smythology
New member
.........
whats the diff between tube and solid state?
- Thread starter smythology
- Start date
smythology
New member
hey, thats why its in the newbie section...gimmeabreak
another one...so is it the tubes that give an amp its distinct sound?
another one...so is it the tubes that give an amp its distinct sound?
Henri Devill
New member
Its everything..The design..the tubes.. the transformers ect ect....
Maybe someone come along and give you a "tech" explanation..
Don
Maybe someone come along and give you a "tech" explanation..
Don
sonusman
Banned
smythology said:
Indeed. But solid state "amps" have their own "distinct sound" too.
Like Henry explained, it is the whole circuit that contributes to the overall sound. All the components, whether tube or solid state, can make a difference in the sound.
There are even hybrid circuits out there that use BOTH!
What kind of "amp" are you talking about? And, what exactly are you trying to get at. Asking "What is the difference between tubes and solid state" is extremely vague.
Ed
Henri Devill
New member
Re: every thing you need to know about amps
Your kidding...right !I know that your jokeing..
Don
sheppard said:
Your kidding...right !I know that your jokeing..
Don
Basically as the name is implied, A Solid state device is comprised of varying degrees of mineral substances in a pre-defined Solid form which conducts electricity in a very precise manner. The Transistor being the most famous along with IC chips. They dont call it Silicon Valley for nothing.
A tube basically emits electrons to plates within the tube, whether it uses a gas or in a Vacuum . Which means it isnt a solid state device because the electrons flow through a Vacuum or gas. To my limited electronic knowledge and projects, a Tube is used for higher voltages..
A tube basically emits electrons to plates within the tube, whether it uses a gas or in a Vacuum . Which means it isnt a solid state device because the electrons flow through a Vacuum or gas. To my limited electronic knowledge and projects, a Tube is used for higher voltages..
I know Bluegrass pickers who think the same about Electric Guitars!
pipelineaudio
Well-known member
I always get funny looks around here because I tend to conventrate on a device's behaviour many times, as usually the others hae covered the freq response and such, or sometimes behaviour is a different angle that bears looking at. Both tuebs and transistors are capable of perfectly good tones, depending on the application. Almost all of the legendary mic pre's and compressors are transistor, with the LA-2A being a common tube exception. While almost any decent distorted guitar tone starts with a tube preamp.
"solid state =shit tone
tube =killer tone
sheppard "
pretty general, and generally crap
An important bit to look at is how these devices ACT. To simplify, to WAY oversimplify, and this is not exactly 100 % accurate always but a decent way to look at for a start:
tubes are controlled by voltage. Your guitar sends out varying amounts of voltage depending on how hard you whack your strings. This is why even with quite a bit of distortion, hitting your strings harder on a tube preamp, will make a louder sound, and even with insane amounts of distortion hitting harder will make a DIFFERENT sound than hitting soft. Transistor guitar PREamps tend not to do this. This is because transistors are controlled by current(usually)
Tubes are many times configured to act in a NON linear way. what goes in is intentionally not what comes out. As levels get higher going into a tube stage, it can easily exhibit its own form of compression, and many times this is what causes " warm " and " fat ". It can also be distorted intentionally. A widely held notion is that tubes will create even order harmonics, while transistors create odd order harmonics. When distorted, tubes many times make a somewhat rounded wave, transistors often make nasty ass square waves.
But its 6 of one half a dozen of another. One reason transistors make square waves is that they can switch or cycle way faster than tubes. This means that transistors on a given similar circuit design can pass more, or more accurate or higher hi frequencies than a tube can. Of course many will say tubes kill that " harshness", while others will say " tubes make it muddy"
its a matter of degrees and taste.
If a device is meant to be accurate and respond in a LINEAR way, often transistors are better. Say you have an instrument that you LOVE the way it sounds as is, and also you want the highest dynamic range possible, no interest in compression or gain control besides what your fingers do. Good candidate for a transistor. Or you want to capture hi's into the dog ear world, another good candidate for transistors.
TRUE, well designed tube circuits can ADD to what you are doing, controlling gain a little and fattening up with nice smooth distortion, and rich harmonics
the trouble today is so many manufacturers caught on to the tube trend and just stick glowing bottles onto gear that they made long ago, using a full on solid state circuit path. In these devices a tube is usually nothing more than a heat an light source and may actually harm the circuit and the sound much more than if it had been ommitted
just cuz something has a "toob " in it dont mean its gonna sound good!
