jameslucas
New member
Any ideas about how much I could get a decent mic preamp for. Looking at $0-$200 if I could. I've got a behnringer mixer but there is some noise on the high end so....any ideas?
mic preamp...where does quality begin?
- Thread starter jameslucas
- Start date
Recording Engineer
Moderator
More than likely, you're simply not setting up your gain structure very well or your inter connections are not setup correctly, or something.
So exactly what and how do you have things setup, where you're going an abundance of noise.
So exactly what and how do you have things setup, where you're going an abundance of noise.
jameslucas
New member
I've got an sm57 and an sm58 which I plug directly into my behringer UB1202. I don't use the EQ on the behringer either. I then run the RCA Tape out from the behringer to the RCA line in on my sound blaster audigy card. I set the gain stage on the UB1202 at about 80% and then I have to boost the tracking software to get the correct volume. I don't think it's a problem with room noise, I think it's a problem with gain staging. ideas?
...and use your "master" output, i've heard people say that the tape-out produces more noise(??). If you get a better soundcard(with balanced inputs), you might wanna use balanced (xlr) cables.
Also ... 80% gain looks pretty much to me...
But ofcourse, the dmp3 is a great preamp for the buck
-grtz
Also ... 80% gain looks pretty much to me...
But ofcourse, the dmp3 is a great preamp for the buck
-grtz
jameslucas said:
I have been using a Mackie and a Behringer 24 ch 8 bus mixer for over 6 years. I updated mr mic pres over the last year and have two Avalons (U5, 737) a DMP3, a Joe Meek VC1 and a Focusrite VM pro. I us ethe inserts to bypass the Mackies and Behringers pre-amps. The sound is better but the sound is still kind of harsh and thin.
I sold both mixers. I bought an Allen and Heath GL2200 32 channel mixer and hooked it up this weekend. I was absolutely floored at the recorded sound of the tracks I made with the Mackie. The Allen and Heath makes the drums sound really great with no harshness. All the drums sound detailed and super punchy. Bass is punchy and deep and guitar is big and open.
What did I learn?
No matter how much you spend on pres, the mixer will kill your sound at mixdown. The Mackie and Behringer mixers are really useless. I did not really know how useless until I used the Allen and Heath. I recorded some tracks with the A&H and the sound was even better. This mixer is friggin wonderful. It makes my monitors sound 5 ft wider in all directions.
I would save your money and ditch the Behringer mixer. Get an Allen and Heath mixer. The pre-amps in it are really good.
So, people will chime in and tell you how great Mackies are and how much Behringer sucks etc. I will tell you, you can learn sooner or later, the Mackies are really horrible mixers too.
spankenstein
New member
I've been looking at the Allen & Heath mixers as well and like what I'm seeing.
I've got a a Behringer MX2004A that I'm using right now. It was the cheapest ($100) to get 8 pres with phantom power so I cold get some projects done. I use the direct insert so it does not go through the EQ section. I haven't had any noise that's been overbearing enough to question. I'm using an M-Audio Delta 1010LT and notice that the sound is a LOT different when I listen to it monitoring from the card's mixer vs. monitoring through the mixer. Once it goes through the EQ section it get hissy. There's a lot of high end and the upper mids seem boosted even witht he EQs flat. It does however sound good direct in the card so it records well... just play back like crap.
I would definitely spend money on a card first. I got mine for like $275 on ebay. I've been very impressed with all the M-Audio equipment that I have used but definitely look around. There are a lot of options now.
As far as Mackie and Behringer. Mackie makes better chassis for their stuff... other than that. I'd say it's all about the same. It's definitely workable but you will probably outgrow it and look into more dedicated equipment.
I've got a a Behringer MX2004A that I'm using right now. It was the cheapest ($100) to get 8 pres with phantom power so I cold get some projects done. I use the direct insert so it does not go through the EQ section. I haven't had any noise that's been overbearing enough to question. I'm using an M-Audio Delta 1010LT and notice that the sound is a LOT different when I listen to it monitoring from the card's mixer vs. monitoring through the mixer. Once it goes through the EQ section it get hissy. There's a lot of high end and the upper mids seem boosted even witht he EQs flat. It does however sound good direct in the card so it records well... just play back like crap.
