Old Keyboard Experts Please answer.

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Brahmb

New member
Hi. I'm following up an earlier question more specifically. I have a Korg digital piano DP2000C that is weighted and old. I love its feel, but want to have it control a module like the Korg Triton or Roland Fantom-XR. Will it give me all the things I want? I want to have the keyboard play one sound on a light touch, but add sounds as the touch increases (layering). I also want split keyboard ability, which I know the Korg DP2000C doesn't currently have. Will a module that is connected to it through midi in and out - or even with midi through - create this master/slave atmosphere (I know it's not Politicly Correct, but those are the terms I know) or do I need to get a new weighted keyboard? Thanks.

PS. I haven't heard back from Korg yet.
 
When the controller falls short, it's up to the module to take up the slack.

For instance, I'll talk about something that I know more about. The Roland MKS-70. The MKS-70 is a rackmounted synth module.

It is capable of layering by default (A + B). You can set this layering up so that it will play one sound on a light touch and one or both sounds when the keys are fully depressed. You can also asign one split with crossover capability.

That means that you can asign a splitpoint low and high. If both low and high are the same point it will be a simple split. If the low is, say an octave above the high you'll have one cross over octave where both tones are played together.

This would work with any MIDI capable keyboard. Yours included.

Carl
 
Brahmb said:
I have a Korg digital piano DP2000C that is weighted and old. I love its feel, but want to have it control a module like the Korg Triton or Roland Fantom-XR.
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If the keyboard has a midi out, then it will control a module.
Will it give me all the things I want?
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That is the real question...
I want to have the keyboard play one sound on a light touch, but add sounds as the touch increases (layering).
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Does the DP200C have aftertouch? If so, then you may be able to do what you require, depending on the progamability (sp?) of the module.
I also want split keyboard ability, which I know the Korg DP2000C doesn't currently have. Will a module that is connected to it through midi in and out - or even with midi through - create this master/slave atmosphere
Click to expand...
Yes and no. Some controller keyboards have the ability to provide zones, which can be programmed to transmit on different midi channels. In this case, you can really take advantage of the multi-timbrality of a module. Some modules have certain patches or "combinations" that will mimic this in the patch, but you will be limited to that subset of patches available to you.

So I guess the answer here is, you probably really want a fully capable midi controller.

Hope this helps.
 
fraserhutch said:
If the keyboard has a midi out, then it will control a module.
That is the real question...
Does the DP200C have aftertouch? If so, then you may be able to do what you require, depending on the progamability (sp?) of the module.
Yes and no. Some controller keyboards have the ability to provide zones, which can be programmed to transmit on different midi channels. In this case, you can really take advantage of the multi-timbrality of a module. Some modules have certain patches or "combinations" that will mimic this in the patch, but you will be limited to that subset of patches available to you.

So I guess the answer here is, you probably really want a fully capable midi controller.

Hope this helps.
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Not nessisarily.

Like I said, modules such as my own will allow you to create splitpoints on ANY MIDI keyboard. Regardless of the controllers ability to create zones itself.

Also, my module will allow me to layer up to two internal sounds in any combination as well as layering the second sound only when the key is more than halfway depressed. It has aftertouch too, but this is something different. Aftertouch is usually reserved for vibrato, brightness, chorus or other effect and not for establishing a new patch. What this does is trigger a second sound instead of or in addition to the first sound when the key is pressed beyond a certain point (regardless of velocity).


Let me repeat, the Roland MKS-70 will allow me to split any two tones at any split point I desire with any MIDI controller, Including the Korg mentioned above.

It depends on his module choices just as much as his controller. In this case the feel of his keyboard is paramount to him so I suggest he find a module that allows him to do these things.

Alternatively, you could always buy a MIDI router like the MOTU Express which lets you rout a single controller to as many as 8 outputs. You can assign each output a different MIDI channel that will interpret your Korg's channel 1 output as any of 15 other channels (16 if you include 1 as well).

Carl
 
Thanks for the answers. I thought what Krakit is saying about both the layering and zones might be true (I mean, a controller just needs midi out to control a module, right?). So I just need to know if the Triton module or the Fantom have these, which I believe they do. Keep the opinions coming, especially if you are familiar with the Korg DP2000C.
 
Krakit said:
Not nessisarily.
[/QUTOE] Well yes, you can do it that way, and as a side note, I have used aaftertouch many times to blend in other patches. I generally do not use the technique you mention, because I do want the entire key strike velocity available to my patches.

However, I still do not think you can create a true split zone on your MKS 70.

For example, let's say I want to play organ with my left hand, and horn punches with my right. I do not want organ to sound woth my horn punches. To do that, you need split zones, I thjnk.
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No you don't. :cool:

When you make splits on the MKS-70 you assign a key for your low splitpoint and another key for your high splitpoint.

If they are both the same key you'll get a split right there (say middle C). If your low point is above your high point you'll get a crossover section where both tones will sound.

As for what you assign to each half of the board, you are not limited in any way. ANY internal tone (I'll repeat that ANY) can be assigned to either end of the keyboard. This is not a function of my controller (which in this case is an Evolution MK149).

There are 104 tones in the MKS-70 and any two can be used in this manner for splits.

You can also assign channel splits. That would allow you to route two controllers to the MKS-70 and play each internal sound on another keyboard entirely.


Let me make this clear. If you split one half of the board for say organs and the other half of the board for brass (as you suggested) there is nothing you could do, no technique that will coax the organ sound from the half split for brass or vice verci. Not unless you intentionally did a layering or crosssplit to begin with.



Carl
 
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I hope this is relevant:

Both the Ensoniq SQR+ Sound module and the Yamaha MEP4 Midi Channelizer allow you to create midi splits and zones (4 zones) from a single midi-channel keyboard.

I know this to be true because my controller(s) of choice is the Yamaha KX-88, which only transmits on one midi channel and supports one split out of the box.

With either of the two above devices I can get multiple midi zones in my studio setup (which consists of two KX-88s). Both are relatively inexpensive on eBay.
 
Ok. I got an answer from Korg today. The DP will do everything on these modules EXCEPT the aftertouch. So can anyone tell me exactly what I'd be missing? I'm leaning toward the Triton, so if you can be specific to that...
 
Aftertouch requires a savy controller.

Essentially it allow you to apply some effects by pressing a bit harder on the keys after they have already bottomed out. It's not the same thing you said you wanted from layering.

Usually aftertouch adds something like vibrato, brightness, chorus, LFO modulation, volume boosts or some other effect.

Most MIDI controllers don't have aftertouch.

However, the ability to change or add patches by passing the halfway point of depression is something else so you can still do that.

Carl
 
The Triton will allow you to set up several keyzones (And velocity layers) per Combi (Combi is what Korg calls a combination of Programs), regardless of what your controller supports.

As far as aftertouch is concerned, it is nice to have, but not necessarily required. It is often used to control frequency modulation rate, filter cutoff, etc. If you want to add it, but really love the feel of your current keyboard, you could always consider getting a foot controller like the Behringer FCB1010. You route the MIDI out to the foot-controller, and use it's MIDI merge function, and set up aftertouch (or any other controller function) on one of the pedals.
 
Well, after all the nonsense... I went and tried things out. I liked the Korg, but then tried the Roland and liked it better. Then I tried the Yamaha and really liked the action. So, I'm now giving up on the module idea and getting together the extra do-re-mi for the Yamaha Motif ES8. I'm keeping the Korg Digital, because I can't bear to give up something that's worked well for me for almost 20 years.
 
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