Re-Writing

M

mikeh

New member
A lesson learned - and hopefully passed on!

Most song writers understand the need to re-write in an attempt to make a song the best it can be - and I have always acknowledged the importance of re-writes. I want to share a recent experiance - which was a real wakeup call for me.

A song I wrote was recently published and selected to be recorded for a national country artist (I can't give a name, but he records on the BMG lable - which is "the big time").

The artist and producer loved the 1st verse and chorus, but felt the 2nd & 3rd verses were too negative (the artist did not want to relay the story of such a "negative charactor"). I normally write more about darker charactors -so trying to lighten up the story line was against my natural writing instincts.

I've just completed the 2nd re-write (they liked most of the 1st re-write - but still wnated more) - and I had to get this done in a very short amount of time (they are already in pre-production). I think the song will make the final cut and appear on the CD (they would not be spending this much time if they did not really like it) ...... so I'm hoping it's worth all the torment of re-writing to please this artist.

The morale is........if you really want to be a writing at a level that can maybe see some success in the bg leagues.......you better be willing and able to re-write.
 
Thanks for sharing that helpful advice. Also, congrats on the major label choosing your song. :D
 
Hi Mikeh,
Just to contribute at least once, since I got help here. I remember when I started out as a copywriter, I was quite miffed when my work came back for rewrite, especially when years before I was used to retaining originality when I did features and columns for newspapers. After eight years, I of course realized this was part of the deal, you have to separate yourself from the work and realize it's not your own anymore once you submit it to the client. I got good at rewrites, you gotta keep your eye on the prize, seeing your name in print with something you're proud to call your own.

It's the same thing with many professions geared toward sales rather than the creative process, which only the very best can eventually collaborate or stand alone and keep their own stuff the way they want it. For example, decorators, they have to be able to put aside their own preferences for how a room should be fixed up, and instead find out exactly what their client wants, and then give it to them, using personal knowledge and style to express the homeowner's world.

I also think rewrites can be just as challenging to a creative person as anything else, at least the songwriter can keep his hand in, rather than the ultimate disappointment of selling all rights or someone else ruining it, and then seeing it turn out as an operated-on scabby rendition, not even close to the original.

Well, that's my two cents, nickel, and dime. I would also do as Mikeh has done, encourage songwriters to go with the flow, let it go, give 'em what they want, enjoy the process, but definitely gladly do the rewrite yourself, so as to keep some control of the situation. Thanks again everyone, this is a fun website. I love the internet.
GG
 
Congratulations on the song's success. I had a creative writing class many years ago where the instructor was fond of saying :" The secret to good writing, is re-writing" This definitely applies in songwriting as well. Best of luck to you. (And everyone else as well, for that matter)
 
i've always been one for rewrites as opposed to those who pour out tunes just to see what sticks kinda writting... while living in nashvegas awile back they used to say a good song is written ... agreat song is rewritten...
 
dementedchord said:
a good song is written ... agreat song is rewritten...
Click to expand...

That is exactly what is happening here. I thought I had a pretty good song to start with (and I had re-written a couple of times before I submitted it to the publisher).

But - the story line was a little dark and perhaps not as "country" as it could be (I try to write country since many country artists accept outside material). By asking me to change the story line.....they got me to re-think the charactors and the way they talk about their relationship. While the story line is now a little too sappy for my taste........it is actually a better country song than what I started with.

With a little luck, maybe the artist and his fans can decide if the song is now "great"...... I do have to admit it is now a better song than when I first submitted it.

I've written a lot of songs and have had some small successes...and even came close to what almost was more than small success, but, it's always come up a little short - this is a hard, hard business!!!!! This one feels like it could be the next step up the ladder.......but I've been doing this long enough that I won't get too wishful (plan for the worst, hope for the best). I'm not planning on quitting the day job:D.

I wrote a better song and that in itself is a success!
 
mikeh said:
A lesson learned - and hopefully passed on!

Most song writers understand the need to re-write in an attempt to make a song the best it can be - and I have always acknowledged the importance of re-writes. I want to share a recent experiance - which was a real wakeup call for me.

A song I wrote was recently published and selected to be recorded for a national country artist (I can't give a name, but he records on the BMG lable - which is "the big time").

The artist and producer loved the 1st verse and chorus, but felt the 2nd & 3rd verses were too negative (the artist did not want to relay the story of such a "negative charactor"). I normally write more about darker charactors -so trying to lighten up the story line was against my natural writing instincts.

I've just completed the 2nd re-write (they liked most of the 1st re-write - but still wnated more) - and I had to get this done in a very short amount of time (they are already in pre-production). I think the song will make the final cut and appear on the CD (they would not be spending this much time if they did not really like it) ...... so I'm hoping it's worth all the torment of re-writing to please this artist.

The morale is........if you really want to be a writing at a level that can maybe see some success in the bg leagues.......you better be willing and able to re-write.
Click to expand...

Any chance we can get to hear the song? Or is it classified?;)
 
We tend to have a strong emotional investment in our creations, and it can be a bit daunting when someone says "it would be better if . . . .".

Because there is a lot of us attached to it, this can seem like a personal attack, which, of course, it isn't.