I would definitely spend money on a card first. I got mine for like $275 on ebay. I've been very impressed with all the M-Audio equipment that I have used but definitely look around. There are a lot of options now.
As far as Mackie and Behringer. Mackie makes better chassis for their stuff... other than that. I'd say it's all about the same. It's definitely workable but you will probably outgrow it and look into more dedicated equipment.
Recording Engineer
Moderator
acorec,
I'm with you on this.
Mackie VLZPRO preamps work great as filler preamps (as long as you don't crank them) and it stops there!
If you can afford it, stay away from Mackies as a mixer... The EQ kills the signal and eats up headrom like crazy! And there is no headroom to even speak of in the first place on the buss and main mix amps!
I had a Soundcraft 200B. Upgraded to an MTA 924. Then downgraded all the way down to a Mackie SR32*4-VLZPRO so that I could put a down-payment for my DaviSound console! I've been dealing with it since about Summer of 2001 and will be until Fall of 2004! So as you can see, I have first-hand experience with this issue nearly every day!
Since I've had the Mackie, my mixes tend to have this "limited" "sound" to them, no matter what the style of music.
A quiet finger-picked acoustic guitar tracked with a Mackie VLZPRO preamp cranked and them mixed through the Mackie is the worst! On occasion, I have to track an acoustic guitar as such. The result is this nasty "sound" I simply cannot explain; and it's NOT a good thing at all!
I remember about a year ago I listened to an MP3 (I think it may have been here in the MP3 Mixing Clinic Forum.) that was a quiet finger-picked acoustic guitar track that had that EXACT same nasty "sound"... Come to find out it was tracked with a Mackie VLZPRO preamp and mixed through a Mackie... Go figure.
I'm with you on this.
Mackie VLZPRO preamps work great as filler preamps (as long as you don't crank them) and it stops there!
If you can afford it, stay away from Mackies as a mixer... The EQ kills the signal and eats up headrom like crazy! And there is no headroom to even speak of in the first place on the buss and main mix amps!
I had a Soundcraft 200B. Upgraded to an MTA 924. Then downgraded all the way down to a Mackie SR32*4-VLZPRO so that I could put a down-payment for my DaviSound console! I've been dealing with it since about Summer of 2001 and will be until Fall of 2004! So as you can see, I have first-hand experience with this issue nearly every day!
Since I've had the Mackie, my mixes tend to have this "limited" "sound" to them, no matter what the style of music.
A quiet finger-picked acoustic guitar tracked with a Mackie VLZPRO preamp cranked and them mixed through the Mackie is the worst! On occasion, I have to track an acoustic guitar as such. The result is this nasty "sound" I simply cannot explain; and it's NOT a good thing at all!
I remember about a year ago I listened to an MP3 (I think it may have been here in the MP3 Mixing Clinic Forum.) that was a quiet finger-picked acoustic guitar track that had that EXACT same nasty "sound"... Come to find out it was tracked with a Mackie VLZPRO preamp and mixed through a Mackie... Go figure.
spankenstein
New member
I mix "in the box" I don't want to go back out to the Behringer if I can avoid it.
captainkey
New member
Recording Engineer said:
wow...you've really nailed it
I've had a Mackie 1202 for about 3 years now and although I've never completely mixed totally in the Mackie, I use it to track vocals, keyboards, and drums as overdubs to PTools or Logic mixes and my recordings never sound anywhere near what the actual instrument sounds like going in....
It really was obvious when I got Reason and did complete mixes within the software.....everything seemed to have a lot more life to it....drums too, even though they were samples....
I'm trying to limit the use of the Mackie to route the outputs of my soundcard (Mbox), or to play mp3's out the audio outs of the Mac thru Itunes, or to have something to plug Vdrums through and listen through my studio monitors....
what's the solution until one can afford a better console???
is it better to get a better audio interface, with more ins and outs like a digi 001, oo2, motu 828, delta 1010, or layla for example and just record directly thru those boxes until the Mackie can be replaced with something better....?