Second song for my first album (radio ready?) - Please critique - Alt. Rock

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dreamsound2

New member
What's up!! Finally done with the second song for my album.

This one was both an experiment and a learning experience... trying to push the envelope. I spent more time that I care to admit tweaking all the instruments to blend well before the mix. A lot of hard work. Everything recorded at home except the drums that were done at a studio in NY. Hopefully you guys can give me some feedback... is it radio ready?

You can find it as an attachment here and you can also find it along with some other songs I'm working on at http://www.myspace.com/coloredfusion

Thanks!
 

Attachments

  • GROW UP (FINAL MP3).mp3
    8.1 MB · Views: 75
Sounds real tight, the 5 string bass is really cool, good mix, sounds pro. I thought the guitars were just a bit wet with verb, echo, The vocal could be just a hair brighter (or something is stepping on the hi frequencies) Just my opinion, its good as it is too. Thanks for posting.
 
Beautiful.....great songwriting and performance.
Yeah, voice could use a little clarity but maybe that's what you were going for. Great work!

Joey :)
 
I thought the musicianship was real good. I thought things generally sounded very good.

Didn't care for the lo-fi repeat of the ends of certain lines. It's been over done.

It's squished about to pro standards. It takes what was probably a very good mix and makes listening to it fatiguing. It's distorting in spots from the limiting.

Other than that it was real good.
 
Thanks a lot for all the comments. They are very helpful so I know what works and what doesn't in order to do better on my next song.

TripleM, I wanted a lot of power/punch on this song trying to capture the energy of this song played live... like if it was done at a big venue. In order to balance the 'fatigue,' the song following this one on the album is a slow chill stoner type of ballad :D
 
Coming from an "untrained ear", I thought it sounded great and radio ready, IMO. Only trained engineers or people doing this for quite some time could probably pick up the nuances like PDP, Joey and Triple did. I guess what matters in the end is how you feel about it because we don't know what sound you're really after.

For the average person/listener, they probably won't even notice. I like it... something I should aspire to achieve myself.
 
Thanks Vunyos.. I try to vary my style a lot, this song is as 'punk' as I'd ever get (not saying is punk at all but don't know how else to describe it) and I like to change the style of music a bit on each song and experiment. What do you listen to? Some of the songs are more Tool'ish (progressive), some more Nirvana (grunge), and some like the one I'm working on now more soul/rnb (believe it or not). I grew up listening to all kinds of music.

mgj, I think the vocals worked out better with a little lo-fi in the mix rather than with more crispness. This is 100% due that I have an M-Audio Sputnik and it has that vibe. If I had a better microphone I would naturally get more crispness out and I will eventually get one! :)
 
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It sounds real good dude. I don't listen to music like this, but I can see myself turning on the radio and hearing this. Of course after a few seconds I would be changing the station, but hey sounds good lol. ;)

Around 2:36 there is a 2 voice harmony that sounds off key. I made it this far, but I'm going to a party. So, I gotta run! :drunk:
 
well, the 1st thing i noticed, was the flubbed lick right at 00:06.
i might of edited that one!

sounds like the drums were captured nicely, but they're all the same volume.
flat, in a way.....
there's no real dynamics to them. they sound compressed all to one volume.
dig the guitar tones, bass has a nice grind on it, but seems a bit low in the overall mix.

dig the vocal performance, and the harmonies.

the song itself, is very formulaic...
like, i can tell where every chord change is going before it happens, same with the vocal melody.
it sounds remiscent, of about 50% of the tunes i currently hear on the hard rock stations, if that's what you're shooting for, then you're right in the middle of all that, but with nothing to really distance yourself from any of the other bands like this.

i don't mind the level of production, it's a solid effort, but nothing about this sounds 'live'. it's very produced.
so much so in fact, it comes off a bit flat, there are no real dynamics in any of this, it's all one volume.
even the quiet part comes down to almost the same peak volume.

it's a solid song, tho, and a solid mix.
maybe re-think the mastering?
 
TripleM said:
I thought the musicianship was real good. I thought things generally sounded very good.

Didn't care for the lo-fi repeat of the ends of certain lines. It's been over done.

It's squished about to pro standards. It takes what was probably a very good mix and makes listening to it fatiguing. It's distorting in spots from the limiting.

