Response to my Last Newsletter Editorial (23rd June issue)

Lt. Bob said:
and again, I didn't say that people with no talent who suck are just as likely to make it as those that have talent and work hard (with some exceptions) ... obviously you have to have some ability to play and sing or whatever you do ...... what I HAVE said is that working hard and having talent isn't much of a factor in making it since there is a vast overabundance of both. It's luck .... pure and simple.
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:D

And I never said that you said it.....but it has been said indirectly (and even directly) in this thread quite a bit and it has woven itself into the discussion.
In the end of your post...you kinda say it too, "It's luck...pure and simple", which implies the other two are not needed.

You raised the point about people with talent working hard and never making it.
OK, I agreed, there are many who go through that...but that point doesn't in any way prove that it's *mostly luck* for those who DO make it, and that talent and hard work wasn't much of a "factor" at all.

I don't see too many artists who fall into that category of making it on pure luck.
We often judge someone's talent based on our own likes/dislikes, so sometimes it's easy to say "He sucks, he must have gotten really lucky to make it like that."....but I think 9 out of 10 times, those people do have talent and they did work hard before their lucky break happened. It was the talent and hard work that set them up for the lucky break.

Anyway...we are each going to believe in whatever works for us, and that's OK.
I certainly don't write/record only with the goal of selling some of my music. I also do it for personal pleasure.
However, I would begin to feel quite apathetic about it all if I thought that no matter how much effort I put in, it would be of little significance, and I would be better off just buying lottery tickets.
I know some people here feel that way...and again, it's their thing...but I do have a goal to get some of my music sold one day.
At this point, I've only put in about 40% effort into the "selling" part, as I've been mostly focusing on the writing/recording and building my studio. I may never sell a single song, but I'm confident that when I do put in 100% toward the selling part...my odds will be much better at getting a "lucky break" than if I just keep it at the 40% level and "wait for luck to find me".


YMMV.......
 
I don't have anything to say :( I've only been doing this life thing for 18 years. Maybe in a few years ill have something cynical to add :D

"Making it" is kind of strange. My old bass players cousin won this American idol type show on mtv a few years ago. The end. She had made it. For 15 minutes. But then that was it. On the flipside I know plenty of semi popular international musicians that might not have mainstream tabloid popularity but are doing fine and have been doing so for years.
Record deals are the problem. Those define making it but don't really mean anything. I cyber know a guitarist in a band that signed to road runner a few years and they hate it now and are looking for a way out. Record deals effectively neuter careers nowdays.
 
kidkage said:
I don't have anything to say :( I've only been doing this life thing for 18 years. Maybe in a few years ill have something cynical to add :D

"Making it" is kind of strange. My old bass players cousin won this American idol type show on mtv a few years ago. The end. She had made it. For 15 minutes. But then that was it. On the flipside I know plenty of semi popular international musicians that might not have mainstream tabloid popularity but are doing fine and have been doing so for years.
Record deals are the problem. Those define making it but don't really mean anything. I cyber know a guitarist in a band that signed to road runner a few years and they hate it now and are looking for a way out. Record deals effectively neuter careers nowdays.
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I sometimes think the perfect world is to make some kind of steady income off music without the fame thing, is the best idea...sometimes i watch these shows and think surely there would be somewhere for you to fit in as an artist without the kiss of death of playing on whats basically a huge televised interview process...there again im sure many have tried for years and got nowhere

Gone are the days that one good record will set you up for life, ive mentioned before that i know a guy who lived off the royalties of one 1987 singles pretty comfortably, but modestly...last time we met around 7 years ago he still wasnt working...dunno if thats a good thing if fame is what you starve, he never did.
 
kcearl said:
I sometimes think the perfect world is to make some kind of steady income off music without the fame thing, is the best idea...sometimes i watch these shows and think surely there would be somewhere for you to fit in as an artist without the kiss of death of playing on whats basically a huge televised interview process...there again im sure many have tried for years and got nowhere

Gone are the days that one good record will set you up for life, ive mentioned before that i know a guy who lived off the royalties of one 1987 singles pretty comfortably, but modestly...last time we met around 7 years ago he still wasnt working...dunno if thats a good thing if fame is what you starve, he never did.
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Songwriting. That's where its at. Sit at home in your underwear and write songs for other people. Let them do all the hard work and you get paid. Like that guy that writes with elton john. I don't even know his name I'm sure he's rich as shit.
 
Greg_L said:
Songwriting. That's where its at. Sit at home in your underwear and write songs for other people. Let them do all the hard work and you get paid. Like that guy that writes with elton john. I don't even know his name I'm sure he's rich as shit.
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Yup

Much easier than facing the public...and when the artist wanes just sell your shit to someone else

Its amazing how much some artists fame relys on their partnership with a certain song writer...

Though i was reading how people like David Guetta (eurocrap electro that seems to be everywhere) doesnt even produce his own music, he has a team back in paris....kinda like when P Diddy would walk in the studio and hum a tune for others to figure out....now thats the gig im looking for....humming, i can hum like a mofo lol
 
kcearl said:
Yup

Much easier than facing the public...and when the artist wanes just sell your shit to someone else

Its amazing how much some artists fame relys on their partnership with a certain song writer...

Though i was reading how people like David Guetta (eurocrap electro that seems to be everywhere) doesnt even produce his own music, he has a team back in paris....kinda like when P Diddy would walk in the studio and hum a tune for others to figure out....now thats the gig im looking for....humming, i can hum like a mofo lol
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That would be nice. I need to learn how to write mindless pop songs for pretty people instead of mindless punk songs for myself. I could be rich! :D
 
Greg_L said:
That would be nice. I need to learn how to write mindless pop songs for pretty people...
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It's not that hard...getting them sold into the right hands is the hard part.

