Travelling in the usa

dobro

dobro

Well-known member
I have a problem. I want to talk to you about the usa, but we have to do this around a table that's covered with drinks. You can't do that online.

Today, aside from dodging coyotes and winding up in Cortez with some really good hoppy IPA, I went to the museum in Los Alamos. Aside from the predictable propaganda, there was actually a display that talked about how many Americans got cancer or suffered birth defects as a result of the New Mexico nuclear tests, and another display that quoted guys like Eisenhower talking about how the nuking of Japan at the end of WWII was completely unnecessary in getting Japan to capitulate.

We could talk about this shit for at least half an hour. Then we could have another drink. See?
 
DM 60 said: "It wasn't the airplane that won the war, it was the bomb."

Nah. So wrong. The war was virtually won by the time the bomb came along. The Japanese had been firebombed to the point where Tokyo was flattened by that time. America dropping the two nukes on Japan was pretty much just an announcement that they'd developed a bomb first. They'd won the war by then.
 
"Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds."

Several U.S. officials opposed the dropping of the bombs - some supported it. The kicker in your statement is that you want to talk about the USA - but in actuality, in my humble opinion, the atomic bomb is a European construct.

Early American colonials argued against the intrusion into European politics - Europeans are strong in nationalism, minimal support for individual rights. Napoleon really screwed that up for everybody. Early "Americans" had it right - leave Europe alone aside from trade - otherwise, you'll entangle yourself in endeavors that only lead to war and destitution.

I agree that the bombs shouldn't have been dropped - unnecessary. But the socialist and nationalist philosophies that denounce natural rights and private property and lean towards socialism and democracy are inherently a European construct, and will result in mob rule.

I ain't hating on Euros - to a certain degree, it's clearly a natural human element due to the USA's drift towards the same - but, until we recognize that the individual rules, and not the country nor the government, we'll continue to the fight the same old battles, ad nauseam.

In my opinion, the US shouldn't have been involved in WWII - or WWI for that matter. War only destroys wealth, and that's not my style, unless it's dire.

Daryl
 
Cortez, Colorado? I've got a cousin that lives there and I am in that area at least 1-2 weeks out of the year. Sort of. Cortez is kind of a shitehole but when you head east for about 20 minutes, or north for that matter, it gets a lot nicer.

All this talk about bombs makes me thirsty... I might grab a beer real quick myself. :drunk:
 
I've never been to Cortez Colorado but it was a topic of conversation with a guy who ran a Pizza joint "Papa Tony's" in Encinitas and I several years back.

We're down vacationing in the city where we hope to retire and I'm rapping with this dude while I'm waiting for our awesome pizza. He tells he's blowing this taco stand and moving to Cortez to retire.. I'd never heard of the place but he was selling me on it..easy living, get a lot of house for a lot less dollars than a Cali house providing mo money to live off of...hmmmm?

I googled the place and have considered even doing a road trip to see if it merits any consideration...but that was before having grandkids... at least in my world that changed the game forever... If I have any plans of getting out of Cali...unless my kids are going, I'm going by myself cause the wife isn't going for that game changer.

The grandkid thing is the ultimate bonus round thing for us so Encinitas or within 15 miles of therein is target for us.

On the monday morning quarterbacking of a war that occurred before any of us here were born is pretty ridiculous. Though we have a peek, a clue... we really don't... history as we know isn't 100% accurate...all's I know is if you see someone getting their ass kicked by someone else and that person is taking it way to far and you have the ability to step in and stop it ...if you don't, you're a lower life form than the bully
 
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Check our Mesa Verde National Park while you're in Cortez. Passed through there on a motorcycle tour this past May. Amazing!
 
pikingrin said:
Cortez, Colorado? I've got a cousin that lives there and I am in that area at least 1-2 weeks out of the year. Sort of. Cortez is kind of a shitehole but when you head east for about 20 minutes, or north for that matter, it gets a lot nicer.

All this talk about bombs makes me thirsty... I might grab a beer real quick myself. :drunk:
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We like Cortez. Mesa Verde's very, very cool. The ranger who took our group through is one of the best guides I've ever had the pleasure to have met. Every once in a while you come across someone who's really good at what they do. It's like they define it.

I didn't buy any smoke though.
 
BroKen_H said:
War has built a lot of wealth in this country...and others. War is big business.
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Things that make money tend to thrive, for sure. But I wonder if that's the reason that the museum at Los Alamos tended to almost celebrate the bomb. I got the impression that the people who put the museum together actually found the whole enterprise exciting, just like the people who were involved in making the thing in the forties.

We found the whole thing kind of depressing, and left after an hour and a half.

Something that surprised us after we left was when we got stopped at a sort of tollbooth west of the town and got asked a bunch of questions about our business travelling in that direction. Sensitive area, still.

The museum's worth a vist,for sure. No entrance fee, either. ;). Honest.
 
There still aren't enough drinks on the table.

Some random impressions...

Provo, Utah is so tidy it's eerie.

Las Vegas is a great big red pimple on the ass of America.

Many women over the age of 45 in Santa Fe are seriously attractive. How do they do that? More than once someone looking good from behind would turn around and surprise me with a tanned, weatherbeaten desert face over 50. How do they do that?

