Vocal Nirvana...Using Gobo's...Wow is all I Can Say!

Muddy T-Bone

Muddy T-Bone

New member
I recently posted an inquiry as to the purpose of vocal booths, as I had a lead vocal recorded in a large, live room that I just could not get to sound good. I had a number of replies that were helpfull, and did some research here, and found a fellow that posted his cheap and portable PVC pipe gobo, using moving blankets. The OP is below.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/gener...on-vocal-booth-live-room-vs-dead-room-357907/

I constructed 3 of these yesterday, and recorded a new lead vocal (as well as 2 percussion tracks). All I can say is that this is a recording life changing experience. The vocal is so clean and natural its unbelievable. I could easily mix it dry it sounds so good. In the end, I decided to send it to my favorite 'verb, and pulled the fader way down on the receive and panned it about 30%R. Wow. The vocal centered is so clean, and with the verb panned it sounds absolutely like it was recorded in a larger space, with the slight delay bouncing off the right wall.

Percussion sound great in there as well. I'm sold on recording vocals this way in the future.
 

Attachments

  • GOBO.JPG
    GOBO.JPG
    99.3 KB · Views: 437
I'm glad that worked out. Hope this serves as a lesson to those who have yet to get some treatment too. Nice one
 
Very nice! I also track vocals in an untreated room. Usually I put the blankets behind the singer but maybe I'll try surrounding the mic/singer. I would love to hear a comparison of the two vocal takes.
 
Welcome to understanding why many of us stress the importance of room treatment so much. It is the 'holy grail' in many ways. Just wait till you actually spend a few bucks on doing it right!

The best investment, hands down, is acoustically treating the room you record/mix in. :)
 
jimmys69 said:
Welcome to understanding why many of us stress the importance of room treatment so much. It is the 'holy grail' in many ways. Just wait till you actually spend a few bucks on doing it right!

The best investment, hands down, is acoustically treating the room you record/mix in. :)
Click to expand...

I have read that so many times, and thought is was home recording voo-doo. Just another reason to spend more money, on a questionable result.

I've seen (and heard) the light now. I'm still stunned by this experience.
 
JG96 said:
Very nice! I also track vocals in an untreated room. Usually I put the blankets behind the singer but maybe I'll try surrounding the mic/singer. I would love to hear a comparison of the two vocal takes.
Click to expand...

I think you'll be very pleased with surrounding the singer. The 2 behind the mic were set at maybe a 30deg angle, and I pulled the one behing fairly close. Also, I moved the blanket stands around with my cans on so I could hear what was going on acoustically. Sometimes a less than a foot, or a few degrees made a difference I could hear. Good and Bad.
 
OK, as I dive deeper into the recording and now into room treatment. I have a question. I have a room with acoustic ceiling and carpet. The only surfaces that have any bounce would be the drywall and a few hard pieces of furniture. I don't hear any issues, but I also haven't developed the ear for it. Based on that and doing a vocal treatment similar to chat was shown on this thread, what more would I need? (Ex. should I treat the walls?) I feel the room is pretty dead, but I am not 100% sure.
 
DM60 said:
OK, as I dive deeper into the recording and now into room treatment. I have a question. I have a room with acoustic ceiling and carpet. The only surfaces that have any bounce would be the drywall and a few hard pieces of furniture. I don't hear any issues, but I also haven't developed the ear for it. Based on that and doing a vocal treatment similar to chat was shown on this thread, what more would I need? (Ex. should I treat the walls?) I feel the room is pretty dead, but I am not 100% sure.
Click to expand...

Every room is different, so there is no "one size fits all". From the OP's pictures, you can see there must have been some conflicting room reflections happening. When I started recording, I was in my main music room with a wood-paneled wall in front of me and one a few feet to the side as well. Despite using a dynamic mic, I was getting reflections, so just used an old thick comforter draped over a stand around me. It worked (listened to some of those recordings this morning, as a matter of fact). Now I do my vocal tracking in a larger room, with some non-90 degree corners/surfaces, and set up on a diagonal. Still looking for an inexpensive source for compressed rock wook/fibreglass to make some 2x4 bass traps, which are, of course, the best solution.
 
mjbphotos said:
Every room is different, so there is no "one size fits all". From the OP's pictures, you can see there must have been some conflicting room reflections happening. When I started recording, I was in my main music room with a wood-paneled wall in front of me and one a few feet to the side as well. Despite using a dynamic mic, I was getting reflections, so just used an old thick comforter draped over a stand around me. It worked (listened to some of those recordings this morning, as a matter of fact). Now I do my vocal tracking in a larger room, with some non-90 degree corners/surfaces, and set up on a diagonal. Still looking for an inexpensive source for compressed rock wook/fibreglass to make some 2x4 bass traps, which are, of course, the best solution.
Click to expand...

MJ, thanks and I understand that it varies. S I was not clear, I am asking more about, what am I looking for in the recording to determine I may or may not have room issues (I know it is a difficult question). Any good examples out there?
 
DM60 said:
MJ, thanks and I understand that it varies. S I was not clear, I am asking more about, what am I looking for in the recording to determine I may or may not have room issues (I know it is a difficult question). Any good examples out there?
Click to expand...
It's not so much the sound issues while recording. Some very live rooms might be great for tracking things like drums, vocals, and even guitars.

The problem with an un-treated room is that you're not hearing the "truth" when you monitor and/or mix down. Also, there's more to it than just being "dead". You need to control low frequencies. The fact that you have carpet might not be a horrible thing, but carpet only kills mid and high frequencies. It's generally better to have a hard wood or even cement floor.

