You're probably sick of monitoring threads, but here we go again

Which monitor (european prices)?

  • Be cheap and go with the Esi Near05 (324$)

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • Chose the reveals because of how they translate. Disregard that you don't like the sound. (576$)

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • Listen to your stephdad and buy the Behringers! (708$)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • The BX8 doesn’t sound like hifi-speakers to me. Now go and buy them!

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • Everybody likes the yorkvilles. Buy them even though they’re more expensive in sweden! (960$)

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • Go with the mackies. They’re superior to all the cheaper monitors and just 200 bucks more expensive

    Votes: 4 26.7%
  • If you’re going to buy monitors, buy the real thing, Dynaudio BM6a even though you can't really affo

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • Buy a better hifi-speaker instead!

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Buy ………. (specify model and preferably price in europe) monitor

    Votes: 1 6.7%

  • Total voters
    15
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Swede

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I’m getting tired of mixing on my terrible home stereo and would like to buy some studio-monitors. Since I don’t have a decent homestereo I would like them to sound good (on professional recordings, but hopefully reveal everything thats wrong with my mixes). My room is a resonably small one and I will be moving to a small dorm-room in a couple of months.

It’s really hard for me to get to listen to the monitors since the nearest music-shop is 100km away and they only have m-audio, tannoys, events, and alesis monitors. I went down to our capital city, Stockholm, and it wasn’t much better there. Some monitors I’ve ruled out because of either the price or how they sounded. My remaining choices are these.

Esi Near05: 324$
Tannoy Reveal: 576$
Behringer Truth: 708$
Yorkville YSM-1p: 960$
Mackie 624: 1092$
Dynaudio BM6a: 1614$
Studiophile BX8: 720$

Prices are the cheapest i’ve found on internet sites in europe. They’re a bit different than the prices in the US. KRKs and Events are really expensive, but the Tannoys and Dynaudios are cheaper I think.

Here are my comments on the monitors I’m choosing between. I’m also specifying what I’ve compared them to. You have to have in mind that I'm an absolute newbie to studio monitors and have very limited experience with recording and mixing.


Esi Near05 (formerly known as Studiophile SP-5b): 324$
A/B comparison: Tannoy Reveal
Comments: These are way more accurate than the cheapass bookshelves I am monitoring on right now, but the bottom end is lacking. I think they sounded fine for the money, but kind of two-dimensional, no depth and I doubt I would be satisfied with these for a long period of time.



Tannoy Reveal : 576$
A/B comparison: Esi Near05, Event 20/20 BAS, Studiophile BX8, Alesis monitor ones

I think these were more ”revealing” than the Near05:s (SP-5b), they had more detail, I belive I could find more "problem areas" of the songs i heard, but it somehow at the same time sounded like someone had put a towel or something over them. I didn’t like the sound of these, but then it may have been the others I compared them to that sounded like hifi-speakers.



Behringer Truth: 708$

A/B comparison: none

My stephdad, who I off the record think is a real idiot, owns a pair of these and tells me that these are, absolutely, the monitor to get. He says that these are so good that you have to buy something like genelec 1031 to get better monitors. He also says that preamps don’t matter, and that it’s possible to get professional sounds through his Behringer MX9000 console. He's been working as a local sound engineer for like 10 years, but to be honest, his stuff sound like a pile of shit, so I doubt I could trust his opinion. I tried to audition the truths his studio, but as soon as I put my CD in, he was there with his fingers on that dreadful MX9000 eq, turned the highs up by a mile, and it sure didn’t sound good. I also think they would be a bit big for my room, but they're on my list anyway.

Mackie 624: 1092$
A/B comparion: none, but the 824 sounded superior to Event 20/20 bas, spirit absolute zero, studiophile sp-8b, tannoy reveal, samson resolv.

I’ve only listened to these ones, for a very short time in a very bad room. I think the room and the monitor-placement made it impossible for me to judge them correctly. I have listened a good deal to the Mackie 824 though, and those were by far the most impressive monitor I’ve ever heard. The detail was amazing and imaging was amazing. (I've never heard Dynaudios, Genelecs or ADAMS). If the 624 has the sound of it’s bigger brother and a resonable bottom I really want this speaker!


Yorkville YSM-1: 960$

I haven’t heard these, but everyone seems to recommend them around here. The price here in Sweden isn’t as nice as in the US though.

