Is using a tube mic alone nessisarily an better than running a solid state one through a tube preamp instead? I can see how maybe the tube section of a tube mic might be best optimized to work with the rest of its internal components, but assuming the quality of the outboard tube preamp is good enough, couldnt you pretty much achieve the same result with SS? Seems this would be more economical in the long run if you own several mics SS mics than ever buying a tube one just for that sound.
Tube mic VS. SS mic w/tube preamp?
- Thread starter NRS
- Start date
It depends.
I think you're over-analyzing this. If you like your tube mic pre, and it has a sound you like, then use it. Same goes for the mic. Don't worry about whether or not something has a tube stuck in it somewhere or where the best place is for that tube to be located in the broader context of your signal chain. You'll drive yourself batty.
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I think you're over-analyzing this. If you like your tube mic pre, and it has a sound you like, then use it. Same goes for the mic. Don't worry about whether or not something has a tube stuck in it somewhere or where the best place is for that tube to be located in the broader context of your signal chain. You'll drive yourself batty.
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flatfinger
Use every dam bit!
The capsule itself generates an infinitesimally small signal which needs to be followed up immeadiatley inside the mic so as to get some gain to drive the signal through the cable.
what your asking is a subjective thing.
If your ears like the thermonic element of the signal chain to be further down the line , so be it. Some folks 's ears fancy( that is so british a phrase!) the tubey element right at the beginning of the gain staging, thus adding the supposed tube "mojo" to everything down the line after that.
It's strictly a personal preference type of thing. Speaking from the mfg.'r and marketing point of view , you must have both arrows in your quiver so go out and buy, buy , buy!!!
what your asking is a subjective thing.
If your ears like the thermonic element of the signal chain to be further down the line , so be it. Some folks 's ears fancy( that is so british a phrase!) the tubey element right at the beginning of the gain staging, thus adding the supposed tube "mojo" to everything down the line after that.
It's strictly a personal preference type of thing. Speaking from the mfg.'r and marketing point of view , you must have both arrows in your quiver so go out and buy, buy , buy!!!
flatfinger
Use every dam bit!
chessrock said:
Definition of a gear whore!!!!
Dont know why I was negative repped for this question so I'll elaborate a bit more on why it was asked:
1) First, I'm a newbie to condenser mics, (including tube ones) so really dont know much about whats electronically happening under the hood of a tube condenser other than the tube is being introduced somewhere into the signal to enhance the sound.
2) Something I'm more familiar with is guitar amps and the role the tube plays in both the preamp and poweramp stages of tone shaping and know there is a distinct advantage power tubes have over a solid state amp that no amount of outboard gear is really going to be able to substitute accordingly (The preamp tubes of coarse are a different story).
So it would stand to reason (without any knowlage of microphone electronics) that one might assume there could be some possible tonal advantage to having a mic with a built in tube over using a preamp with one. Not the case from what I now gather though. Question answered! thanks
1) First, I'm a newbie to condenser mics, (including tube ones) so really dont know much about whats electronically happening under the hood of a tube condenser other than the tube is being introduced somewhere into the signal to enhance the sound.
2) Something I'm more familiar with is guitar amps and the role the tube plays in both the preamp and poweramp stages of tone shaping and know there is a distinct advantage power tubes have over a solid state amp that no amount of outboard gear is really going to be able to substitute accordingly (The preamp tubes of coarse are a different story).
So it would stand to reason (without any knowlage of microphone electronics) that one might assume there could be some possible tonal advantage to having a mic with a built in tube over using a preamp with one. Not the case from what I now gather though. Question answered! thanks
homestudioguy
Well-known member
You could run your tube mic through your tube pre and get a completely different sound/color!!! 
cusebassman
Freakin' sweet
As has been said, find a mic that sounds good to you - whether or not it or the mic pre its running into is valve-based is of little relevance when you are looking for an all-purpose mic. Perhaps you are beyond that stage and looking for mics of a particular color, but either way, combining solid state and tube vs. all SS or all tube? Yea, they will have different tonal characteristics, but one won't be any better than the next. There is for some reason a belief in some (a lot, in fact) that vacuum tube implies better quality, which is not the case.
