Upgrading Equipment

R

rothy

New member
Hello all, you guys have been such a great help over the last year, and I am ready to begin a small upgrade to my "studio".

Right now I have:

Yamaha MG10/2 Mixer
KRK RP-5 Monitors
MBox
MXL 990/991 mics
Various guitars

For the last year or so, I have been running the mics and guitars right into the MBox and for the most part have used the mixer to route the sound from the MBox to the monitors (the MBox has no volume control for the monitor output).

I have recently purchased a Vox Tonelab SE, and will need 2 mono channels for recording it properly. I also would like to capture and play some of my rare vinyl (I will be purchasing an ART DJPRE II phono preamp and perhaps an audio selctor to plug phono, tape and cd into to run to mixer).

All said I need to input:

2 XLR mono (mics)
3 TRS mono (L-R vox tonelab and 1 direct input from acoustic/electric guitar)
1 TRS mono (analog keyboard)
2 TRS mono (L-R monitor output from MBox)
1-3 pair TRS stereo/rca (phono, tape and CD)

I am thinking of purchasing the Behringer Eurorack UB1222FX-PRO. I know Behringer is not thought of highly here, but it fits my price range, and has the features I was lacking on the Yamaha:

XLR output for monitors
4 mono/8 stereo channels
MUTE option on each channel
faders are not knobs

Any help or advice would be appreciated as always. And if there is a better way to spend my ~$200, please feel free to make suggestions.
 
The 1222FX has 4 mono and 4 stereo channels, but the 4 stereo channels consist of 8 in puts, Left and Right ins on each of the stereo channels, Channels 9/10 and 11/12 can be used as mono channels by plugging a single TRS into the input designated as Left. I actually use this board, and it works for what I use it for, which I guess means it was worth what little I spent on it. If you aren't going to be using outboard effects, and mixing down to an outboard source, I don't see a need for a board tbh. Worth looking into.
 
I won't bash the Behri mixer because I haven't used it but FWIW I think those Yammie MG mixers are great for the money. I can't help thinking it'd be a downgrade to replace it with the Behri.

I don't understand why you need the mixer for tracking anyway. The MBox has only two simultaneous ins right? So despite all of your requirements for inputs you'll only be recording 1 or 2 at a time?

It might make routing a bit more flexible but if you stick a cheesy mixer in your signal path you're compromising the audio quality, not only because the mixer is crappy but because you're signals are passing through unnecessary circuitry.

If I had your setup I'd keep it direct and simple:

Mics- mic ins of MBox
Line level sources- line ins of MBox
MBox TRS outs- Monitors (these are balanced outs, why do you specifically need xlr's to your boxes?) or small mixer (if you want to do other stuff with the outputted signal). If you wanted to buy a nicer preamp then that could go to the line ins on the MBox.

If you're mixing on the fly and recording a stereo mix with several sources into the two line ins of the MBox then ignore everything I've said. :D
 
[QUOTE=Kevin DeSchwazi
It might make routing a bit more flexible but if you stick a cheesy mixer in your signal path you're compromising the audio quality, not only because the mixer is crappy but because you're signals are passing through unnecessary circuitry.





For the record, with the particular board in question. I get the same signal quality running through the board and to the in on my PC as I do using a preamp to the in on my PC. I do however agree with the unnecessary part :P
 
Kevin DeSchwazi said:
The MBox has only two simultaneous ins right? So despite all of your requirements for inputs you'll only be recording 1 or 2 at a time?

It might make routing a bit more flexible but if you stick a cheesy mixer in your signal path you're compromising the audio quality, not only because the mixer is crappy but because you're signals are passing through unnecessary circuitry.
Click to expand...

Basically I am at a point where I have so much going on, it would be nice to leave certain elements plugged into the mixer "permanently" for ease of use - rather than plugging and unplugging things into the MBox over and over. That is what I am trying to accomplish, excessive plugging and unplugging of cables. NOTE - I store the mics away when not using them, and plug them in only when needed. But things like the Tonelab and keyboard and monitors and MBox (and phono, cd, tape) I would like to leave plugged in at all times.

I am a newbie...

If there is a better way, or if I am harming my equipment leaving it plugged into the mixer, please point me in the right direction.

I think it is a good analogy to think of a stereo reciever - that is what I am using my mixer as - I only record one (maybe two channels at once - I am a one man band) - I wouldn't unplug my dvd player when not in use...

