Recording a soprano

philboyd studge

philboyd studge

New member
Yesterday I field recorded arias from an excellent soprano and since it's not something I usually do, I've got a few questions and observations.

First, she's really loud, loud to the point that I thought the C-1 was falling apart and breaking up in the headphones. Same thing later as I mixed through monitors.

I also used an 012 as a sort of backup to the C-1 but ended up making a stereo mix with the two mics. I gradually brought them closer to a distance of about 3 feet. Almost no gain on the pres and I left lots of headroom for the peaks but still used a little compression just in case.

Anyway, the finalized CD is fine yet everything along the way made me think it was all junk. What's up? Do I need new gear or what?
 
i run into this recording my own stuff-i'm a tenor, or perhaps even a high baritone, but when i crank the high notes, everything goes batty. it's really hard to control, but i don't want to censor myself for ease of recording-i just want to do it right. i'd love info as well.
 
Just a thought:

Most condenser microphones seem to have a peak in the high end. Supposedly it gives the mike that sought after "sparkle".

If your recording a soprano, thats already high, then the condensor is over compensating for the high end.

Maybe try a dynamic mike, like a Shure SM7 or perhaps a Sennheiser MD441.
A dynamic should help out with the "loudness" too.
 
Sopranos are very difficult to record. I don't know much about what you can do other than try a mic not as hot as the C-1. A ribbon micrpophone could be prefect for this job. Soprano's can EVEN make mics condenser mic overload when they are like 15 - 20 feet away. No joke! She needs to also excercise good mic techique if possible. Also maybe you could try recording her off axis. I would probably seriously consider using the -10db if I could too before the preamp. Maybe even another -10db if I had to, like the XLR kind.

Beez
 
I believe it's common practice to record arias from a distance. A soprano friend who performs both opera and Broadway uses distance miking for the arias and oratorios, pop-style miking for the rest. The "legitimate" music is always recorded live with the accompaniment as well, usually piano.

The MC-012 would be a good choice - a pair if you're recording live piano with it. If you really like your room sound, a pair ECM-8000s could serve well, too.

For pop-style miking, I've gotten very good results with a BLUE Baby Bottle, and with an Oktava MK-319, but the soprano involved was singing more in an alto range.

Jay
 
Thanks guys.

If I record at the instructor's house again I'd like to make a few changes. First, the piano (a decent Stienway) was undifined, so it'll have to be open so I can get to the soundboard with the mics. Also, I was getting a little breating from the pianist and pedal action. Next, move the singer a little further away from the piano, as far away as the singer can remain comfortable with it.

As for which mics to use (I don't have all that many), I'll probably try the 012's as a pair and see how sd condensers perform.

I think some of the breaking up I was getting was in the headphones. Due to the high volume of her voice I had them cranked nearly all the way just hear anything through them, then ended up running at normal levels and thus using the headphones as earplugs.

The most amazing thing to me is the way the waveform of her vocal looked on Sound Forge when strecthed way out. I mean the waves were absoulutely symetrical, something I've never seen before.
 
for any type of classical recording, you truly need a neutral, flat response mic. typically, as mentioned above, you would mic a classical vocalist from several feet out if you have a nice space. i have used tons of SD mics, and i have never yet found any inexpensive mics that can handle this job - even the little neumann km184s are a bit too hyped to yeild an acceptably smooth upper register on a powerful singer. i would recommend something like a schoeps cmc6/mk4 or mk21 at about 6 feet.
 
jnorman said:
for any type of classical recording, you truly need a neutral, flat response mic. typically, as mentioned above, you would mic a classical vocalist from several feet out if you have a nice space. i have used tons of SD mics, and i have never yet found any inexpensive mics that can handle this job - even the little neumann km184s are a bit too hyped to yeild an acceptably smooth upper register on a powerful singer. i would recommend something like a schoeps cmc6/mk4 or mk21 at about 6 feet.
Click to expand...

That would be nice but I have to use what I already own.

The C-1 was ok. I've got two C-1's, two 012's, a 219, and an EV BK-1, and a C1000s.

I started about 8' away and moved up to 6' because I was getting too much piano. I couldn't isolate the two because of the interaction.

The last three arias were done with the C-1 15 degrees off axis and I like those vocals a bit better.
 
Id be as incomspicuous as possible here. Because If you are caught wearing a wire arround Tony Soprano, you will be sleeping with the fishes....Capeash.:eek:
 
darrin_h2000 said:
Id be as incomspicuous as possible here. Because If you are caught wearing a wire arround Tony Soprano, you will be sleeping with the fishes....Capeash.:eek:
Click to expand...

It was a black girl, I, I, I thought I was safe.
 
Geez guys, all these comments and only Beezoboy is the only one to slightly mention it...

A very loud vocal source, a condenser mic with a 14mV/Pa Sensitivity, and a preamp set with heardly any gain... Sounds to me like a classic case of preamp input overload!

Not saying that is the problem, but all the signs are there... And more than likely than overloading the mic with more than a whopping 142dB SPL with the pad in or even 132dB SPL with it out!!!

Try this little guy:
http://www.shure.com/accessories/a15as.asp?PN=Problem Solvers
 
philboyd - i dont know exactly what kinds of work you normally do, and if you mostly do pop/rock recording you do need a variety of mics like you have, but if you are going to concentrate on classical or chamber music, or any kind of live acoustic recording, the mics you have will continue to give you problems. i do pretty much nothing except chamber music in both studio and live settings. over the past few years, i have owned pairs of tlm103s, rode NTKs, SP-C1s, AT4033s, AT4041s, royer r-121s, akg c391b's, rode NT5s, gefell M300s, and 3 pairs of km184s, and frankly, i could not do the job right even with that arsenal. i finally sold every mic i owned and bought a single pair of schoeps cmc6/mk4's. i wish i had just done that to begin with 10 years ago. these mics will literally do anything (piano, pedal harp, trumpet, bass viol, flute, acoustic guitar, and yes, vocals) better than any mics i have ever owned. if you truly want to do justice to a trained classical musician and/or the sound of a $50,000 violin or piano in a million dollar hall, you have to have some pretty good tools in your kit. IMHO, getting to record classical music just cant be beat - it just seems like the most pure expression of musical beauty. best of luck.
 
jnorman,

When I'm not recording myself, the recording for hire projects I do are usually unprofessional country club singers and a good piano player, sometimes bass. Thats where the money is. A pair of schoeps cmc6/mk4's would do nicely but I just don't have the money, and as a full time musician, probably never will.

Though I've really enjoyed the four or five projects I've done recording classical music and the sometimes amazing degree of talent, the clients have been to a person demanding, rude and cheap. Still, I'm looking foreward to more such projects. I love the dynamics of classical music.

Looking back, it appears my fears of things being overdriven were all in the headphones (AKG 240's) when recording. They were really cranked.
 
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