Definition of Professional Musician

I was only refering to the Stagehand thing because there are a HUGE number of people out there,.... posing as a professional, in just about every area of earning a living,.... and those folks are making it harder for those of us who respect and appreciate the 'REAL' pros

The entertainment field is just one of the more obvious because of the public exposure that our business is associated with....


I have seen many other area's of expertice where the so called pros are rampant,... take the building trades,.... I do some basic renovation work,... and that industry is rife with posers,... ask C7, he'll tell ya the same,.... there is absolutely no reason to have to go behind someone who actually DOES earn substantial $$$ from shoddy work,....and have to fix it,... or make it look good.....

Ask any painter who has tried to work behind crappy drywall finishers,.... or a drywaller who has to cover crappy framing,.... etc etc etc,.....




On the other hand, in our business, how does someone like the Simpson girls ever get even a second glance when there are MUCH better artists out there who never get a break,......

Being a 'PRO' in the entertainment business,.... I mean, a person who actually is being promoted by a record company, or has several CD's out on the market, does not make that person a 'PRO',....

just look at all the crappy entertainers who still think people want to hear their stuff, and have the BACKING to go out on tour again,......


the worse they are generally, the more they rely on distractions like lots of lights, and pyro,......

and don't get me started on crappy sound guys,......


Many concerts have been ruined by 'PRO' sound guys who have NO clue how to do a live mix, ......


just my opinion tho, take it or leave it,.....
 
ggunn said:
There are many takes on this, but mine is that it is a matter of attitude.

I do not presently make my entire living in music, but I have in the past. I show up on time and in condition to play, play my parts to the best of my ability, and I am considerate of other musicians, audience members, stage hands, club owners, etc. I do what is necessary for the show to go on, and I have been playing music for more than 40 years. I consider myself a professional. YMMV.
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That comes closest to my view of it. But I also think there is more to it; a professional has paid his / her dues in the business. And in doing that for 40 years, you've paid yours plenty. In my line of work, the dues involve post graduate schooling, huge debt, law school, passing an exam designed to keep you out, and about seven years of private law practice before you really get your sea legs. Medical practitioners have it even worse. CPAs have to suffer from stage 2 hypertension arising out of job stress before they can be considered competent. Look at the trades - years and years of study and work before a person attains a Master Electrician or Master Plumber's status. And so on. All of these are different ways of paying dues.

I'm an officer of a local tax exempt private nonprofit school - the Monteverdi Music School in Montpelier Vt. It's an eclectic kind of place; lots of community outreach and so forth. It's a black hole for time; it'll take all you have and then some. But I am hooked; I love the place. People think of us as small, but we presently have over 300 students registered and nearly 30 faculty. There are Masters and Doctorate level teachers; there are two Masters level special educators who specialize in early childhood education using music as a learning tool - for music's own sake, but also to learn math skills, logic, critical thinking and so forth.

We have teaching musicians and operatic singers who have sung at Carnegie Hall. My daughter studies voice with a coach who, as a baritone, sang duets with Frederica von Stade throughout Europe. These people are professional musicans.

Dragonworks has played in blues, rock and god knows what other bands for over 40 years. He knows his stuff and he knows how to work with others so they learn their stuff. He's a pro - just as much so as the guys I work with at the school.

I've got a friend whose name is Dan Haley - He's in the band I fool around with, as well as in half a dozen other bands. He teaches guitar and is in demand as a session musician. He is involved somewhere on most of the local albums that get released. He lives on nothing except his earnings from music and he hustles like hell to do it. He also has the ability to draw out the best in other musicians. The guy is a consummate professional.

In contrast, I look around at the talent I am privileged to work with and have to keep picking my jaw up off the floor. I'm having a ball doing this stuff and sometimes even get paid for it. I paid my dues in a whole different area of life and my profession is law, not music. But it's the music that tends to keep me sane and off the cardiac monitors. Maybe the definition is one of those things where what you get out of it depends on what you bring to it. :cool:
 
you have opened my eyes

cephus said:
It would be prety easy to refute me on this, but to me, a "professional" musician is one who shows up on time, doesn't play too loud and can and will play music he may or may not like for a buck. Just getting money to do your thing is how the Olympics work, not necessarily music.

Lots of guys make money playing, but they may be mini rock stars that enough people dig to keep him in taco bell and leather pants. Not that there's anything wrong with that. I wish people did like me and my music warts and all.

I figure they probably don't, so I show up on time, don't play too loud and will bust out with free bird if someone yells it out at the right time. That's what I always thought being a professional was.

Now, if someone says "SRV was a professional and he played the music he liked!" I'd have to say that there is no doubt in my mind that he did crap gigs where he had to play "Brown Sugar" or some other crap bar song he wasn't interested in. I might also say that he was an artist and it would be an insult to call an artist a "professional guitarist".
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Well, this post has affected me in a profound way. It may even change the course of my entire life :eek:

I used to think that a musical artist should be uncompromising when it comes to playing, and only doing what they liked. But it's so much more important than that! Yeah, thanks for opening my eyes :D
 
To me, a "professional" means "one who earns a living in a given or implied occupation"

A "pro" means "a skilled practitioner; an expert"

So you can be a professional without being a pro, and vice versa.

So Britney is a professional musician (among other things) without being a pro, and 90% of bluegrass musicians are pros without being professionals.
 
Why is the label you put on someone important? Will someone explain what possible difference it could make if some guy decides, for his own reasons,to call me a professional (or not to)? Why would I give a shit? I just do what I do, be who I be.

The less I worry about people's assessment of me, the happier I am in general. :)
 
I'd like to say that it simply means that you get paid, but you know, I guess it could be more complicated than that nowadays. I would just like to hijack this thread to say:


I have adjusted the truss rod on my guitar for the first time ever, and the strings no longer buzz, and the notes on the 12th fret are much closer to the harmonics on the same fret. I'm so proud of myself (and angry that I didnt fix the damn thing when I got it over a year ago!)
 
Grey Angel said:
I'd like to say that it simply means that you get paid, but you know, I guess it could be more complicated than that nowadays. I would just like to hijack this thread to say:


I have adjusted the truss rod on my guitar for the first time ever, and the strings no longer buzz, and the notes on the 12th fret are much closer to the harmonics on the same fret. I'm so proud of myself (and angry that I didnt fix the damn thing when I got it over a year ago!)
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I am so damn proud of you as well Grey Angel, that can be a touchy process to get right. Well Done! :)
 
Pro Musician

I know that in Sailing that a pro is someone that derives a vast majority of theri income from the sailing industry.

If you work in a boat yard, you are a pro...

If you work for a sail maker, you are a pro...
 
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