Dynaudio Bm6a 1614$

I understand these are really good monitors. From what I’ve heard they´re supposed to be better than the Mackie824 and Genelec 1030 that both are much more expensive than the dynaudio over here. The Dynaudios are a bit smaller than the Mackie824s I think, but are they still to big for a small room? This one is by far the most expensive of the monitors I am considering, but my ears could probably never outgrow them and they would be an investment that would last for years. Unfortunately I probably wouldn’t afford to buy anything else if I went this route.

Studiophile BX8 720$
A/B comparison: Event 20/20 BAS, tannoy reveal, alesis monitor one.

I’m not shure about these. I liked the sound of these better than the tannoy reveals and monitor ones but liked the 20/20 BAS better, but they are twice the price here 1400$. I’m afraid I think the m-audios sounded like they had a little smiley face response-curve and I don't know how accurate they are. They're probably better than the Esi nEars (studiophile Sp-5b) though. This one may be to big for my room, don’t you think?



Conclusions:

I know monitoring is important and would preferably like to get a pair of monitors that would last me a while. As I said, I really liked mackie 824, but they are too expensive (1700$) and probably to big for my room anyway. I imagine that the 624:s would be perfect my room and more easy on the wallet than the 824, even though spending a thousand dollars on a studiomonitor I haven’t heard much of would feel a bit strange .

I wasn’t really impressed with the reveals, studiophiles, truths (from what I could tell) or the Esi nEars, but then I’m just a newbie and probably don’t know what to look for in a monitor. I’m thinking that if I would go the cheap route it may be best to just buy the Esi nEars and spend money elseware, and probably upgrade later. The Dynaudios would probably be exellent but they’re very, very expensive.

Even though my mic cost me 30$, my monitoring chain is the weakest link in my setup that consists of:

Delta 1010lt
Cakewalk Sonar
Roland RS-5
Behringer XM8500 mic
Audio Technica atm40fs
Cheap ass home stereo for monitoring

I'm mostly recording my keyboard, trumpet or singing.

What do you think I should do? Should I take out the plunge and buy the mackies or go the cheap route with the Esi nEars (studiophile sp-5b)? Would you have done something else? Please think about the european prices when you answer.
 
Swede said:
I’m getting tired of mixing on my terrible home stereo and would like to buy some studio-monitors. Since I don’t have a decent homestereo I would like them to sound good (on professional recordings, but hopefully reveal everything thats wrong with my mixes). My room is a resonably small one and I will be moving to a small dorm-room in a couple of months.

It’s really hard for me to get to listen to the monitors since the nearest music-shop is 100km away and they only have m-audio, tannoys, events, and alesis monitors. I went down to our capital city, Stockholm, and it wasn’t much better there. Some monitors I’ve ruled out because of either the price or how they sounded. My remaining choices are these.

Esi Near05: 324$
Tannoy Reveal: 576$
Behringer Truth: 708$
Yorkville YSM-1p: 960$
Mackie 624: 1092$
Dynaudio BM6a: 1614$
Studiophile BX8: 720$

Prices are the cheapest i’ve found on internet sites in europe. They’re a bit different than the prices in the US. KRKs and Events are really expensive, but the Tannoys and Dynaudios are cheaper I think.

Here are my comments on the monitors I’m choosing between. I’m also specifying what I’ve compared them to. You have to have in mind that I'm an absolute newbie to studio monitors and have very limited experience with recording and mixing.


Esi Near05 (formerly known as Studiophile SP-5b): 324$
A/B comparison: Tannoy Reveal
Comments: These are way more accurate than the cheapass bookshelves I am monitoring on right now, but the bottom end is lacking. I think they sounded fine for the money, but kind of two-dimensional, no depth and I doubt I would be satisfied with these for a long period of time.



Tannoy Reveal : 576$
A/B comparison: Esi Near05, Event 20/20 BAS, Studiophile BX8, Alesis monitor ones

I think these were more ”revealing” than the Near05:s (SP-5b), they had more detail, I belive I could find more "problem areas" of the songs i heard, but it somehow at the same time sounded like someone had put a towel or something over them. I didn’t like the sound of these, but then it may have been the others I compared them to that sounded like hifi-speakers.



