What to record 1st?

B

bennie08

Member
Hi everyone, I'm new to this site, but have known about it for a very long time. Glad to be apart of it finally! I was just wondering if it was necessary to record drum tracks 1st? I know most people record this way, but I'm not most people. I guess I view it differently because I'm the one who is recording guitar, bass, drums, and vocals... I try to get into every kind of music instrument I can. Anyhow, my guitar skills are better than my drumming skills and I don't think I could stay in time on the drums by recoding them first. So would it be better for me to lay down the guitar track first to a metronome then record drums? I know it's all personal preference, but I'd like to get others opinions. So if anyone has a different way please share. Also what are some good compressions for a whole drum kit? Thanks to those who share.

Ben
 
Sometimes I'll make a drum beat that's just one bar repeated and lay down the other tracks and then go back and fix the drums up.

Sometimes I'll lay down a guide track of just piano and then add the drums and bass to that, and eventually erase the guide track.

Other times I'll finish the drum track first and then do the bass and build it up from there.

As usual the only rule is "NO RULES!".
 
I'm primarily a guitarist too, and for a long time I'd always start with a drum loop and the guitars, before adding in other tracks.

However, recently I've started by starting with the bass guitars, and I think I'm getting better results. Here's why - historically, the bass has always been more of an afterthought for me, so once all the guitars are tracked, I'd go back and record a few takes and, just to get it over with, go with the first one that was pretty decent.

However, the problem with this is generally I usually evaluate the tracks in the context of the mix, and slight irregularities in a bass performance don't really leap out at you THAT much. As a consequence, my bass tracks (which, again, bass is not my primary instrument so I'm a much better guitarist anyway) would always be a little sloppier than my guitar tracks. This isn't necessarily a problem per se, as it'd always sound "ok" in the mix, but I also feel like the "groove" of a song is carried by the drums and bass, and a really tight, in-the-pocket bass line is just easier to mix and makes the whole piece cohere a bit better.

So, by starting with the bass track and then recording takes after take (and punching in if needed) until I had a really "in the groove" bass track, and then putting guitars on top of that (which as a guitarist I tend to care more about and be better at playing anyway, so sloppiness is way less of a problem) the resulting guitar/bass/drums rhythm performance is just better overall.

As an added bonus, once I have a pretty good picture of what the bass is going to "sound" like, it's easier to dial in a guitar sound to "fit" with the bass tracks.

Long story short, sometimes starting with a weaker instrument is actually a good thing, since it forces you to scrutinize it solo'd, which psychologically makes it harder to accept a sub-par performance.
 
Thanks for the suggestions guys. I like the idea of the guide track, I have yet to attempt it so I defiantly will. I think that will help me get where I need to be going with my recordings. As for starting with the bass first I should have thought about this myself as how you described it makes perfect sense. This will allow me to dial in a "fitting" guitar tone rather than a tone of guitar I prefer. I understand why this would help everything go together in the mix. Once again thanks a lot for the help fellaws. If I get anything completed I'll surely let you listen!

Ben
 
bennie08 said:
I'm the one who is recording guitar, bass, drums, and vocals...

....

So would it be better for me to lay down the guitar track first to a metronome then record drums?
Click to expand...


IMO, if you are recording all those tracks one at a time by yourself, the best way is to use a click track.

Then lay down some scratch/guide music tracks to that click so you have the song structure mapped out.

Now...go and record whatever you prefer first...using both the click and scratch tracks as references.
For me, I like do get the drums down first, just because most of the other instruments will key off the drums, and IMO, the drums are the most important instrument in rock/pop/country/R&B/etc music...even if they are just playing a simple beat.
 
I'm with MiroDude on this and for alot of the same reasons.

I do all the instruments too and find that layin down a click track then a scratch guitar seems to work best...for me anyway.
The click makes life alot easier too.
 
Dogbreath said:
I'm with MiroDude on this and for alot of the same reasons.

I do all the instruments too and find that layin down a click track then a scratch guitar seems to work best...for me anyway.
The click makes life alot easier too.
Click to expand...

yep me too,

making a click will help determine your bpm to punch in the grid. The lines will then serve a purpose.
 
Typically recording drums after other tracks is a nightmare. Never does seem to sound exactly right. At the very least you end up doing the bass again to get things in the groove. I've done drums after guitars but never liked the results. IMO the feel from the drums and bass must be established first. But wth you're not trying to do the record so just use a click.

/me waffles...
 
I'm primarily a drummer, but drums are usually the last thing I track. I do all my tracks to a guide, simple drum machine beat. I'll start with whatever "dominates" the tune most in my mind. Sometimes it's bass, sometimes guitar.

I'll either do vocals or drums last. But, it doesn't mean I won't go back and re-record one or more tracks after, if I find that after laying down the drums, I need to change something I did earlier.
 
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I'm in much the same boat as you. I record all the parts myself. (except I use a drum machine.) I use a click track to record a scratch of the guitar and vox together. I just stick up a mic and play acoustic and sing to get the basic arrangment of the song down. Then go back and retrack each part seperately. I am happy with this process. But as has often been said . . . there are no rules.
 
Since you are using real drums, my suggestion is to decide on a tempo, set up a click track or fake drum track, and throw down some scratch guitar and vocal tracks for reference (bass as well, if that is what drives the song). Then, go after getting a good "keeper" drum track--as many takes as needed. Once you have a good performance on drums, start stacking everything else on top.

Obviously this isn't the only way to do things, but from my experience, the benefits are as follows. The scratch tracks allow the drummer (you) to focus on laying down a performance without having to count measures, repetitions of riffs, etc.--you can just focus on nailing the part. Then, when you're laying down the other instruments, you'll be playing directly off of that existing drum track. In other words, the keeper drum track will be driving the remaining performances, which is much closer to how a real live performance works. Yes, as Rami said, it is possible to do drums last, but it's tougher than you might think to get it right--especially if the song is at all fancy.
 
I always record the drums first, but I play along to help the drummer keep his place in the song. I let the overhead mics pick up just a little guitar so that when I go back for all the overdubs I know where I am. This gives the finished songs a nice "live" feel.
 
Like a lot of others I start with a scratch track, usually rythm guitar and vocal with a drum machine simple beat for a referance track. From this I build the song by adding whatever track(s) I feel are needed. A good solid drum track helps keep everything else in alignment but isn't always the first track I try to get down. Often I will try to get the rythm guitar and bass guitar tracks before drums. Then the drum track sort of conects these all together. I usualy save lead instruments and vocals for last. I don't have a set order for tracking but I find myself repeating this order, it's what works for me. Experiment and find what works best for you.
 
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