mia output levels + multimedia speakers?

C

clazymike

New member
i'm very close to getting an echo mia, but i just had a few clarifacation questions that maybe someone could help me out with. (just for reference, i'm gonna be using the mia along side an sblive.)

i don't have the funds to get monitors yet, so i plan on just using my computer speakers. i know that you're not supposed to, but it's all i have right now, so it will have to do. my question is can you use regular multimedia speakers with the mia? i thought i heard someone say something before about the line level outputs on the mia and not being able to do that.

regardless, of the whole monitoring situations--if i still wanted to use my speakers to watch movies or just listen to normal music (i don't have a dedicated recording machine), can regular multimedia speakers be used with the mia? how about a 5 piece surround system?

finally, i bought my computer back before i knew any better and got a gateway. now the speaker system that gateway uses is a modified form of a digital boston acoustics system. it requires a digital out from the computer, but isn't spdif (it's just a simple 1/8" jack). you just use the soundblaster's "digital out" to use the speakers. (when i use headphones from that same jack, i have to turn the "digital out" option off from the windows mixer.) does anybody know what's going on with this? and if this is the case can i still use these speakers with the mia? i know the mia have spdif out, but these speakers aren't spdif.

if i cannot use these speakers with the mia, is there another option? could i use the mia for recording and then route everything out the sblive for output? i know this would kinda defeat the purpose of the mia, but even if i recorded at 16/44.1, i would still get the mia's lower signal noise and stronger input, right?

obviously the best solution is to just get some monitors... but until then...
 
regardless, of the whole monitoring situations--if i still wanted to use my speakers to watch movies or just listen to normal music (i don't have a dedicated recording machine), can regular multimedia speakers be used with the mia?
Click to expand...

Well, it depends. The Mia had line outputs. Some multimedia speakers might be powered speakers that will work with line level signals. Then there's that digital issue you brought up earlier.

how about a 5 piece surround system?
Click to expand...
No.

now the speaker system that gateway uses is a modified form of a digital boston acoustics system. it requires a digital out from the computer, but isn't spdif (it's just a simple 1/8" jack). you just use the soundblaster's "digital out" to use the speakers. (when i use headphones from that same jack, i have to turn the "digital out" option off from the windows mixer.) does anybody know what's going on with this? and if this is the case can i still use these speakers with the mia? i know the mia have spdif out, but these speakers aren't spdif.
Click to expand...

Actually I must be S/PDIF because that's what the SB's digital out is. They just use their own proprietary connectors, the weenies. You can probably make it work fine with the Mia's S/PDIF. There was an article on one of the SB Live websites that told how to connect an ordinary S/PDIF device to the SB Live's minijack, let's see if I can find it... ah, yes, here:

http://alive.singnet.com.sg/tech/digital-io.htm

could i use the mia for recording and then route everything out the sblive for output?
Click to expand...

Sure, that's a reasonable compromise for your situation.

.i know this would kinda defeat the purpose of the mia, but even if i recorded at 16/44.1, i would still get the mia's lower signal noise and stronger input, right?
Click to expand...
It doesn't defeat the purpose at all -- your recordings will be made better, you will definitely get the improvements of the Mia's specs in your recording. Even if you played them out the computer speaker the recorded data itself is still intact.
 
AlChuck said:
could i use the mia for recording and then route everything out the sblive for output?

Sure, that's a reasonable compromise for your situation.

i know this would kinda defeat the purpose of the mia, but even if i recorded at 16/44.1, i would still get the mia's lower signal noise and stronger input, right?

It doesn't defeat the purpose at all -- your recordings will be made better, you will definitely get the improvements of the Mia's specs in your recording. Even if you played them out the computer speaker the recorded data itself is still intact.
Click to expand...

one more question about this... obviously since the mia is a more powerful soundcard, i will be able to have more tracks being played back simultaneously along with more directx or vst plugins working without dropouts in comparison to the sblive (correct me if i'm wrong please.)

however, if i choose to record with the mia and out with the sblive, i will be using the sblive to process the sound, no? thus i will not receive any of the mia's digital processing capabilities. is that correct?
 
Mia? Digital signal processing capabilities? I didn't know it had any beyond the ordinary routing of signals. That is what you mean by "obviously since the mia is a more powerful soundcard..."

If it has DSP, it would only have its own proprietary effects, like the Aardvark DirectPro. If you use those instead of plug-ins you would have used otherwise, then yes, you might "be able to have more tracks being played back simultaneously along with more directx or vst plugins working without dropouts in comparison to the sblive..."

