Need advice on room

[fraserhutch]

Hi all.

I have recently moved, and the property has a mother-in-law's unit that I wish to convert into my studio.

It's not, and unfortunately under an HOA, so any external modification to the structure is out of the question.

Here is a pdf of the dimensions: http://www.fileupyours.com/view/285847/Studio.pdf

I am looking for advice on how to proceed. This is on a very quiet street, so sound proofing is not a big issue really, but I would like to keep sound in as much as possible. To that end, I expect to rip out the interior walls. I really cannot do much with the ceiling because it has a massive air conditioning/heating vent and the access panel/door to the "attic" I can add insulation upwards - there's a huge amount of empty space and air between the ceiling and the sloped roof.

I will be taking out the carpet and installing hard wood floors.


Any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance!

-Fraser

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Bass traps in all four corners and front and back walls to start. Then a cloud over the mix position and regular panels on the side walls. You'll have to hang 'em in front of the windows and slider or build 'em on stands you can move around. Fairly straightforward - small room, lots of absorption.


lou

 

[Jeff_D]

^ what he said. Its nice (and fairly rare) to have all 4 corners available for trapping in a bedroom. Usually there is a door or closet or other stuff in the way... Anyways, I'd do 4" thick rigid fiberglass or rockwool traps in all four corners, from floor to ceiling (or as tall as you can). Treating the first reflection points between your speakers and the sidewalls will be trickey because of that window and sliding door. You could build a stand-up gobo or something to sit in front of the window if that doesn't spoil your view too much- same thing rockwool or rigid fiberglass. Here's a link to a basic guide on room setup. RealTraps - How To Set Up a Room

As for actual soundproofing, the *easiest* solution would be to add another layer of drywall, but you have those big windows to deal with which I would guess would be the weak link in sound transmission. Personally, I'd set up and treat the room and try it out to see if you actually need to do any soundproofing, then go from there before you start ripping into walls.

No matter what you do (and maybe you've already figured this out) avoid foam, eggcrates, and packing blankets.

So, what kind of recording are you looking to do in there?

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Its nice (and fairly rare) to have all 4 corners available for trapping in a bedroom. Usually there is a door or closet or other stuff in the way... Anyways, I'd do 4" thick rigid fiberglass or rockwool traps in all four corners, from floor to ceiling (or as tall as you can).

Agreed, agreed. Or "superchunks" in the corners. Pricier - more material - but mass/density is your friend in bass trapping.


lou

 

[fraserhutch]

Hey guys, than ks for the feedback.

I happen to have a 4 Auralex bass traps, 2 boxes of Auralex pyramid foam, and 14 2" rigid fiberglass panels.

Looking to record horns and vocals. Not sure there's enough room to do any bands

I'm also thinking of converting the walk-in closet to a recording booth, except the it's square. Good idea, bad?

 

[Jeff_D]

I happen to have a 4 Auralex bass traps, 2 boxes of Auralex pyramid foam, and 14 2" rigid fiberglass panels.

I'd sell that auralex in a heartbeat and buy more of the stuff that will actually help (the rigid fiberglass). The pyramids are only absorbent in the mid and high range and even their "basstraps" are suspect IMO. Are your 2" panels already finished like framed and cloth covered? If not, I'd double some up into 4" panels to span the 4 room corners. If they are, then I'd pick up some 4" 703 or rockwool. The superchunks are a great idea too. If that was my room, the only piece of foam you'd find in there would be the seat cushion on my desk chair.

I'm also thinking of converting the walk-in closet to a recording booth, except the it's square. Good idea, bad?

That closet it awful small for a booth. From reading around the last few years, i sounds like most 'pro' studio's booths are more like the size of your main room. I think you'll get far better results tracking in your well treated room than in a closet. Besides the closet is just more to treat anyway.

IF you find that tracking the horns is too loud and bothering the neighbors, THEN, I might consider using the closet just because it would be a lot easier to try and sound proof that small area with no windows than it would be to try and soundproof the whole building. But, I still think it would be a compromise in acoustics.

hope that helps...

 

[studiopa]

This is related to sound isolation and not acoustics--If you're going to the trouble of ripping out walls, you could consider leaving them in tact (maybe fortifying them if possible) and building a structure within those outer walls that doesn't actually touch the outer walls. This will provide the best sound isolation between your studio noise and the outside world and will allow you to keep the original structure in place per your requirements.