Behringer Truth: 708$

A/B comparison: none

My stephdad, who I off the record think is a real idiot, owns a pair of these and tells me that these are, absolutely, the monitor to get. He says that these are so good that you have to buy something like genelec 1031 to get better monitors. He also says that preamps don’t matter, and that it’s possible to get professional sounds through his Behringer MX9000 console. He's been working as a local sound engineer for like 10 years, but to be honest, his stuff sound like a pile of shit, so I doubt I could trust his opinion. I tried to audition the truths his studio, but as soon as I put my CD in, he was there with his fingers on that dreadful MX9000 eq, turned the highs up by a mile, and it sure didn’t sound good. I also think they would be a bit big for my room, but they're on my list anyway.

Mackie 624: 1092$
A/B comparion: none, but the 824 sounded superior to Event 20/20 bas, spirit absolute zero, studiophile sp-8b, tannoy reveal, samson resolv.

I’ve only listened to these ones, for a very short time in a very bad room. I think the room and the monitor-placement made it impossible for me to judge them correctly. I have listened a good deal to the Mackie 824 though, and those were by far the most impressive monitor I’ve ever heard. The detail was amazing and imaging was amazing. (I've never heard Dynaudios, Genelecs or ADAMS). If the 624 has the sound of it’s bigger brother and a resonable bottom I really want this speaker!


Yorkville YSM-1: 960$

I haven’t heard these, but everyone seems to recommend them around here. The price here in Sweden isn’t as nice as in the US though.

Dynaudio Bm6a 1614$

I understand these are really good monitors. From what I’ve heard they´re supposed to be better than the Mackie824 and Genelec 1030 that both are much more expensive than the dynaudio over here. The Dynaudios are a bit smaller than the Mackie824s I think, but are they still to big for a small room? This one is by far the most expensive of the monitors I am considering, but my ears could probably never outgrow them and they would be an investment that would last for years. Unfortunately I probably wouldn’t afford to buy anything else if I went this route.

Studiophile BX8 720$
A/B comparison: Event 20/20 BAS, tannoy reveal, alesis monitor one.

I’m not shure about these. I liked the sound of these better than the tannoy reveals and monitor ones but liked the 20/20 BAS better, but they are twice the price here 1400$. I’m afraid I think the m-audios sounded like they had a little smiley face response-curve and I don't know how accurate they are. They're probably better than the Esi nEars (studiophile Sp-5b) though. This one may be to big for my room, don’t you think?



Conclusions:

I know monitoring is important and would preferably like to get a pair of monitors that would last me a while. As I said, I really liked mackie 824, but they are too expensive (1700$) and probably to big for my room anyway. I imagine that the 624:s would be perfect my room and more easy on the wallet than the 824, even though spending a thousand dollars on a studiomonitor I haven’t heard much of would feel a bit strange .

I wasn’t really impressed with the reveals, studiophiles, truths (from what I could tell) or the Esi nEars, but then I’m just a newbie and probably don’t know what to look for in a monitor. I’m thinking that if I would go the cheap route it may be best to just buy the Esi nEars and spend money elseware, and probably upgrade later. The Dynaudios would probably be exellent but they’re very, very expensive.

Even though my mic cost me 30$, my monitoring chain is the weakest link in my setup that consists of:

Delta 1010lt
Cakewalk Sonar
Roland RS-5
Behringer XM8500 mic
Audio Technica atm40fs
Cheap ass home stereo for monitoring

I'm mostly recording my keyboard, trumpet or singing.

What do you think I should do? Should I take out the plunge and buy the mackies or go the cheap route with the Esi nEars (studiophile sp-5b)? Would you have done something else? Please think about the european prices when you answer.

Yes.
 
Is that you Carl Anton?
a 30 dollar mic through good monitors is going to sound like more ass.

Remember monitors aren't supposed to sound "good", they're supposed to sound accurate. If it's a shitty mix it should sound like shit.

Was there something in particular that you didn't like about the monitors you heard?
 
I voted Dynaudio. I found their sound to be in between the Genelec 1030 and 1031, as is their price.
I A/B-ed Genelec 1030, 1031, Dynaudio BM-6, Tannoy Reveal and Eclipse, Behringer Thruth, Yamaha MSP5 and 10 and KrK V8 in the same room.

