Accoustic Recording - Direct line vs. mic Opinions.

If I want the acoustic guitar sound, then I use a mic. I was very disappointed when I first got an electro-acoustic. I naively thought, 20 years ago, that you'd get the acoustic sound by going in direct. Ha !
You don't. Well, I didn't !
I personally hate the sound of my acoustic directly plugged in. I have a 12 string that can be tweaked slightly to give a better sound directly plugged in, but I still prefer the mic'd sound. Direct sounds thin, sharp and sour to me. Until recently I used a dynamic in front of the soundhole coz I like the bottom end of an acoustic. But I've been recently using a small diaphagm condenser mic'd in two spots. It's Ok. I also, as a variation, like using my son's cheapo 3/4 size acoustic with a bottle top pick up. Doubled with the 12 string it gives a very interesting sound.
 
sendittokeith said:
For recording accoustic guitar which do you prefer and why?
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I just did a tracking session that included recording some acoustic guitar. I captured both the pickup and a mic so I could decide song by song which approach was preferable. Mostly the mic was my preference but in at least one case I added some pickup to solidify the tone.
 
thanks... thats a good idea. I guess because i just spent money to get electronics put in my rig that i was hoping it would be better for recording - oh and also my pedal has only one mic input and 1 guitar input ;-) -- i can try some other stuff out.
 
Recording a live accoustic you usually don't have a choice. There are things a pickup can do that a mic just can't as far as freedom for the performer on stage. So many times it just has to be a pickup.


In the studio... I know I always say "never say never or always" (sheesh, this sentence is already in trouble), but I never use a pickup in the studio. It is just a nasty sound.
 
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By and large, almost nobody with any experience will tell you to record any acoustic instrument direct, although many will suggest taking a direct line in addition to a mic or mics, and sometimes blending in a little of the pickup. This is particularly common with those who use a magnetic pickup-Leo Kottke, for instance. Why? because first, they don't want to hear a piezo quack like a duck. Secondly, just like electric guitars, we are used to the sound of moving air hitting a mic, which is not duplicated by a pickup.

That said, I got kind of lucky one time. I was recording a guide track for overdub staff, and I was having a devil of a time singing and playing the song separately. Being on a tight schedule, I figured I'd record direct while singing, and then overdub the vocal, and use the guitar as a scratch track, and mic it up pretty later. I was playing a Taylor 710CE with a Fishman Prefix Plus stereo blender. So there is a mic, but it's part of the pickup system, inside the upper bout. The blender allows you to send 2 separate signals to the preamp, and record the mic and the piezo on separate tracks. I ran the stereo output into the 2 sides of a Joemeek twinQ, and used pretty much every bass cut/high pass filter available to me. (That axe is pretty boomy- it thinks it's a Martin.)

When the mixing engineer listened to the track, he said, "Why do it again? There's nothing wrong with it. I'll have to write Fishman a letter and congratulate them." Ha! He should've written *me* a letter. So it wound up on my CD as a direct track. Who would've thunk? Anyway, you'll find a clip on my website. Look for "Goody's Song". I think it's track #5. Just solo fingerstyle acoustic and 2 voices, me and Maureen Fleming from San Diego and some mixed down drums. Yeah, it's an MP3, but what the hell? It's my best attempt at DI Acoustic:


http://bardwire.com/reunion.htm
 
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As in Richards case, I think if your guitar has a blend of an internal mic as part of the pickup system then the odds of getting a more "usable" sound via direct increase dramatically. That said i typically go the two mic approach, one condenser getting the sound off of the body near the sound hole and one condenser capturing sounds from the neck, and if i can i'll probably run a line direct as well, in case i want to blend it somehow (usually i don't though).

If you're limited on mics, inputs, or anything else don't be afraid to try several different approaches, a lot of cool / interesting recordings have come through people being creative with what they had.
 
Richard Monroe said:
By and large, almost nobody with any experience will tell you to record any acoustic instrument direct, although many will suggest taking a direct line in addition to a mic or mics, and sometimes blending in a little of the pickup. This is particularly common with those who use a magnetic pickup-Leo Kottke, for instance. Why? because first, they don't want to hear a piezo quack like a duck. Secondly, just like electric guitars, we are used to the sound of moving air hitting a mic, which is not duplicated by a pickup.

That said, I got kind of lucky one time. I was recording a guide track for overdub staff, and I was having a devil of a time singing and playing the song separately. Being on a tight schedule, I figured I'd record direct while singing, and then overdub the vocal, and use the guitar as a scratch track, and mic it up pretty later. I was playing a Taylor 710CE with a Fishman Prefix Plus stereo blender. So there is a mic, but it's part of the pickup system, inside the upper bout. The blender allows you to send 2 separate signals to the preamp, and record the mic and the piezo on separate tracks. I ran the stereo output into the 2 sides of a Joemeek twinQ, and used pretty much every bass cut/high pass filter available to me. (That axe is pretty boomy- it thinks it's a Martin.)

