The Need for Speed... err, more plugin power

aaroncomp

aaroncomp

1-20-2009
This question may not have a clear answer, but thought I'd seek opinions. Currently I use Adobe Audition 1.5, and while doing a typical mix, I use a ton of effects. Over time, the number of tracks, and subsequently the number of effects has increased further. Needless to say, my creativity has started to become limited by this. So, one thing I realize I should be looking at is the effects I use and that I should perhaps be using them more wisely and less liberally. And, there's always the search for the more efficient, yet high quality plugin. Another thing that may change this is that I will soon be using Audition 2.0 which employs a much better routing and bus scheme allowing the consolidation of effects.

Okay, so what's my question? If I still seek more processing power, what would you recommend? My current setup is a P4 3.0E (HT 800FSB), 1GB OCZ (2-3-2-5), (2)10k Raptors in RAID0 on my OS/program drive, (3)7200 Storage Drives. It's basically, spend little now and get some boost or wait a bit, spend more and get more boost. Small things I've considered are adding another gig of RAM or rechipping my CPU with, say, a 3.4 - which of these do you think would have the greatest boost factor? Okay, after that I've got the option of a complete overhaul with new mobo, ram and cpu. Finally, there's the helper chips - DPS cards, second computer for effects, etc.

Thanks for any insight.
 
If you are running software synths, they will run a lot smoother with more RAM. Still, softsynths use CPU too!

Otherwise, NO OTHER PLUGINS will benefit from more RAM. So, forget about RAM

If you want to run more plugins, you will need one of a combination of:

1 - CPU power
2 - More efficient plugins
3 - A DSP card like the UAD-1

The UAD-1 will handle a lot of chore, but it is fairly expensive if you want the "cool" plugins.

Good luck.
 
Drumagog uses RAM to store the samples so that they may more quickly be inserted into the audio stream.

Drumagog and softsynths are the two exceptions to more RAM does not equal more plugin power.

Increasing your RAM doesn't even mean you can run more instances of Drumagog, just means that each instance can contain more audio data to use. The CPU hit is going to be the same no matter what.

There was a whole debate in another thread concerning DAWs and RAM. Many seem to believe that plugin and track counts are effected by the amount of RAM you have. I believe that RAM has almost no effect on plugin and track counts.

The other tread had to do with a person who was wondering if he needed to do some upgrades on a laptop before he used it as a simple recording/playback computer for some live recordings. In his case, RAM would benefit him nothing because he was just recording. No mixing, etc...

Anyway, in YOUR case, again, increasing the RAM will NOT net you more plugins. If you are tapping out your cpu, more RAM WILL NOT alleviate that problem. Only a faster CPU will! Or, using more efficient plugins (not a likely option), or adding a PCI card that has it's own plugins and cpu to run them, like the UAD-1 card.

Now, if you don't want to follow my very pratical advice here, please, go ahead and buy some more RAM. But, when you see that it didn't give you more plugins, at least come back and grovel at my feet a little bit and allow me to say "See? I told you so!". ;)
 
Ford Van said:
Drumagog uses RAM to store the samples so that they may more quickly be inserted into the audio stream.

Drumagog and softsynths are the two exceptions to more RAM does not equal more plugin power.

Increasing your RAM doesn't even mean you can run more instances of Drumagog, just means that each instance can contain more audio data to use. The CPU hit is going to be the same no matter what.

There was a whole debate in another thread concerning DAWs and RAM. Many seem to believe that plugin and track counts are effected by the amount of RAM you have. I believe that RAM has almost no effect on plugin and track counts.

The other tread had to do with a person who was wondering if he needed to do some upgrades on a laptop before he used it as a simple recording/playback computer for some live recordings. In his case, RAM would benefit him nothing because he was just recording. No mixing, etc...

Anyway, in YOUR case, again, increasing the RAM will NOT net you more plugins. If you are tapping out your cpu, more RAM WILL NOT alleviate that problem. Only a faster CPU will! Or, using more efficient plugins (not a likely option), or adding a PCI card that has it's own plugins and cpu to run them, like the UAD-1 card.

