Vocals- Dynamic vs. LD Condensor

Jeff_D

Jeff_D

New member
Hello everyone- I've got a quick question for you guys- Im recording a rock and roll band (that im in), and im happy with how everything is sounding (decent-but not "great")- Im recording lead vocal seperate with a SM58 into a Soundcraft M8- with a LAX Compressor in the insert, into my computer via M-Audio Delta 1010LT. They dont sound terrible and they actually sit in the mix pretty well. So here is my question- Would i benifit from purchasing an inexpensive LD Condensor like the SP B1- Will there be a noticible leap in quality or clarrity or any other benifit otherwise (Ive got a pair of Oktava 012's for drum overheads and Im happy with those- but i heard SD's are no good for vocals) Really more than anything, your suggestions will determine whether i try to get something for next weekend for more vocal tracking, or i get one later (but its probably gonna be inevitable eventually) Thanks for all the info guys-

Jeff
 
kremitmusic said:
Would i benifit from purchasing an inexpensive LD Condensor like the SP B1- Will there be a noticible leap in quality or clarrity or any other benifit otherwise . . .
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Not really. It will probably sound a little different. Might be better but might be worse. Depends.
 
Try the 012's on vocals, both singly, and as an X-Y pair. They work for some singers, you might be surprised. You won't lose any thing by trying them out. But absolutely use a pop filter!-Richie
 
Well you could get a V67 from Samash for only $79. That would give you a dramatic difference than what you are getting from an Sm58. You could try a 57 for a bit more open sound.

Other options are:
C-1 - $199
B-1 - $79

You could also look into a Shure SM-7. It is a LD Dynamic that is great. Unfortunately they also cost about $300.

But if it works in the mix and sounds good, then why change it?
Beez
 
I found that when I changed to use a LD condensor from a dynamic on vocals, that on my voice at least, it made the world of difference. For the first time My voice sounded how I heard it!

I'd previously been using SM57's, SM58'S Sennheiser e835's and Sennheiser e845's to record vocals. The leap to the SP B1 was one of the best I'd ever made.

This is just my opinion though.

Neil
 
Neil Ogilvie said:
For the first time My voice sounded how I heard it!
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A condensor will usually get your voice closer to how you hear it, but depending on the voice and the style of music, that's not necessarily a good thing.
 
Thanks guys- i might as well try the sd- like ya said-couldnt hurt-
Beezoboy- it sounds good in the mix- but not great or outstanding or anything- and if the difference between good and really good or great is $80 then why not- BTW- the MXL mics- Marshall- is that the same as the Guitar Amplifier people?- just curious- oh and one more thing- if i do the x-y config, should i record it stereo or 2 mono tracks- stereo i'd guess

Thanks- Jeff
 
kremitmusic said:
- and if the difference between good and really good or great is $80 then why not
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Sometimes the difference is $80, sometimes it's $8,000, sometimes great is even cheaper than good.

the MXL mics- Marshall- is that the same as the Guitar Amplifier people?
Click to expand...

Nope.

if i do the x-y config, should i record it stereo or 2 mono tracks- stereo i'd guess
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Same thing.
 
same thing audibly, but control wise is different- stereo's probably easier to work with in this case
 
RE: "other benefit"

The B1 is an excellent rehearsal tool as it's relatively so neutral,
superior to the Oktava or Marshall for this purpose.
(most Marshall's=bright, Oktava=dark)

Your Oktava is somewhat neutral, however, it's thicker in the mids, and rolled off at the top. Keeping it approximately between
forehead and nose level pointed downward is a good starting
place to help avoid popping.

Schoeps and DPA are two top notch manufacturers of SD condenser microphones for vocals. They are very popular
when recording major opera singers.
Roy Orbison's vocals on hits like "Only The Lonely" were also
recorded on a SD condenser BTW.

Chris
 
The 012's aren't my first choice for vocals, but sometimes they work, especially if you record at low volume levels and give them some distance- 18-24", they're not bad, but they're not forgiving either, they'll make you toe the line as a vocalist.-Richie
 
I had pretty good luck at around 8 to 9 inches away,
guess it's the old "YMMV". Richie's absolutely right about the pop screen-no matter what! (protects the capsule too)

Chris
 
good info guys- so are you suggesting that a large diaphram condensor may not be essential - what it sounds like anyway- and that results are attainable with pretty much any type of mic? Like i said in my initial post- im not unhappy with the way the vocal sounds- but, due to my lack of experience with recording vox- i may be satisfied simply because its the best ive done- but not the best i can do. Im not against buying equipment, unless of course i just really dont need it. Would you guys say that im better of waiting and spending a little more down the road- I know buy cheap- buy twice... and im sure thats a bit of an ambiguous question- maybe the vox im getting are the best they're gonna get- im just tryin to guage the potential improvement, before i invest the time and money to get one

anyway, i'll have plenty of time to mess with this. right now the goal is to get 5-8 songs recorded for a demo. The band is at my house and we get together for an entire day once a week to "practice" (recording lately) we will continue to record as we continue writing, and that shouldnt be too difficult since our practice and recording space are both in the same house.

thanks for all input and keep the comments comin, if you got any thing else.

jeff
 
Vocals are quirky things, Jeff. Sometimes great tracks require a Neumann mic and a vintage Neve preamp, and sometimes they require a Shure SM-57 (and a Neve preamp). There just is no telling what mic will work for a given singer on a given song. I wouldn't want to work with *one* vocal mic, anymore than I would play one guitar. You won't get "the same" results using the Oktava, or any other mic. You'll get what that mic can do. If you don't like what you hear, try another song, in a different key. Sometimes a specific song will bring a mic to life, and maybe it's only good for that one song. Where you're at, all you can do is begin by collecting mics that work for other people, starting with inexpensive ones, and trying out as many as you have the opportunity to sing through. Make those opportunities. If you want to be a singer, and a recording artist, get to know mics personally. With current technology, I would start at Studio Projects B-1 and Marshall MXLV67. Then add a dynamic, Shure SM7 or Sennheiser MD421.
Next, add a tube mic, Rode NTK or Studio Projects T-3. It then progresses to Shure KSM44, B.L.U.E. Dragonfly, Neumann TLM103.
The next level involves Lawson, more Neumann, more B.L.U.E. more money. Did I mention that you need a Shure SM-57? If all those expensive main vocal mics don't work, try that. It could be the right mic.-Richie
 
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