Other than that it was real good.
Click to expand...

+

~ you might consider replacing the echo line with an actual background vocal - I think that would add a lot more depth than the low pass delay. The vocal could be filtered the same - but the delay is too linkin park or something

One more thing I think would really add some impact is to build a little more tension in the climax of the song - if you listed to a sample around 0.30 then around 1:00 there is a definite difference, jump to the end around 3:00 and there is no difference in the dynamics - 0:56 and 3:05 are essentially interchangeable as far as the emotional/dynamic/intensity range. This is just a personal taste issue, but since the song seems to build in intensity from 0:30 to 1:00 it would seem natural that the intensity climaxed at the end of the song.

I don't really know what to suggest as far as achieving that - maybe some additional vocal tracks that kicked it in a bit or a bridge that shifted tempo or something...

It's a good song - it's well done and well mixed.

$0.02 FWIW
 
arcadeko said:
+

~ you might consider replacing the echo line with an actual background vocal - I think that would add a lot more depth than the low pass delay. The vocal could be filtered the same - but the delay is too linkin park or something

One more thing I think would really add some impact is to build a little more tension in the climax of the song - if you listed to a sample around 0.30 then around 1:00 there is a definite difference, jump to the end around 3:00 and there is no difference in the dynamics - 0:56 and 3:05 are essentially interchangeable as far as the emotional/dynamic/intensity range. This is just a personal taste issue, but since the song seems to build in intensity from 0:30 to 1:00 it would seem natural that the intensity climaxed at the end of the song.

I don't really know what to suggest as far as achieving that - maybe some additional vocal tracks that kicked it in a bit or a bridge that shifted tempo or something...

It's a good song - it's well done and well mixed.

$0.02 FWIW
Click to expand...

That's a good point. When I was playing this song live I wanted the song to climax at around 2:18 but then I couldn't think of any way to bring the tone down on the bridge...

I do agree it lacks dynamics but the songs itself live at least is pretty fast all the way. My other song 'Bye Bye' has more dynamics and I would like to go back to that on the next one I'm working on right now.

I like Linkin Park! :D

I'm 2 cents richer, thank you.
 
GONZO-X said:
well, the 1st thing i noticed, was the flubbed lick right at 00:06.
i might of edited that one!

sounds like the drums were captured nicely, but they're all the same volume.
flat, in a way.....
there's no real dynamics to them. they sound compressed all to one volume.
dig the guitar tones, bass has a nice grind on it, but seems a bit low in the overall mix.

dig the vocal performance, and the harmonies.

the song itself, is very formulaic...
like, i can tell where every chord change is going before it happens, same with the vocal melody.
it sounds remiscent, of about 50% of the tunes i currently hear on the hard rock stations, if that's what you're shooting for, then you're right in the middle of all that, but with nothing to really distance yourself from any of the other bands like this.

i don't mind the level of production, it's a solid effort, but nothing about this sounds 'live'. it's very produced.
so much so in fact, it comes off a bit flat, there are no real dynamics in any of this, it's all one volume.
even the quiet part comes down to almost the same peak volume.

it's a solid song, tho, and a solid mix.
maybe re-think the mastering?
Click to expand...

Like I was saying before I agree the whole song is like a bomb and it could use more dynamics. I do want to distance myself from other bands and I also agree it has that 'sound'. Can't really find the bobo at 0:06, that was a guitar slide and I don't hear anything wrong.

I can't do anything at this point since it has been mastered already but it certainly helps when working on other material. Thank you.
 
dreamsound2 said:
I like Linkin Park! :D
Click to expand...

So do I :) - by "too" linkin park I meant it sounded too similar - hell, there might not even be a linkin park song that does that but it made me think if it for some reason.

I really think putting in a backing vocal repeating the line instead of an echo would add some real richness to it and make it a real nice "plus" where right now I don't think it adds much (might even take away some).

Now you got four cents!

Keep up the good work - I'll look for Bye Bye ;)
 
The recording is nice...I'll ditto the other comments about squish n' stuff.