I tested a couple mics before buying the Rode K2, and I bought it because I liked the sound... if it had been solid state, I would have been fine with that as well.
Once any mic / pre combo hits the recorders, it gets translated to digital anyway - what you need to investigate is the most outrageous console I have ever seen:
http://www.vintec-audio.de/
It was brought up in a post recently, and it is just entertaining.
I tested a couple mics before buying the Rode K2, and I bought it because I liked the sound... if it had been solid state, I would have been fine with that as well.
Once any mic / pre combo hits the recorders, it gets translated to digital anyway - what you need to investigate is the most outrageous console I have ever seen:
http://www.vintec-audio.de/
It was brought up in a post recently, and it is just entertaining.
craigmorris74
New member
The tube is not used to enhance the sound. It is used to amplify the sound.
cusebassman
Freakin' sweet
Yup, tubes amplify sound. But you'll often hear people saying that using tubes instead of their solid state brethren produces a nicer, "warmer" sound(or in many cases, simply "better sound"). I'll admit, I do enjoy my tube amps for that sound you can't quite put your finger on, but in the grand scheme of things, you can get amazing quality using either, depending on what yer lookin for.
cusebassman said:
If these people are talking about recording equipment, then they do not really know what they are talking about. In the end it is all about how well a peice of equipment is designed as to how it sounds, not whether or not it has a tube in it. Some of the "warmest" sounding stuff has no tubes. Some of the most coveted items have no tubes either. It's all a matter of what sound you want, who makes something that assists you in that sound, how well you use it, and how that peice was designed. Just as often as not it will or won't have tubes.
homestudioguy
Well-known member
But does it not "colour" the sound in some way vs the "colouration" you get with a SS mic?craigmorris74 said:
brendandwyer
New member
homestudioguy said:
that's also like saying "capacitors and resistors" colour the sound. sure they do. but who cares?
if it sounds good to you it's good to you.
If you're looking to achieve a certain sound or "color" then there might be specific design attributes to look for. If you're not sure what you're looking for, but have heard that tubes=good (or worse the dreaded "warm") then you might be unsatisfied with them once you have them.
Like xstatic and chessrock said, it's all in what you're looking for.
I recently swapped tubes and opamps in a preamp and can tell you that the opamps (tiny little chips) did a lot more to change the overall sound of the preamp than changing the tubes did.
craigmorris74
New member
Yes, the tube does color the sound (as does every part in the signal path, especially transformers and signal path caps) but there is no "standard" tube color sound. My transistorized Neve preamps add far more color to my signal than my hand built tube mic pres.
People building high end tube mics are thinking of the tube as a high quality signal amplification device, not a color source. The only folks claiming that are the budget models. Who do you trust, Gefell or Apex?
cusebassman
Freakin' sweet
Hmm... xstatic quoted me, so I can't tell if he's agreeing with me or not... it seems as though he is...
I suppose the tube vs. SS debate will go on until the last vacuum tube manufactured blows out and all equipment becomes solid state, but again, who cares?
Most of the Neumann mics you see in every damn studio on the planet aren't valve based, and they are considered by many to be some of the best mics manufactured. I suppose in an expensive tube mic, yes, there will be coloration different from that of a solid-state, but if you stick it next to a SS of the same quality construction and design, they will probably have a different sound, but one won't be 'better' or 'worse' than the other...
I suppose the tube vs. SS debate will go on until the last vacuum tube manufactured blows out and all equipment becomes solid state, but again, who cares?
Most of the Neumann mics you see in every damn studio on the planet aren't valve based, and they are considered by many to be some of the best mics manufactured. I suppose in an expensive tube mic, yes, there will be coloration different from that of a solid-state, but if you stick it next to a SS of the same quality construction and design, they will probably have a different sound, but one won't be 'better' or 'worse' than the other...