Recording Drums - Drummers?

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fuquam

New member
So my set up is 57 on the snare, 52 on the bass, two Oktava 219s as overheads. I think the sound is sweet but my drummer has been complaining that he can't hear his toms enough during rolls. We tried moving the mics higher, lower, closers, angled. Anyone have advice and please don't say mic the toms individually?
Thanks.
 
Are the toms muffled?
If they are, maybe they are not projecting well.
Also, it can be a tuning issue.
If tuned too low, tone and projection are compromised.
Cheers!
 
I'm not being facetious when I say he might need to just hit them harder. I've seen many a drummer who can whack the kick and snare, but totally wimp out on the toms.
 
I agree with MadAudio.

I've learned to adjust my playing to "feed' the mics. Often during recording, drummers really needs to back off the attack on the cymbals, but lay heavy into the toms.

It's also the nature of tone and the human ear - brighter sounds are easier to hear, toms are more low-end and can easily get lost in the mix.

One thing you can try is to move the overheads back -- kind of like above the drummers head, facing straight down at the toms. It could help a bit.

Good luck, Rez
 
You have two choices only. Tight mic the toms or have him hit the toms harder. It's that simple.
 
The mics are postioned in a Y formation at about 6 ft off the ground over the drummer's head. I should take a photo to show if I ever post something like this again. Thanks for all the comments. Any EQing advice?
 
Instead of close-miking your snare with the sm57, you could put it on a stand in front of the set to capture the snare AND toms. Before I had individual mics, when my living room was doubling as a studio, I only had an sm57 draped over the back of the couch, in front of the set, a condenser room mic, and a couple of PZMs as OHs, and I gotta tell you, the sm57 really did a great job at picking up the snare, toms, AND kick! I didn't even have an individual kick mic at that time! if you experiment with placement, you and your drummer should find something you like. Just a thought. For some great tips on eq (and a wealth of other recording info too), try this site: www.saecollege.de/reference_material
 
fuquam said:
The mics are postioned in a Y formation at about 6 ft off the ground over the drummer's head. I should take a photo to show if I ever post something like this again. Thanks for all the comments. Any EQing advice?
Click to expand...

Y- In the future, you might want to try x/y just as a comparison.

EQ- Do you have a multiband compressor? Try compressing the lows and mids but leave the highs alone. Then I would start rolling off a bit of EQ from like 1K and up. What I'm trying to suggest is to back off the highs a bit and maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to "pick out" the toms better.

Usually though, unless the song calls for it, I wouldn't sacrifice an otherwise good sounding track just to save a couple of tom fills here and there.

Just my humble op...
 
I might be repeating what was laready said, but I really think that if the drums sound good at the source and the drummer HITS them, the only other thing can be the mic placement. You should be able to hear everything pretty evenly before eq-ing and/or compression.

Then, you tweak it.
 
Try an XY, AB or ORTF pair from a single stand behind the drummer. This way you can keep the mics pointed roughtly between the toms and the cymbals, and they will still be far away enough from the cymbals to not make them wash over everything.
 
It can only be three things:
1. the mics are too close to the cymbals, so you have to turn them down.
2. the drummer has really loud cymbals and quiet toms.
3. the drummer beats the crap out of the cymbals, while lightly tapping on the toms.

3 is an over-exageration, but if you are trying to mic the drums as a kit, the drummer has to play with the appropriate dynamics. If you can't hear everything he is playing in the overheads, your placement is way off (which it doesn't seem like it is) or his playing is weak in the toms.
 
I raised the overheads back up last night and we tracked some more. I told him that most people said he's a pussy and needs to hit the toms harder. I think that worked. I liked to compressor idea. I do have a dual channel compressor that I'm not currently using during the recording process. Might be worth a try. I try to record everything clean with maybe a touch of EQ through the board. The Oktava 219s I'm using as overheads are known for a slightly "glassy" sound so that might have something to do with it. Thanks for all the advice. It was a good lesson.
 
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