Two Mixes of a Cover Song (John Frusciante - Masters Also Enclosed for Download)

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rocknrollstar

New member
So I'm wanting to record live. I have a collection of around 8-10 songs written. I can play and sing separate, however I want to record a performance and get a "live" feel so would prefer to just record both at the same time.

As practice for mixing, I've recorded and done 2 mixes of The Past Recedes - a song originally done by John Frusciante so all rights belong to him - I'm just an avid fan, go listen to his album Curtains.

Anyway, I used x2 LDC mics - one aimed sideways, one foot out and up, pointing towards where the soundhole meets the neck. Another mic was infront of my mouth w pop shield. I recorded the track live and you are hearing take 2.

I feel it is VERY close to what I want, however feel it is still a bit "sharp" - could I get some feedback/advice please?

Mix 1 - https://soundcloud.com/michaeloneilmusic/the-past-recedes-1-john-1

Mix 2 - https://soundcloud.com/michaeloneilmusic/the-past-recedes-2-john

Master Tracks for Download - https://soundcloud.com/michaeloneilmusic/sets/master-tracks-for-the-past


Additional info: my room is not treated unfortunately, however it is set up to the best of my ability, I do have decent monitors which I used for these mixes - I have a Samson LDC, an Audio Technica LDC (the two used on this song) and also have a Rode SDC and a Samson SDC. I usually have these plugged into a Scarlett 2i4 which is then connected to Ableton Live. My computer is half decent and can handle multiple WAVS at a time.


Any advice greatly appreciated, anything I've missed I will answer and willing to crit for crit to the best of my ability.





EDIT: some issues getting Soundcloud it would seem, so both mixes attached via mp3
 

Attachments

  • The Past Recedes (1).mp3
    7.8 MB · Views: 15
  • The Past Recedes (2).mp3
    8.5 MB · Views: 7
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Soundcloud's having technical difficulties right now, just thought I'd let you know.
 
Pinky said:
Soundcloud's having technical difficulties right now, just thought I'd let you know.
Click to expand...

Really, it's working okay for me...

I'll see if I can change the mixes to mp3 and upload them here then - thanks for letting me know.


EDIT: Mp3s now attached to original post
 
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Something was definitely wrong accessing your files at the time (but other soundcloud music was playing fine). [I'll check it out again later, at work now]
 
Pinky said:
Something was definitely wrong accessing your files at the time (but other soundcloud music was playing fine). [I'll check it out again later, at work now]
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Hey man, just in from work myself. Hmm that's strange, although my friend reported something similar - I must have a unique soundcloud haha.

Okay thanks man, any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
#1 has that wandering stereo panning effect, which is a little distracting on headphones. It's also not as 'full' sounding.

#2 is louder and I like that it doesn't have the panning effect, but the vocals are slightly distorted during louder passages (not sure if that's on the original, but didn't notice it on #1). This is a little too dry, and some conservative reverb might help. I would avoid applying the same reverb patch for both, or if you do use (say)a medium room effect, change something about one or the other (maybe adjust the decay by a millisecond on one of them).

I don't notice any phasing, always a plus when using two mics.
 
Pinky said:
#1 has that wandering stereo panning effect, which is a little distracting on headphones. It's also not as 'full' sounding.

#2 is louder and I like that it doesn't have the panning effect, but the vocals are slightly distorted during louder passages (not sure if that's on the original, but didn't notice it on #1). This is a little too dry, and some conservative reverb might help. I would avoid applying the same reverb patch for both, or if you do use (say)a medium room effect, change something about one or the other (maybe adjust the decay by a millisecond on one of them).

I don't notice any phasing, always a plus when using two mics.
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Recent festivities have kept me away from here, so first off Happy New Year :) thank you for responding.


Yes #1 has the guitar L 9 o clock and vox is R 3 o clock. The idea was to give them space but it's not how I hear it in my head.

#2 has some slight reverb and things aren't so panned. Other people have mentioned a lack of reverb so I think that + maybe some double tracking should hopefully open things up a bit. Mix #1 just has everything louder in general I believe.


So I think the next steps are to record better and learn a bit more about reverb and how to use it. Thanks for taking the time to respond :) if there's anything else I should be aware of then let me know/anything else you want to add.


Also willing to check out anything you have done if you have a link?
 
rocknrollstar said:
Also willing to check out anything you have done if you have a link?
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That's a very nice gesture. I'm not sure when the last time I posted a mix here for feedback. I learn a lot from participating in helping others with their mixes, often seeing good ideas executed when suggested, or just reminding myself of principles maybe I don't adhere to as often as I should.

Regarding reverb, best thing is to try lots of different things. I've probably spent more time tinkering to learn proper reverb use than any other single thing in mixing. [compression would be #2, and I've actually only recently started tackling that more seriously]
 
Pinky said:
That's a very nice gesture. I'm not sure when the last time I posted a mix here for feedback. I learn a lot from participating in helping others with their mixes, often seeing good ideas executed when suggested, or just reminding myself of principles maybe I don't adhere to as often as I should.

Regarding reverb, best thing is to try lots of different things. I've probably spent more time tinkering to learn proper reverb use than any other single thing in mixing. [compression would be #2, and I've actually only recently started tackling that more seriously]
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No problem man, that's what it's all about. The more I can get involved with people who are superior producers to me then the more opportunities I have to learn.

I've been reading some Sound on Sound articles re: reverb - just recorded (well, re-recorded) an original track and going to see if I can get the acoustic and vocals to blend.

