Not Another Mic Pre Thread!

U

undermind

Member
Sorry to do this, I know there are a million and one threads on mic pre's, and I've read most of them. I just love attention.

I've got a Trident S-20 two channel mic pre. My main vocal mic is a Lawson L47 FET. The results aren't terrible, but I wouldn't say they're magical. I would like to get more silk on vocals. And from what I've read the S-20 makes a far better drum pre than a vocal pre.

I'm aware of the better pre's like the Great River, Neve Portico, Sebatron, etc. What I haven't read about is how the API's and other "lunchbox" types compare to these.

I'm not super familiar with all of the different lunchbox type setups, but I have a few questions...
How do the EQ's and compression modules compare to plug-ins?
How do the different brands compare to one another? API, SSL, True Systems, etc.
What would be the best bang for the buck in regard to getting into a setup for about a grand? I would be willing to start with one channel of pre for that price and add on later. And used/Ebay is fine.

A couple of things I should note, rackmount-able is ideal, but not necessary. Also something with a good amount of gain to run a ribbon mic would be nice, but again not necessary.

Thanks, and sorry for the noob questions.
 
Whoops, just noticed that the True Systems stuff is not lunchbox type..

I'm also open to the channel strip DIY'd into rack idea.. I just honestly don't know where to begin when it comes to vintage and quality names in this arena. Most of my knowledge is in the "for the home studio" world..
 
Since I could never afford any of that, my final answer is SP VTB-1... :D

Although, I'm interested in hearing this too...
 
from what i can tell, it seems like the best deal for the lunchbox-style pres is thru seventh circle audio's DYI kits...although the chassis and power supply alone run $650, the preamp modules aren't all that expensive, and are of the highest-quality from what i hear...the current line includes neve 1272 and API 512 clones, amongst a couple of others - there's also an option to buy the stuff assembled, but i think it's about $200 more per channel that way

i did the math a while back, and it came to around $1600 for the chassis, PS, and 2 channels each of neve and API preamps
 
Ironklad Audio said:
from what i can tell, it seems like the best deal for the lunchbox-style pres is thru seventh circle audio's DYI kits...although the chassis and power supply alone run $650, the preamp modules aren't all that expensive, and are of the highest-quality from what i hear...the current line includes neve 1272 and API 512 clones, amongst a couple of others - there's also an option to buy the stuff assembled, but i think it's about $200 more per channel that way

i did the math a while back, and it came to around $1600 for the chassis, PS, and 2 channels each of neve and API preamps
Click to expand...
Thanks for reminding me of SCA. I forgot about that. I've been re-reading about it.
 
With 500 format pres and other modules, we are largely talking about different flavors of good. You will need to do some research and some listening to decide what works for you. A used 6 slot API lunch box will run you about $350 or so on e-bay. Prices for used pres vary a bit with API 512c pres being some of the less expensive ($550-600 used) and most available (because they've been out longer and there are a lot more of them out there). OSA pres are also on the less expensive end. You will need to be careful about the power requirements of different modules since the power supplies in some of the older lunch boxes are limited (they were designed for the API modules which draw less than some others). There are currently a lot more preamps available than other outboard modules, but vendors seem to be coming out with more EQs and compressors to fit the format. Depending on what you are looking for, the flexibility you need, and the number of channels you want, it is worthwhile to see whether it is cost effective to buy into the 500 series or just get a dedicated multichannel rack unit. For example, if you just wanted 4 channels of API, a 3124 with 4 channels of API pre ($2400 new) is less expensive than buying a lunch box and 4-512c cards ($3125 new).

FWIW, I have a couple lunch boxes with 2 X API 512c pres, 1 X A-Designs P-1 Pre, 1 X Purple Audio Biz pre, 2 X API 550b EQs, and 1 API 525 compressor. I've got rack gear too, but all these pres have different sounds and are really portable in this format, which makes them really useful for recording in other people's locations. I had an A-Designs Red pre, but I thought it sounded too much like my APIs so I traded it for the Purple Audio pre.

Keep in mind that not all modular gear is 500 format.

Here is a list of generally available or rumored 500 format equipment:

API

http://www.apiaudio.com/500v.html

* 500-6B - 6 slot lunchbox
* 500V - 10 slot vertical rack mount
* 500H - 2 slot horizontal rack mount (costs more that the 10 slot???)

OSA (Old School Audio)

http://www.oldschoolaudio.com/products.html

* Power Rack - 11 slot rack mount
* Track Pack - 8 slot lunchbox

BAE (Brent Averill Enterprises)

http://www.brentaverill.com/api_rack/

* 6 Module lunchbox
* 6 Module rack mount
* 11 module rack mount


Now on to the real goodness - the modules themselves!