I mix everything "in the box" with the MBox and ProTools - the mixer is simply a router to me - directing whatever 1 or 2 channels I am recording at the time to the MBox.

Thanks for the responses so far, it is very helpful. you guys are a great resource.

EDIT: The reason I am wanting to upgrade is because I fell in love with the VOX Tonelad SE - and it says in the manual to use 2 mono inputs panned far left and far right for best results. I can see this as there are effects like stereo delay and rotary speakers... Also there is a good chance I will want to record 3 channels at once - putting a guide vocal on top of the Tonelab.
 
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I suspected that might be your aim, I just thought I'd point out that generally the more 'direct' you record the better (you're not 'harming' anything btw). Do with that advice what you will, you might hook it all up, be happy with the sound and see the additional circuitry as a good compromise given the convenience it gives you. For me it wouldn't do.

If I was in your position my solution would involve getting an interface with more ins rather than another mixer, then you could have everything permanently plugged directly into that. Your setup would also be a bit more future proof, not in the technical obsolescence sense but in that if friends come over in the future to record you'd have a few extra channels to play with.
rothy said:
EDIT: The reason I am wanting to upgrade is because I fell in love with the VOX Tonelad SE - and it says in the manual to use 2 mono inputs panned far left and far right for best results. I can see this as there are effects like stereo delay and rotary speakers... Also there is a good chance I will want to record 3 channels at once - putting a guide vocal on top of the Tonelab.
Click to expand...
Can you not pan the inputs in the software mixer that comes with the MBox?


I hope you sort something out that works well for you anyway.
 
Kevin DeSchwazi said:
If I was in your position my solution would involve getting an interface with more ins rather than another mixer, then you could have everything permanently plugged directly into that. Your setup would also be a bit more future proof, not in the technical obsolescence sense but in that if friends come over in the future to record you'd have a few extra channels to play with.
Click to expand...

Any suggestions? I am already seeing limitations with the MBox. I am also looking to get into midi recording, and the MBox does not lend itself to that very easily.

As for the tonlab - there are 2 TRS outputs (L & R) coming out, it says to put each in its own mono channel, and pan far left and right. It may be my lack of experience, that I don't see a better way. :confused:
 
I use an MAudio 1010LT, that gives me 8 analog ins (2 with mic preamps which can be bypassed if you wish), plus MIDI in/out and spdif and I think it retails for $199 over there.

The downside is there's no breakout box so it's wires hanging from the back of your PC but I find everything just stays hooked up anyway though so it's not an issue for me. Also 6 of the ins and all of the outs are unbalanced but in a small home studio with short cable runs again, this isn't a problem for me.

I think it's a fantastic multi in/out card for the money.

I'm not saying your thinking (or what it says in the manual) is wrong with the tonelab, only that you should be able to go direct into the two mono inputs of the MBox and then pan the two channels in the MBox mixer software before going to PT, so you don't need to pan in hardware beforehand. That's assuming you can pan in the MBox control software? I don't know I haven't used one, but with most interfaces you should be able to do this.
 
Kevin DeSchwazi said:
I'm not saying your thinking (or what it says in the manual) is wrong with the tonelab, only that you should be able to go direct into the two mono inputs of the MBox and then pan the two channels in the MBox mixer software before going to PT, so you don't need to pan in hardware beforehand. That's assuming you can pan in the MBox control software? I don't know I haven't used one, but with most interfaces you should be able to do this.
Click to expand...

I just misunderstood what you were saying. Yes I can go into the 2 channels on the MBox, then pan then channels in ProTools.

Any recomendations on a firewire or usb interface, or some search parameters so I can know what I am looking at on musiciansfriend?

Thanks again for your help.
 
rothy said:
I just misunderstood what you were saying. Yes I can go into the 2 channels on the MBox, then pan then channels in ProTools.

Any recomendations on a firewire or usb interface, or some search parameters so I can know what I am looking at on musiciansfriend?

Thanks again for your help.
Click to expand...
I've nver used either type so I'm not really up on these things, the word on the street is that firewire is preferrable to USB, more stable, fewer problems with latency, drop-outs etc.

Presonus do a couple of firewire interfaces which alot of people seem to be happy with, not sure about MIDI on those though.

Try the homepages of M Audio, presonus, Edirol, E-mu, Terratec etc. to get a feel for what's out there. Other than M audio I'm not recommending any of those as such because I've never used any of them, but those are the manufacturers that are out there.

If you just do a search for firewire at any of the online retailers you should get a good range.
 
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