I got no bones about writing songs that could potentially sell...if I could just get them in the right hands (aka "my lucky break"). :)

I grew up listening to AM radio, all that Motown/British Invasion/American West Coast Pop.
Yeah...it's "mindless"...but then, more mindless than what...?...Hendrix doing "Purple Haze" or the Zep doing "Dancing Days" or Nirvana doing "Smells Like Teen Spirit"...or any of a thousand other songs that have come out in the last 50-60 years during the modern "Rock" era.
I mean...what is "lofty" Rock music? :D
The Metalhead stuff...?....Progressive Rock...?...the Floyd kind of head music...?
Most of it is mindless, but also fun and entertaining to large groups of people.

If there is a buying, interested public...it's all good music, just different.
Heck...we can't all do Jazz or some other kind of avant-garde music. Tell the truth, Jazz bores me most of the time.
I like 3-chord Pop/Rock music, and that's what I mostly write/record with the intention of one day selling.

But you can still do other music too. That's the nice thing about being a songwriter.
You can do whatever you want. You can do cheesy love ballads and also intense instrumental "head music" for your own consumption or for a more niche audience.
I agree...songwriting is a much more lucrative and less manipulative world to be in.
When you are an "artist"...a "performer"...you have to stay true to your "image", and that is often manipulated by the music business. That's the price of being IN the limelight.
Songwriters mostly kick back on the sidelines and quietly get their 50% (or whatever deal they have).

You want to play out still...you can also do that locally and get your fill of the live thing, and without the pressure of making it as an artist. Just write songs that sell...and jam out the rest of the time.
 
kcearl said:
send the lyrics without music and say theyre pop lol
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I'd like to hear Katy Perry sing "Vaginasaurus Rex" or "Transsexual Mutant Monster Beach Party On Mars". Well I wouldn't really like to hear it, but seeing her isn't a bad thing.
 
Greg_L said:
I'd like to hear Katy Perry sing "Vaginasaurus Rex" or "Transsexual Mutant Monster Beach Party On Mars". Well I wouldn't really like to hear it, but seeing her isn't a bad thing.
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I was about suggest Nikki Minaj for the latter. Maybe Lady Gaga, even.
 
You've got it totally right, Greg. I'm a 40+ year original music veteran in Hawaii where the pay has always sucke.....unless you had some hits on local radio. Beginning in the 70s and peaking in the 80s and slowly trending down since then, if you got good airplay, then your records made money and one could charge $7,000 to $8,000 a gig. But now? The money's way down and there are, as you said, more entertainers than there are venues. Even regional "name" performers are having a hard time paying the bills.

When I got out of school I had a career decision to make; follow my love of music and make it support me or get a career job and do music after hours. I did the latter because I knew the odds for "making it" really big even in the 70s where way against me and I didn't want to end up an old man having to play in smoke-filled bars just to pay the bills and be on public assistance. I also realized that you had to start a career in your 20s to have a decent retirement. So, I had my career job which left me evenings and weekends to do music. For me, as opposed to many of the guys I played with, music was all joy and art; whereas for my contemporaries it was a job. And today, I still get chills when I hear my music on the radio. I also get checks from BMI which, because my finances are sound, I can blow on music!

So one can have both a career job and follow their dream.
 
Pakala said:
When I got out of school I had a career decision to make; follow my love of music and make it support me or get a career job and do music after hours. I did the latter because I knew the odds for "making it" really big even in the 70s where way against me and I didn't want to end up an old man having to play in smoke-filled bars just to pay the bills and be on public assistance. I also realized that you had to start a career in your 20s to have a decent retirement. So, I had my career job which left me evenings and weekends to do music. For me, as opposed to many of the guys I played with, music was all joy and art; whereas for my contemporaries it was a job. And today, I still get chills when I hear my music on the radio. I also get checks from BMI which, because my finances are sound, I can blow on music!

So one can have both a career job and follow their dream.
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Agreed.
I too moved away from the gig-driven music pursuits back in my late 20s and decided to get a more secure career for my income, and then I would be free to do when/whatever I wanted with music.
For me it's been the whole studio/recording thing...and honestly, if I didn't have the solid day job, I would not have been able to build out my studio to the same degree.
There are job opportunities for gig-driven musicians without a doubt...but it's often a grind even at the better club/event circuits, never mind the local bar/club level.

So your royalty checks...are they from songwriting/publishing or from just record sales/radio plays?

There's an article in the July issue of Mix magazine about Claude Kelly...but who the the heck is Claude Kelly...???
I certainly never heard of him, but he is apparently a major songwriter and has written hits for Bruno Mars, Kelly Clarkson, Miley Cyrus, Britney Speers...etc...and regardless of the music styles (though he says he tries to write in various styles, not just one)...the point is that the guys is making big $$$.
Songwriting can be very lucrative...IF you can find a way in with some publisher or record company or artist. If just one of your songs does well for a bigger artists...they will be back for more.
Of course, it's not easy breaking into that either...
 
miroslav said:
Agreed.

So your royalty checks...are they from songwriting/publishing or from just record sales/radio plays?
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My checks are performance royalties collected by BMI for airplay. the albums that my songs appeared on were mostly in the 70s & 80s and no longer sell to any material degree. I wrote one of those "golden oldies" of contemporary Hawaiian music that keeps getting radio play. It also keeps getting covered, the most recent time by the Kingston Trio. It's a song called "Cheri" but other of my songs have been covered or used in commercials which every now and then means I get a meaningful check. But it's really play money as it's is not consistent. Occasionally it can be over a thousand dollars. So for me it's all about continued air play (performance) royalties. This is including more and more Internet radio and streaming like Pandora.
 
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