When the mixing engineer listened to the track, he said, "Why do it again? There's nothing wrong with it. I'll have to write Fishman a letter and congratulate them." Ha! He should've written *me* a letter. So it wound up on my CD as a direct track. Who would've thunk? Anyway, you'll find a clip on my website. Look for "Goody's Song". I think it's track #5. Just solo fingerstyle acoustic and 2 voices, me and Maureen Fleming from San Diego. Yeah, it's an MP3, but what the hell? It's my best attempt at DI Acoustic:


http://bardwire.com/reunion.htm
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ha - very nice. Thank you for sharing that. What equipment are you using to record with?
 
What I used then and what I use now are 2 different animals. The S/PDIF out on the Joemeek twinQ went straight to the S/PDIF in on a Roland VS1824CD. My vocal was done with a B.L.U.E. Kiwi into an Avalon AD2022 into a TC Electronics M300 set for bypass. The M300 was used only as an AD convertor, then S/PDIF out to the Roland. The whole point was to bypass the pres and AD conversion of the Roland. Maureen's vocal was the same deal, except the mic is an AKG C2000B. The drums were done with the Joemeek by S/PDIF (overheads-Oktava MC012), kick with AKG D112 and snare with Shure SM7b, both into the Avalon. Both snare and kick went into the Roland's pres. I have long since improved my AD conversion and gone to a computer based setup. The bit depth and resolution was 16bit/44.1kHz.-Richie
 
Like others have said, its still a paint and canvas situation. The direct method tends to be mostly attack. So, if your mic is providing the best overall sound of the guitar, a little blend of the direct could bring out the pick attack of the strings. But the type of music or sound your after will determine if you want that or not.
 
Try a Dean Markley ProMag pickup...you might reconsider. :)

http://www.deanmarkley.com/Pickups/ProMag.shtml

A mic is nice if you have a nice room to go with it.
Also, with some mics and some acoustics...you have to really work hard to find the sweet spot, and then when you play, you have to hold that position....which can be uncomfortable.
With an electric guitar...the sound source isn't acoustic...it's a speaker and it doesn't move around as you play. ;)

But I know...the purists will feel the need to use the mic on an acoustic...which I love to do...when it's the right mic and the right guitar and the right room.
And, it depends on your final mix.
Is it just acoustic guitar and vocals, and you want that big-room, spacious sound...then maybe the mic approach is best...or is it just another track in a denser mix?

AFA built in acoustic electronics...most seem to suck...they give the guitar a metallic sound. The ProMag doesn't do that that...I was very surprised and pleased...so I went and bought another ProMag, as they have 3 different types.
 
So I hear a lot of this "record the acoustic guitar pickup as well and maybe you can add some in later" if you're not happy with the microphone sound yo've achieved...

I also hear a lot of "acoustic guitar pickup sounds are crap" - especially piezos, which probably most of us have. This is true. They do sound crap lined into a recording.

So by some magical alchemy, adding a crap pickup sound to a miked sound you're not happy with enough to consider doing this at all will get you a better result? Hmmm maybe, maybe not...

I struggled with this for ages - getting a good acoustic sound in your average HR set up ain't the easiest thing in the world, and you're always trying to make it better, or recreate that magic moment/method that you forgot to document...

Try this, if you're in an experimental mood...

Plug your acoustic guitar into a good quality (I use a Laney 30W valve) electric guitar amp that makes good clean sounds and isn't noisy. In another room, obviously and at a low volume. Cut the bass and get a sound sort of like a clean jangly electric happening as best you can. Not too much mid..

Using an LDC mike this back to your recorder as you play, at the same time as you're getting the best acoustic recording you can with your microphone(s).

Now, try adding a just a bit of the amplified guitar back into your miked channels and see if that doesn't do a hell of a lot more to making your miked acoustic sounds a bit "fuller".

If you're using acoustic guitar in an otherwise busy rock mix, then this probably won't do much good, but if it's a feature instrument in an acoustic type song, you may find this useful.

I do it all the time. Fills a sonic hole in the sound and I can now dial up a pretty decent "acoustic" sound at will.

You can thank me later... :laughings:
 
One of the advantages of the technique that Armistice suggests, is that like mic'ing an electric guitar amp- it moves air, which smacks into a mic. I did find that tracking the song I referenced above, I used a lot more of the mic than the piezo in my rough mix, and the mixing engineer did also. The biggest disadvantage of the onboard mic in the Fishman was that if it wasn't bass cut, it produced really annoying boom. By adding in a touch of piezo, I got some bass without the boom that the onboard mic produced. Every other acoustic track on the CD was done with a single C414 or Shure SM82 on the 12th fret, into the Avalon, which worked just fine.-Richie
 
One mic option not mentioned is instead of close micing try a mic in omni about 2 or 3 feet out from the source..........I think you'll like it.....it's a very natural sound of the instrument that your capturing.
 
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