What you need to do is treat the room with the proper materials like rigid fibreglass. Typically, bass builds up more in the corners, so you need at least 4" think traps in as many corners as you can cover, which includes the wall/floor and wall/ceiling corners, but at the very least the 4 corners of the room.
 
DM60 said:
MJ, thanks and I understand that it varies. S I was not clear, I am asking more about, what am I looking for in the recording to determine I may or may not have room issues (I know it is a difficult question). Any good examples out there?
Click to expand...

The question isn't really 'whether you have room issues', it is at what frequencies you have them the most. All rooms will have peaks, and nulls. The worst of these are in the low end register, especially if the room is small and square.

You could do testing (REW), and verify yourself, what the problematic frequencies are, but RAMI's advice is a solid starting point. EVERY mixing rooms issues, would be improved by doing the basic steps he speaks of.

Now, determining the problem, without testing, is more a matter of not knowing, until you know. In other words, you can not really audibly assess the difference, until you do some type of treatment. That is kinda the point the OP had, he was amazed at how much better his recordings sounded, after even basic room treatments. Your mixes will translate to other systems, because you are actually hearing a more accurate representation of the actually frequencies in a recording. This also applies to recording, as reflections and resonance of some frequencies, can enhance, or destroy a performance. Controlling the extremes, is more the idea here.

To finalize, every room will benefit by acoustically treating the correct way for it's use. Not necessarily always for a tracking room, but they benefit just as much, only sometimes a different approach. A room can have a 'sound' for recording. For mixing, you want to stop the room from having any other sound, than accurate. If they are 'one in the same' room, then likely treating for mixing is the best compromise.


This is an opinion, but one that I have researched, had had quite a bit of experience with. I do not claim to be an authority on the subject tho...
 
jimmys69 said:
The question isn't really 'whether you have room issues', it is at what frequencies you have them the most. All rooms will have peaks, and nulls. The worst of these are in the low end register, especially if the room is small and square.

You could do testing (REW), and verify yourself, what the problematic frequencies are, but RAMI's advice is a solid starting point. EVERY mixing rooms issues, would be improved by doing the basic steps he speaks of.

Now, determining the problem, without testing, is more a matter of not knowing, until you know. In other words, you can not really audibly assess the difference, until you do some type of treatment. That is kinda the point the OP had, he was amazed at how much better his recordings sounded, after even basic room treatments. Your mixes will translate to other systems, because you are actually hearing a more accurate representation of the actually frequencies in a recording. This also applies to recording, as reflections and resonance of some frequencies, can enhance, or destroy a performance. Controlling the extremes, is more the idea here.

To finalize, every room will benefit by acoustically treating the correct way for it's use. Not necessarily always for a tracking room, but they benefit just as much, only sometimes a different approach. A room can have a 'sound' for recording. For mixing, you want to stop the room from having any other sound, than accurate. If they are 'one in the same' room, then likely treating for mixing is the best compromise.


This is an opinion, but one that I have researched, had had quite a bit of experience with. I do not claim to be an authority on the subject tho...
Click to expand...

At this point, before I make any other purchases, I am going to take this sage advice and wok on the sound treatment of the room. Not crazy, but a few bass traps, and a good area for vocals. And as stated, then do some comparisons.

Thanks all for the info, I will return in a few days with a follow up.
 
DM60 said:
OK, as I dive deeper into the recording and now into room treatment. I have a question. I have a room with acoustic ceiling and carpet. The only surfaces that have any bounce would be the drywall and a few hard pieces of furniture. I don't hear any issues, but I also haven't developed the ear for it. Based on that and doing a vocal treatment similar to chat was shown on this thread, what more would I need? (Ex. should I treat the walls?) I feel the room is pretty dead, but I am not 100% sure.
Click to expand...

DM60,
The PVC ran me about $40 and I already had 2 moving blankets. I paid $17.00 for the third moving blanket. This will be the best under $100 expenditure you can make for your studio.

I suggest building three of these, placing them in your studio, and then make another take on one of your existing recordings. Try for vocals or an instrument. Then go back and solo the 2 different takes. I was switching back and forth A-B'ing mine, and was literally speachless at the difference.

I'm sure you'll have a similar experience.

As for me, once I move my studio into it's permanent location, I plan on extensive room treatment. If some simple and cheap portable movers blankets had this type impact on quality, I can only imagine how a properly treated room will impact tone and quality.
 
Muddy T-Bone said:
DM60,
The PVC ran me about $40 and I already had 2 moving blankets. I paid $17.00 for the third moving blanket. This will be the best under $100 expenditure you can make for your studio.
Click to expand...


Or...you could just get one of the wrap-around reflection filters and end up with the same result...only less clutter and no effort on the whole building process.

41689-extra_l.jpg

Look...hanging blankets up in a hard-wall, untreated room is obviously going to change the ambiance going into the mic....but don't get too carried away with it as though it's the answer to everyone's acoustics issue.
You could go stand in a full clothing closet and the same effect, but that's not necessarily a solution, not to mention, it may only have some effect on vocals, because it dampens frequencies in just that particular range.
Try other instruments with just blankets around them...and they won't give you an even/balanced treatment...only shaving off the upper end...which may sound more dead, but that may not be better for the sound.

Typical "gobos" are made out of layers and are thick, with often one hard side and the other full of broadband absorption material. Just hanging up some blankets is probably one-step away from simply sourounding yourself with foam...which isn't a great approach....though they both can help in a pinch for taming upper frequencies, but don't do much more than that.
 
I borrowed a friends reflection filter, and it was an improvement, but nothing close to my experience. Probably because of the limited ability in a 360 deg area.

I also tried recording vocals in a closet. That was sonically hideous. Perhaps the textiles in my closet were the wrong type. Haaaaahhaahhhhhaaa.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top