Also not going to start mixing straight away - I've read about people's ears feeling sore after mixing/recording but this is the first time I've ever felt it - strange sensation.

Out of curiosity, do you have a favourite genre of music to mix?

Will be back on PC later so going to check out the link in your signature :)
 
rocknrollstar said:
Out of curiosity, do you have a favourite genre of music to mix?
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Not at all, as a musician I tend to have a wide range of styles in my own music, as a listener I would probably qualify for eclectic, and as a fledgling producer I've worked on metal, pop, prog, folk, and classical to name a few. They all offer unique challenges and are equally rewarding when finished. :)

That isn't to say everyone has to be into doing every style, I just like the challenges of applying my skills across different styles which require entirely different approaches. I'm still probably 'learning' metal, as the compression techniques for getting a good metal mix rub me the wrong way but are a necessity if you're going to be releasing metal to the masses.

Is folk/pop going to be your thing or just where you're starting at this time?
 
Pinky said:
Not at all, as a musician I tend to have a wide range of styles in my own music, as a listener I would probably qualify for eclectic, and as a fledgling producer I've worked on metal, pop, prog, folk, and classical to name a few. They all offer unique challenges and are equally rewarding when finished. :)

That isn't to say everyone has to be into doing every style, I just like the challenges of applying my skills across different styles which require entirely different approaches. I'm still probably 'learning' metal, as the compression techniques for getting a good metal mix rub me the wrong way but are a necessity if you're going to be releasing metal to the masses.

Is folk/pop going to be your thing or just where you're starting at this time?
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Do you ever find some unlikely things that transcend genres in your experience as a producer so far? e.g. something that two genres share that you wouldn't usually put together like say dance music and metal? e.g. they both are heavy in certain effects etc


No I work in all different types of music. The stuff I record at home is mainly acoustic, but I also do more electronic based music with a friend and I went to a studio and done full band arrangements.


I want to get the acoustic album done and at the same time me and my friend have done a few songs (I usually record the parts/MIDI then and he mixes everything as he is better at it than me) - stuff I do with him is influenced by acts like Matt Lange, Andrew Bayer, Daft Punk - that sort of thought process.


The reason I'm so hell-bent on acoustic is because I've had an album sitting for nearly 2 yrs that I want to get out of my system, so to speak as well.
 
rocknrollstar said:
Do you ever find some unlikely things that transcend genres in your experience as a producer so far? e.g. something that two genres share that you wouldn't usually put together like say dance music and metal? e.g. they both are heavy in certain effects etc.
Click to expand...

Metal and techno are an obvious one because they both have driving beats. Fundamentals are always the same, but when/how much you apply compression and reverb, EQ certain instruments, etc changes from genre to genre.
 
Pinky said:
Metal and techno are an obvious one because they both have driving beats. Fundamentals are always the same, but when/how much you apply compression and reverb, EQ certain instruments, etc changes from genre to genre.
Click to expand...


Once I get myself to what I consider an acceptable level w acoustic + vocals I'll venture onto other things as well :) how long you been involved with music?


ALSO - what do you make of the attached mp3? That's just a short clip of me and getting the acoustic guitar - two mic recording w some reverb etc
 

Attachments

  • Mic Test.mp3
    657.8 KB · Views: 2
Mic test sounds good!

I've been dabbling since 1991, first with reel to reel, then 4 tracks and a few studio visits, on serious band, and since 2000 have been pretty much doing home recording (couple local bands thrown in). Looking back, I have to agree with the cliche there's no substitute for time. Much of what I've learned has been an accumulation over the years. But we all start somewhere, and the advantage to starting today is the plethora of tools and ease to which these tools allow us to make good music.
 
Pinky said:
Mic test sounds good!

I've been dabbling since 1991, first with reel to reel, then 4 tracks and a few studio visits, on serious band, and since 2000 have been pretty much doing home recording (couple local bands thrown in). Looking back, I have to agree with the cliche there's no substitute for time. Much of what I've learned has been an accumulation over the years. But we all start somewhere, and the advantage to starting today is the plethora of tools and ease to which these tools allow us to make good music.
Click to expand...


Yeah I was actually quite happyish with mic test - it's thick, not too overpowered and I'm not biting my lip in anger when I listen back to it so I'm getting better haha.


In terms of the whole analog vs digital debate, do you have a favourite? - it's weird because with most other things in my life, I'm quite impatient and tend to snap easily - but for some reason music + anything related to it, I always go back. Always.
 
There really isn't a debate, techincally analog is always "better" but at a typically hefty cost. For independent schmoes like us or people just looking to dabble, digital can't be beat for the cost. Digital has also come a long way too, so it's not as much of a compromise as it was, say, a decade ago.
 
Pinky said:
There really isn't a debate, techincally analog is always "better" but at a typically hefty cost. For independent schmoes like us or people just looking to dabble, digital can't be beat for the cost. Digital has also come a long way too, so it's not as much of a compromise as it was, say, a decade ago.
Click to expand...


I've always fancied a go at recording with tape, but having to get the razor blades out makes me a bit hesitant - my hands are quite shaky. Can just imagine me getting a take perfect in every way then shaving it haha.


Also experimenting with vocals/techniques I've learned - what do you make of mix attached to this post? It's not complete, but there's progress in terms of guitar thickness etc I think
 

Attachments

  • Cover - Pay No Mind (so far mix).mp3
    2.1 MB · Views: 2
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