"solid state =shit tone
tube =killer tone
sheppard "
pretty general, and generally crap
An important bit to look at is how these devices ACT. To simplify, to WAY oversimplify, and this is not exactly 100 % accurate always but a decent way to look at for a start:
tubes are controlled by voltage. Your guitar sends out varying amounts of voltage depending on how hard you whack your strings. This is why even with quite a bit of distortion, hitting your strings harder on a tube preamp, will make a louder sound, and even with insane amounts of distortion hitting harder will make a DIFFERENT sound than hitting soft. Transistor guitar PREamps tend not to do this. This is because transistors are controlled by current(usually)
Tubes are many times configured to act in a NON linear way. what goes in is intentionally not what comes out. As levels get higher going into a tube stage, it can easily exhibit its own form of compression, and many times this is what causes " warm " and " fat ". It can also be distorted intentionally. A widely held notion is that tubes will create even order harmonics, while transistors create odd order harmonics. When distorted, tubes many times make a somewhat rounded wave, transistors often make nasty ass square waves.
But its 6 of one half a dozen of another. One reason transistors make square waves is that they can switch or cycle way faster than tubes. This means that transistors on a given similar circuit design can pass more, or more accurate or higher hi frequencies than a tube can. Of course many will say tubes kill that " harshness", while others will say " tubes make it muddy"
its a matter of degrees and taste.
If a device is meant to be accurate and respond in a LINEAR way, often transistors are better. Say you have an instrument that you LOVE the way it sounds as is, and also you want the highest dynamic range possible, no interest in compression or gain control besides what your fingers do. Good candidate for a transistor. Or you want to capture hi's into the dog ear world, another good candidate for transistors.
TRUE, well designed tube circuits can ADD to what you are doing, controlling gain a little and fattening up with nice smooth distortion, and rich harmonics
the trouble today is so many manufacturers caught on to the tube trend and just stick glowing bottles onto gear that they made long ago, using a full on solid state circuit path. In these devices a tube is usually nothing more than a heat an light source and may actually harm the circuit and the sound much more than if it had been ommitted
just cuz something has a "toob " in it dont mean its gonna sound good!
eyeslikefire
I CAN SMELL EM!
Toki987 said:I think I`ll get a fresh cigar and a beer for this one. It might prove very interesting in the long run...
Tok,.. I allready have a Macanudo in one hand and a Heineken
in the other.
Where shall we sit?
pipelineaudio
Well-known member
What exactly do you mean by " dynamic distortion" ?
In practice tubes are usually set up to change or distort of manipulate the dynamic range by having a nonlinear input output level response, or are you speaking of something else?
In practice tubes are usually set up to change or distort of manipulate the dynamic range by having a nonlinear input output level response, or are you speaking of something else?
Charva
Shower Time
Years ago and once upon a time, vacuum tubes were used in amplifiers. Then, someone invented transistors to replace tubes because they were smaller and required less power to operate.
Think of it this way....people used to ride horses until the automobile was invented. Most of the people now days prefer to drive cars because thet require less day to day maintenence (feeding the horse, cleaning up horse shit, vet bills....)
But horses are still fun to ride and can go places that cars can't.
Think of it this way....people used to ride horses until the automobile was invented. Most of the people now days prefer to drive cars because thet require less day to day maintenence (feeding the horse, cleaning up horse shit, vet bills....)
But horses are still fun to ride and can go places that cars can't.
subtractor
New member
Vaccum tubes are still used in amps...
in my 25 yrs+ as a guitar player i have never played thru a solid state amp that could cut the mustard.
the problem with them is that a few sound really good when yer wood sheding in the bedroom at home,but when you get on stage they dont cut thru the mix.this is especially so if you are playing with a second guitarist who is using a tube amp.
i am not an amp tech but i know what my ears tell me.solid state sounds muddy and undefined while tube sound well defined and lend solos an almost violin like quality.just my 2 cents.
later
sheppard
the problem with them is that a few sound really good when yer wood sheding in the bedroom at home,but when you get on stage they dont cut thru the mix.this is especially so if you are playing with a second guitarist who is using a tube amp.
i am not an amp tech but i know what my ears tell me.solid state sounds muddy and undefined while tube sound well defined and lend solos an almost violin like quality.just my 2 cents.
later
sheppard
pipelineaudio said:
Emphasis on usually, in a guitar amp application.
It all depends on the cicuit design, the trannies, the tubes themselves and the speaker setup.
Ever heard a good triode amp through a good horn setup? Nothing like it in solid-state that I've ever heard.
FET based pres and amps sound much better than op-amp based stuff to me as well. Figures since an FET is basically emulating the operation of a vacuum tube.