A-Designs

http://www.adesignsaudio.com/
http://www.adesignsaudio.com/p-1_emseries.htm

* P-1 Pacifica (Quad Eight Style) Preamp
* EM-Silver Preamp
* EM-Blue Preamp
* EM-Red Preamp
* EM-Gold Preamp
* 500 Series EQ's

API

* 512c Mic/Line Preamp/DI - http://www.apiaudio.com/512c.html
* 525 Discrete Compressor, Re-Issue - http://www.apiaudio.com/525.html
* 550a Discrete 3-Band Equalizer
* 550b 4 Band EQ - http://www.apiaudio.com/550b.html
* 560b 10 Band Graphic EQ - http://www.apiaudio.com/560.html

Avedis Audio

* E27 3-Band Equalizer - http://www.avedisaudio.com

BAE (Brent Averill Enterprises)

* 312A Mic Preamp - http://www.brentaverill.com/312a/

Buzz Audio

* Elixir Mic Preamp - http://www.buzzaudio.com/products/elixir.htm
* Essence Class A Opto Compressor - http://buzzaudio.com/products/essence.htm

Eisen Audio

* DIY 500 Mic Preamp - http://www.eisenaudio.com/diy500/
*A do it yourself kit - thousands of possible transformer and opamp combinations!

OSA (Old School Audio)

link to all: http://www.oldschoolaudio.com/products.html

* MP1-A Mic Preamp
* MP1-C Mic Preamp
* MP1-L Mic Preamp
* MP1-L3 Mic Preamp

Purple Audio

* 'Biz' Mic Preamp - http://www.purpleaudio.com/Product/biz.html

Shadow Hills

* Mono GAMA Mic Pre - http://www.vintageking.com/s.nl/sc.13/id.5730/.f

RUMOR HAS IT (more 500 series format modules coming soon):

* OSA compressor
* Purple Audio compressor
* Speck EQ (now available) http://www.speck.com/
* Daking EQ (now available) http://www.dakingplus.com/products.html
* John Hardy preamp (confirmed in the works)
* S&M Audio EQ based on Trident 80B

OTHER MENTIONS (non API format rack units):

* Buzz Audio A-Rack - http://www.buzzaudio.com/products/arack.htm
* SCA Rack Kits DIY - http://www.seventhcirclestudios.com/SCA/SCA.htm
* Tonelux VRack Remote control Modules - http://www.tonelux.com/products.html
* Wunder PEQ1 For Neve Racks - http://www.wunderaudio.com/PEQ1product.html

List is courtesy of Mark Warren on GS.

I'd check out this thread as a starting point for researching what modules might make sense for you:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/showthread.php?t=54104


Have fun!! :D
 
Not quite. They do make a horizontal 2 space rack though.

http://www.mercenary.com/api50homora.html

However, by the time you add the modules, it's pricey. If you want a 2 channel rack unit, I would strongly consider an A-Designs Pacifica. The pres are similar to the 500 factor P-1 preamp but have bigger transformers.

http://www.frontendaudio.com/A_Designs_Pacifica_Preamp_p/8144.htm

Another consideration would be a Great River pre:

http://www.mercenary.com/greatrivelmp.html

They have been around for awhile and show up used on the GS board from time to time.
 
Pohaku, great summary on all this. Best I've run across and thanks for taking the time to document all this. Rep point to ya.
 
would like to point out that if you buy the whole kit at SCA ; a chassis kit a power supply and a preamp kit you get a discount that is practically a free power supply. You can get a chassis kit, power supply and a n72 kit for 625.00 total. Great sounding preamp I might add. I tested them against the neve's at work and they were dam close. Not exact mind you ( then again I have yet to hear 2 neve's that are exact to each other) but quite close and at that price completely worth it. I haven't heard the a12 ( api 312 ish clone) yet but look forward to building a couple in the future. I don't work for them or anything just thought that its a great product at a great price. PLus I still have room to build 7 more ( chassis and PS will hold and power 8 SCA preamps) Works out to less than 3000 for 8 channels of 1272 clones ( if you choose to build all 8 as n72) works out Roughly the same for the a12 and the j99 ( i believe this is very similar to the john hardy stuff) and the c84 ( i have no clue on the sound of this though I hear they are good sounding) are even cheaper. Not trying to spam or sell, just think its a great product
Randy
 
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undermind said:
Holy smokes that empty 2-space rack is $725!
Click to expand...
Yup. You really have to want your API modules in a horizontal rack space to pay for that. Can't imagine that they sell too many of them. :D
 
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