Portland's really nice. All that shit that's fodder for Portlandia actually makes it a nice place to be. If you're going to live in a place that has too much rain and not enough sun, you might as well make life as pleasant as possible. Seriously good vegan food served up with good IPA in cans while people come out of their yoga classes and stand around looking healthily flexible, as if it's normal.

When you go to Chinle, Arizona, hike down into the canyon. But go to Chinle. It's up there with Monument Valley and Mesa Verde.

The first time I came to the States, everybody I met seemed American to me. I've been a few times since. This time, people just seem like people. I'm more familiar with the place, I guess. But not Las Vegas. They had that beautiful stretch of desert on their hands, and they dropped that piece of insanity smack dab in the middle of it. What a clown act.

But the southwest is one of the most beautiful parts of the planet. I could roam around this place again and again. You guys are so lucky.
 
Next time you swing around Cortez give yourself a day or two to do the loop up through Rico to telluride and Ouray. Stay in Ouray and enjoy a frosty brew or 10 there; they've got a great microbrewery there and the scenery is worth it. Head out of Ouray the next day towards Silverton and back down to Durango. You go over one really substantial mountain pass and then 2 others that aren't as high but still offer some extremely impressive views.

Or, if you don't have that kind of time, go east on 160 from Cortez to Mancos and take 184 north from there. The first access road to San Juan national forest will take you to the Sharkstooth peak trailhead. Put that on your bucket list. Takes about 1.5 hours to make it to the top and you're looking down from around 12,500ft towards Mesa verde and Mancos valley.
 
I've been to Vegas as well, mate. Its a hideous place which appears to be a magnet for hideous people. Had I known what it was like I really wouldn't have bothered. Live and learn I suppose.
 
pikingrin said:
Next time you swing around Cortez give yourself a day or two to do the loop up through Rico to telluride and Ouray. Stay in Ouray and enjoy a frosty brew or 10 there; they've got a great microbrewery there and the scenery is worth it. Head out of Ouray the next day towards Silverton and back down to Durango. You go over one really substantial mountain pass and then 2 others that aren't as high but still offer some extremely impressive views.

Or, if you don't have that kind of time, go east on 160 from Cortez to Mancos and take 184 north from there. The first access road to San Juan national forest will take you to the Sharkstooth peak trailhead. Put that on your bucket list. Takes about 1.5 hours to make it to the top and you're looking down from around 12,500ft towards Mesa verde and Mancos valley.
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That's what I'm talking about! Will do. Thanks very much. :thumbs up::thumbs up:
 
JDOD said:
I've been to Vegas as well, mate. Its a hideous place which appears to be a magnet for hideous people. Had I known what it was like I really wouldn't have bothered. Live and learn I suppose.
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It's designed to appeal to what's lowest and least intelligent in people. I detest that sort of thing. The fountain in front of the Bellagio was spectacular though, and I loved our hotel room in the Luxor. "We stayed in a pyramid!" :laughings:
 
dobro said:
It's designed to appeal to what's lowest and least intelligent in people. I detest that sort of thing. The fountain in front of the Bellagio was spectacular though, and I loved our hotel room in the Luxor. "We stayed in a pyramid!" :laughings:
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When I was there someone actually said to me "Why, would I want to go to Venice or Paris? I can see it right here"

:facepalm:
 
I don't care for Vegas. I love Lake Tahoe though. The southwest is very beautiful I agree. I love the nappa valley too. When visit San Francisco I love the drive across the golden gate and on into wine country. Man, there is really some beautiful scenery there. It's like every bend you go around has a stunning landscape and you want to take a picture.
Every picture you take is a wall hanger too.
:)
The redwood forest is awsome.
That is one of my favorite trips....San Fransisco.
 
jimistone said:
I don't care for Vegas. I love Lake Tahoe though. The southwest is very beautiful I agree. I love the nappa valley too. When visit San Francisco I love the drive across the golden gate and on into wine country. Man, there is really some beautiful scenery there. It's like every bend you go around has a stunning landscape and you want to take a picture.
Every picture you take is a wall hanger too.
:)
The redwood forest is awsome.
That is one of my favorite trips....San Fransisco.
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Yeah, you're right, I really wanna go back there.
 
JDOD said:
When I was there someone actually said to me "Why, would I want to go to Venice or Paris? I can see it right here"

:facepalm:
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You can sort of make a game of it, and 'rate the fake'. Vegas runs on fake. My favorite fake was at the Venetian Hotel, where there was a fake Venetian canal, and a fake gondola containing tourists with no sense of irony or embarrassment, and a local guy paddling them slowly and stupidly back and forth, singing 'Volare' lamely.
 
I didn't really care for Vegas too much either. I'm not much of a gambler, and there aren't really any of those spectacle shows that I care to go see. I couldn't give less of a shit about Cirque Du Soleil or Celeine Dion or whatever. It was fun enough walking the strip, watching people, stopping in to random casinos, plunking a quarter or two into a slot machine long enough to get a free beer, then moving on. I did see fake Kiss, a guy trying to impersonate Bret Micheals, and a guy in very weak drag on Fremont street under the lights. But after a while I went nuts from the sound of dinging slot machines.
 
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