Best moni's to *MY TASTE* were Gennies 1031, followed by the Dynaudio's then the 1030 and the KrK (their sound is different, I'm a deep lows & high higs fan).

I went for the 1031's and the salesperson wanted to sell the Dynaudios to me, because they're supposed to be made in the same factory :confused: :confused:

whatever. Define a budget with a 10% margin and then buy the speakers you cannot afford. I know I did and I'm happy with it
:D :cool: :D :p

budget and taste matter most, not other people's opinions.


Herwig
 
Ambi: No I'm not Carl Anton.

Yes, I'm sure my 30$ mic is going to sound like ass in a good set of monitors! But right now the mic isn't the weakest link in the chain! And I'm not kidding! I'm most of the time just recording with my keyboard and for loud trumpet work the mic is, well obviously not very good, but ok. The difference in quality between this mic and an SM58 isn't very large.

My recordings sound like shit in my speakers, but so does proffessional ones. Right now it's like trying to mix with cotton in my ears! I want my mixes to sound like ass in my speakers so that I can correct them, but I want to be able to hear WHAT sounds like ass and not that everything I play on them, including professional recordings, sound like ass.

Well, what I didn't like about the monitors I heard: (note that my impressions may not be the same as yours, since I'm new to this.)


Esi nEar05: Very weak low end response. Two dimensional sound.

Tannoy Reveal:

More detailed than the Esi nEars, I could hear the reverb tales etc clearer. Maybe these are good mixing tools but they sure didn't sound as "good" as the Event 20/20 BAS or studiophile BX8 (and maybe that's a good sign, since both the events and especially the studiophiles to me sounded like they had a "smiley face" eq on them). (any comments to this, Gidge?)

Behringer Truth:
Solid low end, but high end was very harsh. The listening session was not ideal.

Studiophile BX8: Sounded better than all of the above. Great bass and clear highs, but I think theres something missing in the mids. Sounded to much like ordinary hifi-speakers to me, but what do I know?

As I said I liked the mackie hr824. I haven't had a chance to listen to the yorkvilles, mackie hr624 (except for just a few minutes in a bad room) and dynaudios.

Maybe the reveals would be the best low budget monitor after all, but I might just buy me a new hifi-system for listening pleasure before buying studio-monitors. I just can't stand my home stereo!
 
I got Tannoy Reveal Actives, and they are the bees knees as far as I'm concerned. Defenitely no wet towel sound at all.

I got them precisely because of their price in Sweden. In the US they are usually in tests and the like being put in the same league as Event 20/20bas, but in Sweden they are half the price. They are almost always said to be better than the Behringers, but in Sweden they are almost the same price.

They are a bit weak on the low bass, which is expected for small nearfields like this, but other than that they are just great. One of the best investments I've made.
 
It sounds like your evaluation of those monitors if fairly consistant with the reviews of many of the people on this board and in other places. You probably have a better ear than you think. I'd say from reputation the reveals are the best. ESPECIALLY at that price. They're normally more than the yorkvilles.

Bass response on those 6-6.5 inch woofers is never going to be GREAT, but we can't all afford mackie hr824's.
 
Ambi: I read in another thread that you thought about powering a set of yorkvilles with a rotel amp. Did you end up with that combination? If so, how's it working for you? Is the rotel amp transparent enough?

I'm thinking about maybe doing something similiar myself. A rotel ra-01 amp (550$) to drive my future hifi-speakers and something like a passive set of tannoy reveals (275$). It sure would save me some money if I could use the same amp for a passive set of monitors and my hifi system.
 
I haven't used that set, infact i have no monitors yet due to a lack of money. But it would work fairly well. My only concern was that th rotel might slightly underpower the monitors. So you couldn't drive them really hard, but that would be ok for monitoring.

But hey it might work really well.

Alfalfa would be the best guy to talk to about it.
 
I don't think power would be a problem with the rotel. I think someone has mentioned it before but rotel always seem to underrate their amplifiers. They also deliver, from what I've heard, more wattage with a lower impendance and the Yorkvilles and Reveals are both 6ohm speakers.

I don't know the above for a fact, It's just what I've read. Maybe I should send a message to alfalfa.
 