Now, if you don't want to follow my very pratical advice here, please, go ahead and buy some more RAM. But, when you see that it didn't give you more plugins, at least come back and grovel at my feet a little bit and allow me to say "See? I told you so!". ;)
Click to expand...

Mr. Ford Van,

Not sure why you have taken a somewhat defensive tone in the last paragraph, but I sincerely appreciate your advice. I was merely curious what Drumagog had to do with the processing of effects. From your response, I see that the mention of Drumagog by Bulls Hit was directed to your statement concerning RAM and CPU, rather than giving an answer to my original question. The UAD-1 is looking more appealing to me, especially with the new Neve plugins coming.

After observing my CPU and RAM usage while adding an increasing number of effects, your statements hold true. The RAM remains nearly fixed, while CPU use increases further and further - odd thing (imo, anyway) happens: I start getting pops/clicks/whatever when my CPU use gets to about 60-65% - seems too soon?
 
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my experience suggests that the more plug-ins you use, the more cpu you need.

my way around working with whatever cpu you have is to use plug-ins with discretion. for example, wherever possible, i batch process the waves so that i am not running the plug in in real time. If I know what EQ, compression, noise gates or other effect I want, then I batch process this. Other effects (for example, reverb, delay) I find I need to have in real time because it is more difficult to predict exactly how much you will need.
 
aaroncomp said:
This question may not have a clear answer, but thought I'd seek opinions. Currently I use Adobe Audition 1.5, and while doing a typical mix, I use a ton of effects. Over time, the number of tracks, and subsequently the number of effects has increased further. Needless to say, my creativity has started to become limited by this. So, one thing I realize I should be looking at is the effects I use and that I should perhaps be using them more wisely and less liberally. And, there's always the search for the more efficient, yet high quality plugin. Another thing that may change this is that I will soon be using Audition 2.0 which employs a much better routing and bus scheme allowing the consolidation of effects.

Okay, so what's my question? If I still seek more processing power, what would you recommend? My current setup is a P4 3.0E (HT 800FSB), 1GB OCZ (2-3-2-5), (2)10k Raptors in RAID0 on my OS/program drive, (3)7200 Storage Drives. It's basically, spend little now and get some boost or wait a bit, spend more and get more boost. Small things I've considered are adding another gig of RAM or rechipping my CPU with, say, a 3.4 - which of these do you think would have the greatest boost factor? Okay, after that I've got the option of a complete overhaul with new mobo, ram and cpu. Finally, there's the helper chips - DPS cards, second computer for effects, etc.

Thanks for any insight.
Click to expand...

Dude you have an easy solution that will cost you no money.
Just use the "lock" feature in Audition. Look it up in the manual/help:
Free's up the CPU so more effects/plugins can be used.
I can work with alot of CPU heavy plugins this way!
 
Ford Van said:
There was a whole debate in another thread concerning DAWs and RAM. Many seem to believe that plugin and track counts are effected by the amount of RAM you have. I believe that RAM has almost no effect on plugin and track counts.
Click to expand...

I've found the same, with possibly one exception. If your ram is not "configured" for optimum performance with your mobo, it may act as a bottle neck in general for the performance of your computer. When i upgraded my ram, I did get more plug-in counts (i know because i tested before and after with the same plugins/programs/source material)...acording to the mobo manual, certain configuration of ram were more 'efficient' or something to that nature. Interesting thing is that beyond that, when i added more ram again, i got no more processing benifit.
 
teainthesahara said:
Dude you have an easy solution that will cost you no money.
Just use the "lock" feature in Audition. Look it up in the manual/help:
Free's up the CPU so more effects/plugins can be used.
I can work with alot of CPU heavy plugins this way!
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know all about the Lock feature. It's just a little cumbersome when you want to make changes and takes a bit longer to load at startup, but yeah, it does get the job done.
 
Another thing that might take a little of the strain off the CPU would be to increase the buffer size of your interface. (Someone PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong here!) It seemed that I had a similar problem... Loads of tracks, loads of plugins, and clicks and pops... Then I increased the buffer a little, and all that stopped. It's worth a try... :o
 
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