and Dell Studio 1535. spikes randomly maybe every 8 sec. then complete loss of audio at random moments. Have to reboot to get audio back.
I am trying another PCI express card that does not include a USB slot. It's made by Star Tech. have turned off all that stuff in device manager. No improvement. Any ideas?? thanks.
 
See what's sharing an IRQ with the FireWire card and move it to a different IRQ. Either that or move the FireWire card to a different slot.
 
dgatwood said:
See what's sharing an IRQ with the FireWire card and move it to a different IRQ. Either that or move the FireWire card to a different slot.
Click to expand...

My dell wireless card is sharing the IRQ. Talked to Dell a bunch and they were no help. Will try again.
thanks.
 
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