I just got my adam s11p and think they are much better than the mackies you realy can hear every thing thats going on the mix.
Even songs that sound good on other monitors reveal them selvs
on the adam's,

Mackies are ok they give a good representation of the mix but you cant realy look into the mix the adams have a surtan transparency to them whitout being to upfront.

ther is one thing that i dont like and that is that you have to be a 1m away from these monitors to mix the basse when your mixing
dance music or hip hop

this is just my opinion, if your able to audition them go and try

I wasnt able to test them but what i heard from other people these wher the right monitors for me so i took the risk and i like them you can return them if you dont like them.

if you live in sweden you can also easely buy from german shops
most of them carry the adams for 633 euro,s a piece

good luck finding the right monitors i know how hard it is.

Yannick
 
std1: glad you like the adams but they are WAAY to expensive for a poor student like me. Now when I think about it the smaller mackies are also to much, but thanks for the tip anyway.
 
yea swede i'm a poor student as well. I have to choose between gear or tuition right now. Guess which one wins..

Yea the rotel is nice. Yea i didn't factor in the 8ohs - 6 ohms thing, and yea alfalfa was saying in the other thread about how they are usually more powerful than what they are rated at.
i believe the rotal ra-02 is rated at 40 watts per side at 8ohms.
 
The measured performance of the Rotel RA-02 is 81w into 4 ohms and 59w into 8 ohms (1khz @ 0.5% THD).
The specified performance of the RA-02 is 40w into 8ohms (1khz @ <0.03% THD).
Notice the conservative specification through the use of a much lower THD limit.

For comparison a 'pro audio' Hafler TA1600 has specifications of 75w into 4 ohms and 60w into 4ohm (1khz @ 0.1% THD).

http://www.milleraudioresearch.com/download/Rotel_RA02.zip

If you are really worried about amplifier clipping damaging your speakers when you play really loud then you may want to go with a more powerful amp than either of the above or something like the NAD amps that have a 'soft clipping' feature. How much power you need depends on the speakers you use, how big your rooms is and your distance from the speakers, and how loud you want to go.

I would definitely recommend going with the separate amp and passive speaker combination. It is more flexible, allowing you to upgrade in steps and use multiple speakers with the one amp. You also get volume control with an integrated amp and usually a headphone output. Besides Rotel checkout NAD, Marantz, Arcam etc for budget hifi amps. Avoid home theater receivers.

The tannoy reveals are decent and so are the dynaudio passives. B&W DM303 and 600 series are also accurate speakers worth an audition in that price range. Sound on sound magazine has tested B&W speakers in a number of articles and found them to work well. Do a search there for more info. www.sospubs.co.uk

Note: I believe the rotel RA01 is identical to the RA02 except for the lack of remote control and costs a lot less. That could save you some cash if you dont need the remote.
 
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The main differences are the NAD C350 has:
- remote control
- soft clipping feature (to protect your speakers though sound quality will suffer slightly when it is on).
- higher power specification

The Rotel RA-01 has:
- separate tape loop and monitoring selection (can be useful)
- an A/B speaker switch (so you can connect 2 sets of speakers to it at the same time)
- the ability to mute the speakers without having to plug the headphones in
- the ability to listen to both headphones and speakers at the same time
- phono preamp/input (so you can plug a turntable in).

I suspect the C350 is more powerful than the RA-01. NAD uses a different amplifier design (ISC) to the Rotel so its hard to compare the power measurements and ratings. My guess is the C320 is more similar to the RA-01 in terms of power and the C350 is more comparable to the RA-1060. However the only sure way to tell is to connect both amps up to the speaker you are going to be using them with and compare them. You should be able to find a hifi store that stocks both. Go have a listen and talk with the salesman (though they are not always reliable sources of info).

From my brief audition of NAD and rotel budget amps (cant remember the models), I recall that they did sound different. Reviews typically find Rotel amps to be more transparent and revealing but 'harsher' sounding while the NAD amps are little 'warmer'. I preferred the Rotels for sound quality though if power is important for you, the NADs seemed like better value. These are only opinions and generalisations though - you really need to listen to both to decide for yourself.

If you are interested in what is inside the Rotel, take a look at this article on the RA-931mkII which the RA-01 is basically an update of (I believe that the amplification design is very similar). Rotel tends to use more high quality parts than some other budget amplifer manufacturers.
http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/rotelra931_e.html
 
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