But the arrangement has some weaknesses....ambiguous progression...indefinite bass movement [the notes below E on the 5 stringer don't sound so clear moving scale-wise...weak rootage...much stronger and defined moving in 4ths and 5ths]. I gave one listen, and didn't pinpoint the prollum..but there's a melody note that don't jive with the progression in a place or two, I think. And the V chord doesn't sound the minor or major third comng into the chorus [IIRC]. The tune's kind of a harmonic minor thing, and the ear expects to hear the leading tone...natural 7 of the scale...for the V7 Or , otherwise, defined as a V-7 chord. Hit me like a hot babe who smiles a moment..and shows a missing front tooth.

So, I think your recording is close to radio ready sound-wise; but it needs the touch of an experienced arranger/producer to get up to competing, musically, with what's on the stations that play this stuff. The bar is very high. Those producers spend large sums for whipsaw-ears-guys to smoothe wrinkles and add musical oomph....the George Martin thing.

Sound is important...but there's that whole nuther set of skills to master and knowledge to acquire. There are things that may be done to a tune like this to make it special. Y' gotta try to get a handle on some of them, I think: listen to the best, and analyze the musical goings-on in the parts that move you. Catalog them. Add to your repertoire as you would on an instrument.

MHOFWIIW

Not too shabby, though. Enough natural talent here for an 'ear guy' and wealthy producer to mold into a potential hit-making unit. You're better than, say, Green Day, in their infancy. I can hear where you want to go. I can also hear something's missing: effective arrangement ideas and structural strength.
 
jeffmaher said:
indefinite bass movement [the notes below E on the 5 stringer don't sound so clear moving scale-wise...weak rootage...much stronger and defined moving in 4ths and 5ths].
Click to expand...

I dont hear the problem in the bass, but I agree with the comments on the chords and melody, a few spots a producer would work to improve.
 
jeffmaher said:
Sound is important...but there's that whole nuther set of skills to master and knowledge to acquire
Click to expand...

Because this is a recording forum, this doesnt come up alot, but I couldnt agree more. 99.9% of musicians would be amazed at the intensity of some producers. Not saying this to worship, but some have truly musical genius ability.
 
jeffmaher said:
The recording is nice...I'll ditto the other comments about squish n' stuff.

But the arrangement has some weaknesses....ambiguous progression...indefinite bass movement [the notes below E on the 5 stringer don't sound so clear moving scale-wise...weak rootage...much stronger and defined moving in 4ths and 5ths]. I gave one listen, and didn't pinpoint the prollum..but there's a melody note that don't jive with the progression in a place or two, I think. And the V chord doesn't sound the minor or major third comng into the chorus [IIRC]. The tune's kind of a harmonic minor thing, and the ear expects to hear the leading tone...natural 7 of the scale...for the V7 Or , otherwise, defined as a V-7 chord. Hit me like a hot babe who smiles a moment..and shows a missing front tooth.

So, I think your recording is close to radio ready sound-wise; but it needs the touch of an experienced arranger/producer to get up to competing, musically, with what's on the stations that play this stuff. The bar is very high. Those producers spend large sums for whipsaw-ears-guys to smoothe wrinkles and add musical oomph....the George Martin thing.

Sound is important...but there's that whole nuther set of skills to master and knowledge to acquire. There are things that may be done to a tune like this to make it special. Y' gotta try to get a handle on some of them, I think: listen to the best, and analyze the musical goings-on in the parts that move you. Catalog them. Add to your repertoire as you would on an instrument.

MHOFWIIW

Not too shabby, though. Enough natural talent here for an 'ear guy' and wealthy producer to mold into a potential hit-making unit. You're better than, say, Green Day, in their infancy. I can hear where you want to go. I can also hear something's missing: effective arrangement ideas and structural strength.
Click to expand...


Thanks. I definitely agree that I need help from a producer to be competitive and take it to the next level. There are a lot of finer details that I can work on right now but it would take me years to do this myself rather than with someone else's help. I want to spend another year practicing and record the best songs I can at home so I can then start putting it out there for both bands and producers.

I do want to sound radio friendly but I don't want to sound like everyone else (I've seen so many talented singers fall into that!) and I'm certainly working on developing a unique more signature type of sound on this next tune I will present to you guys in a few weeks.

I still like the Breaking Benjamin type of mix, however I want for it to be more dynamic like you all suggested.

Sorry if I'm repeating myself here, I guess I'm thinking outloud yo' :o
 
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