To be effective, the structure would need to be solid (sheetrock/drywall all around) and completely enclosed. This method would also allow you to shape the internal structure for the best acoustics--avoiding cubes and parallel walls--and a layout to suit your needs.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

The space is way too small for room-in-room foolishness and the OP stated isolation was not a major issue. Having re-read the original post I'm wondering what he means by "ripping out walls". Are you going to eliminate the washroom and closet? That opens up some different possibilities.


lou

 

[fraserhutch]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I guess I should have been more clear. I am only willing/able to rip out the walls in the main room and the closet. the bathroom is off limits. And by walls, I mean drywall. I am not allowed to change the room layout in any significant way, not would I be allowed to remove the bathroom.

And yes, Lou, you are correct, i had already considered the room in a room solution - very briefly. While it's a good and valid suggestion, the last thing I need is a second closet

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Room in a room is definitely the way to go if you have money and space but I just can't see it with anything less than twenty feet as a minimum dimension to start with.

To your specific space I think tearing out the drywall to add insulation is pretty bloody expensive for minimal return.* You could double up the drywall but I don't think I'd even go that far. Try absorption first and go from there.


lou

*edit - You could remove the drywall and replace it with fabric over extra insulation. Make the whole room an absorber or just strategic sections. If you overdo it you could add diffusion back in to brighten it up. That would really maximize the space available. If that thought appeals to you maybe start another thread to hopefully attract Ethan or John or some of the other experts.

 

[studiopa]

While I don't think room-in-a-room is out of the question in this case, it does become less of a realistic option in smaller spaces. The suggestion was bred as much from the need to leave the original space untouched as it was for isolation, essentially serving two functions with one method. My take now is the opposite of my original interpretion in that you can mess with the outer structure but are required to leave some of the internal structure in place.

In that case, I think the suggestion to pull the drywall in selected areas (maybe to eliminate the parallel walls?), fill the cavity with absorption and add diffusion back in as needed, is a good recommendation to create space and improve acoustics. One thing to keep in mind is that doing this will increase the noise level reaching the outside since you're removing one layer of mass (sheetrock/drywall) from the equation. It sounds like this is the lesser concern for you so maybe it's the way to go. Vocals would be fine and horns might be ok. If you decide to record bands, I'd test out amped bass guitar (you can always go direct), kick drum and snare before committing because these could be challenges as far as the neighborhood goes.

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Here is what I'd do...

If you don't own this building, forget about dumping $$ for soundproofing "attempts", as it may be futile, depending on various factors. I'd just go for the best "bang for the buck" treatment and be done with it. Although, you could build removable window and door panels out of MDF or Ply which may help with a modicum of sound transmission in and out. But full scale transmission loss construction would be a waste of time and dollars in a room this size. At least from my wallets perspective. Anyway...my .02 for what it's worth.

fitZ

 

[fraserhutch]

Wow, Rick, thanks for taking the time.

I think I will take your advice. Just one question - are those panels 2" rigid fiberglass panels?

Thanks very much,

Fraser

Here is what I'd do...

If you don't own this building, forget about dumping $$ for soundproofing "attempts", as it may be futile, depending on various factors. I'd just go for the best "bang for the buck" treatment and be done with it. Although, you could build removable window and door panels out of MDF or Ply which may help with a modicum of sound transmission in and out. But full scale transmission loss construction would be a waste of time and dollars in a room this size. At least from my wallets perspective. Anyway...my .02 for what it's worth.

fitZ

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Just one question - are those panels 2" rigid fiberglass panels?

Looks like 4" to me.

Nice layout, Fitz.


lou

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

How in the hell did that sit for three weeks?

Gotta check yer threads, dude.


lou

 

[RICK FITZPATRICK]

Wow, Rick, thanks for taking the time.

No problem. This is kind of a "defacto"/typical HR layout for treatment. However, take a look at this thread for improving the LF absorption in the corner diagonal panels.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/gener.../corner-trap-dimensions-effectiveness-306280/

Also, the layout doesn't address EXACT position in the room where the your head is placed. The norm is centered on the long axis, with a STARTING point about 38% from the front wall. Keep your speakers in a equilateral triangle(60 degrees) with the engineering position, and move the speakers/seat back and forth till you get the best response at the listening position. Also, the 60 degree thing is NOT set in stone.