When you read novels, you often see, in the acknowledgements, a testimonial to an editor or a friend or someone who read the draft and helped with tightening up the text.
 
wRITTEN IN STONE?

Hardly. We all know that we should be thick skinned enough to take criticism and rework our lyrics to appeal to the greatest common denominator.

Or should we? Some work comes to me from the ether. It is not great by any means, nor written in stone, but I am reluctant to take the rough edges off for fear of losing the "suggestion" of the content.

There is a chapter in my book titled, "What You Don't Say."

I think what you don't say speaks volumes. Case in point:

A song from "A Feeling of Power" called "Living My Life" goes thusly:

(Refrain)

Don't follow . . . no worship . . . you are the heart of this song

Don't follow . . . no worship . . . you are the heart of this song . . . you're the heart of this song.

The protagonist is singing this to the audience at the end of the musical.

I have no idea what the words mean. I have an impression only that I am left with.

For years I have struggled with the question as to whether to re-write this song to be more concise.

And yet it stands as originally written.

Remember Inna Godda Da Vida? The lyricist admitted to the actual words, In The Garden of Eden and yet chose not to change the lyrics.
 
Similar vein

Interesting viewpoints. Similar to one of my own, but instead of rewriting to please a "mover and a shaker", I rewrite to please myself, there being no tougher critic than yours truly.

For many a year, I have thought my 1st album title might be "No song before its time", but a couple of friends thought it too arrogant.

I may still use it, though. <grin>


Case in point, as is revealed, I have not yet recorded the CD (though I have enough material for 6 CD's). Obviously, for me, there are other things in play.
 
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Xeries, My publisher does not want me posting any of the songs he's accepted into his catalog - while it's not classified:o - it is a partly owned by the publisher.....so what he says, goes!

Toddskins - I can relate......I have sooo many songs that I keep tweaking and rerecording (always thinking I can make them better). It's a good thing that every one in a while I get something published and placed or none of my material would ever be "completed":D
 
Re-write Margaritaville

http://www.usaweekend.com/contest/index.html

Write a new first verse to the song Margaritaville and win a trip to Jamaica.

Here's my entry:

A Goddess that I saw
Was sippin' a bar straw
I couldn't believe such a beauty I found.
But lately it's seemin'
I must a' been dreamin'
Cause when I woke up she was nowhere around.
 
You couldn't pay me enough money in the world to do a re-write... But then again I would never sell off any of my lyrics...

Every thing is about prospective... If you're trying to sell your lyrics to an artist then a re-write is possibly necessary... And you have to take criticisms of your work. If you're not trying to sell off your lyrics then anyone who say a rewrite is necessary you can tell then to screw off because they will never know your original emotion of the piece.

The problem I would have doing a re-write is the fact that every song I write has at least three or four different meanings and every phrase ties to the previous phrase and the phrase after it... and as a consequence of that if you change one line it has a good possibility of destroying all the other meanings... and that would make it another utterly useless song in the world...

Songs and lyrics are suppose to have meaning and emotion, and I'm curious how a person can maintain any original emotion in a rewrite (not to say you can't change a word or two)..?

Ex: if I write a song about how I love crack and a producer tells me that there can be no reference to drugs in the lyrics then the entire meaning of the song is gone and what the hell is the point to writing a bunch of meaningless words so someone can, unemotionally, sing them?
 
the moral of the story is...if you want to write a CREATIVE and GOOD song...FUCK THAT SHIT! hehehe :) WHo wants to listen to a song that is so far removed from it's inspiration... that's like looking at 1950s advertizing illustrations as the highest art in the land (without any unintentional ironic propaganda brilliance being considered)
 
Epicurious....spoken(written) like a true dillatante. I would wager that there's not a writer who takes his/her art and craft seriously who doesn't re-write. Some people write because they believe that it's cool to be able to say, with all vanity and arrogance, "I'm a writer", thereby showing a level of narcisism and self-absorbtion that virtually guarantees that their output will be drivel. This is the literary equivalent of thinking that "their shit don't stink" .



Trust me....it does.



chazba
 
a serious question

OK i read the OP and while i am teetering on the brink between disgust at how lame selling art is and mature realization that thats how life goes id like to say/ask something.

Every MF will tell you re-writing "works". But rarely if ever will someone state their process for doing so and the advantages/disadvantages of that process.

Think about it, if you write something, you probably have been composing for awhile. That means everything you do is a rewrite in theory. Every time you break out a "new" idea its basically a mutant of your previous ideas. So in "rewriting" theory, the initial idea shouldnt need revision. But no one ever says that.

So rather than stating that rewriting "works", people should maybe list their revision methods WITH reasoning behind WHY it works and what the possible pitfalls are in that method.
 
I tend to think that my best lines are the ones that come out with the least effort---the ones that pretty much come out intact all at once.

The ones I have to spend time working on or "re-writing" are usually the most forced and contrived-sounding to me. Of course, I'm not talking about country music or something very commercial like that. I'm just talking about my style, which is kind of indie/rock/alternative/whatever. But still, I think a good song's a good song.


Just my two cents.
 
could be

It could be that the reason why some fast coming ideas are good without effort is that they are informal and borderline conversational in nature, and therefore smooth. The human brain will always associate fluidity with truth.
 
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