I just looked at the Echo website, and I think the DSP they tout is just the hardware mixing capability, which is basically the same as that of the Audiophile or Delta and most other cards in that proce range. So, since everything is host-based, you probably won't do any better with tracks and plug-ins than you could with the SB Live. Sorry. And there is nothing therefore disadvantageous about using the SB Live outputs except that the Mia's D/A converters are probably better.
 
one more question about this... obviously since the mia is a more powerful soundcard, i will be able to have more tracks being played back simultaneously along with more directx or vst plugins working without dropouts in comparison to the sblive (correct me if i'm wrong please.)
Click to expand...

The Mia can play back several tracks simultaneously (4 or 8 I think) but the directx and vst plugins are being processed by your CPU and OS I think, not the soundcard(s); or am I the one that's mistaken... hmmm... it would be nice to get a definitve answer on that one.

however, if i choose to record with the mia and out with the sblive, i will be using the sblive to process the sound, no? thus i will not receive any of the mia's digital processing capabilities. is that correct?
Click to expand...

In that case, the SBlive is only doing D/A conversion on the data you recorded from the Mia A/D conversion. This signal is only used to make your speakers work, and the original WAV recorded from the Mia chipset remains intact. So in theory it wont sound as good to *you*as if you were using the Mia outputs, but the sounds stored in your computer are still the Mia recordings.

-Shaz
 
Shazukura,

The DirectX and VST plug-ins are running on the host computer, but of course my statement is noy in any way definitive...

-AlChuck
 
So as far as getting more simultaneous playback out of the Mia, trackwise without dropout, the Mia isn't going to help there?

What is the next step up (any brand) that would offer me that?

I can get maybe 11 tracks simultaneous right now... I was hoping for 20 with a better sound card.
 
So as far as getting more simultaneous playback out of the Mia, trackwise without dropout, the Mia isn't going to help there?

What is the next step up (any brand) that would offer me that?
Click to expand...

Well, no card can help there, unless you can offload some of the tasks to it. The Aardvark DirectPro has DSP effects, so if they worked for you, you could apply those instead of plug-ins, hence freeing up some system resources. The effects are fixed, I believe, you cannot load others into the card. That card is roughly in the $500 range. The next thing I can think of is a Creamware card, also with DSP, that can run some TC Electronics effects and some others. I believe these can be loaded into the card so it's more flexible than the DirectPro, but they are not DirectX or VST, they a re a Creamware proprietary format. That card is over $1000.

The only thing that can help in a host-based system is a faster, more bodacious host. Faster CPU, faster front-side bus, more RAM, faster hard drive.

Of course you can also pre-mix -- print the effected tracks to other tracks and archive the originals (in case you want to come back to them uneffected later).
 
I guess I'm mistaken somehow, but my buddy has an Echo Gina and he can have about 14 tracks simultaneously playing on Cakewalk with compression on each track without a dropout, whereas I can squeak out 12 with comp on maybe 3 of them. With the exception of the sound card, his setup has less RAM, slower hard drive and slower processor. Are there any other explanations for that?
 
Yeah, I was thinking that 11 did sound a bit on the low side.

But not necessarily. It depends on many things:

  • the plug-ins themselves (some are written so they are very "tight" and resource-efficient, some not; some, like reverb, are by nature more complex in the first place and so naturally more resource-intensive)
  • whether the tracks are 16-bit or 24-bit resolution, whether they're 44.1 or 48 or 96 kHz sampling rate
  • whether the PC has been well-optimized -- there are a hundred tweaks, and a million variables in the PC that can affect this. Hev you gone through any of the system tweaking tips out there and checked whether any made a difference before and after?
  • whether or not the earth's spin is carrying you in the same direction as the solar system's passage through the galaxy or not

Well, maybe not the last thing, though it seems like it sometimes :)
 
Riku said:
Are you using the same compressor plugin?

Are all those tracks in both cases 24/96?
Click to expand...

Actually, they are 16/44.1 and yes, they are all the same compressor.

No, I haven't done any tweaking yet. When using a seperate drive for audio, though, how much depends on the original drive where the sequencer is located and how much depends on the audio drive?
 
I'm no master of that tweaking side but it sounds like the problem might be there. Would one of those Tweakers in here help clazymike to optimize his system???

You should start with giving us the specs of your system...
 
My specs:

P3-700 Mhz on an Intel 815 Board
384MB RAM
40GB 7200RPM IBM Deskstar (main drive)
120GB 7200RPM Western Digital Caviar (audio drive)
SBLive! Value (soon adding an Echo Mia)
Windows 2000
Cakewalk PA9

Can you suggest any websites that I can read up on pertaining to tweaking?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top