Joemeek compressor question
- Thread starter Henrik
- Start date
alanhyatt
PMI Audio Group
Henrik said:
Henrik,
Here are some of the differences. The TWINQ is not exactly a true stereo unit. The dual mono compressors link, but the link is only allowing both units to share an opto device so the volume is consistant on both channels. You still have to set up both controls on each side the same. It does work, but a bit tricky. A Stereo Compressor like the SC2.2, or the SC2 is really a stereo unit, and does image better.
One other issue is the 5th position of the TwinQ's slope switch is a 15:1 ratio where the SC2.2 and SC2 stop at 10:1. The TwiQ should be thought of as dual micpre compressor eq units first, stereo compression 2nd.
I hope that helps.
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
From the manual...
THE MONO/STEREO COMPRESSORS.
The compressors on the 'TwinQ' are an advanced version of the
compressor on the VC1Q. The 5-way slope switch has been improved so
that the effective compression ratios are from approximately 2 to 1 on
position 1 up to a ratio of 15 to 1 on position 5. This high ratio makes the
unit into a limiter.
The attack characteristics have also been improved so that at minimum
attack time, the compression will be fully effective after less than 0.5
milliseconds.
The release system is the same as on the original Joemeek SC2 which has
a compound release curve: After a single sudden transient signal, the
compression releases extremely quickly. On a normal music signal the
compression releases at a speed according to the release control.
NOTE. When both attack and release are set to maximum speed (both fully
anti-clockwise), the speed of the circuit action is very much quicker than is
possible to show on conventional meter movements, so the meters cannot
register the amount of transient compression accurately.
STEREO OPERATION
When the 'link' switch is depressed (yellow light on) and the compressors
are both selected 'on', the left-hand compressor becomes the master in all
respects: The compression control, the slope, the attack and the release
act on both channels. The left-hand meter gives an indication of the
amount of compression on both channels.
NOTE. When operating in 'stereo' mode, if the right-hand meter is switched
to read compression, it will only indicate correctly if the right-hand slope
switch is selected to the same slope as the master left-hand switch.
It is recommended that when working in stereo mode, the right-hand meter
is left switched to reading the audio level at all times.
twinQCS Dual Recording Channel - User's guide
THE MONO/STEREO COMPRESSORS.
The compressors on the 'TwinQ' are an advanced version of the
compressor on the VC1Q. The 5-way slope switch has been improved so
that the effective compression ratios are from approximately 2 to 1 on
position 1 up to a ratio of 15 to 1 on position 5. This high ratio makes the
unit into a limiter.
The attack characteristics have also been improved so that at minimum
attack time, the compression will be fully effective after less than 0.5
milliseconds.
The release system is the same as on the original Joemeek SC2 which has
a compound release curve: After a single sudden transient signal, the
compression releases extremely quickly. On a normal music signal the
compression releases at a speed according to the release control.
NOTE. When both attack and release are set to maximum speed (both fully
anti-clockwise), the speed of the circuit action is very much quicker than is
possible to show on conventional meter movements, so the meters cannot
register the amount of transient compression accurately.
STEREO OPERATION
When the 'link' switch is depressed (yellow light on) and the compressors
are both selected 'on', the left-hand compressor becomes the master in all
respects: The compression control, the slope, the attack and the release
act on both channels. The left-hand meter gives an indication of the
amount of compression on both channels.
NOTE. When operating in 'stereo' mode, if the right-hand meter is switched
to read compression, it will only indicate correctly if the right-hand slope
switch is selected to the same slope as the master left-hand switch.
It is recommended that when working in stereo mode, the right-hand meter
is left switched to reading the audio level at all times.
twinQCS Dual Recording Channel - User's guide
Hi Alan,alanhyatt said:
If what you say is true (and I'm sure it is), you just did me a big favor.
I was going to sell my VC1Q and get the twin for the stereo compressor.
I seriously considered it because I didn't want a unit that I had to set up both channels of the comp the same way, plus it has the same curves as the SC2. Oh, well...
I found a SC2.2 on EBay for $425.00. SO nice!!!!
Guess I'll have to find another..
Thanx,
Carmen
Henrik
Member
alanhyatt said:
WTF! Who in this world can you trust? Not Joemeeks manual writers, that seems to be certain. Alan, I suppose it can't just be a problem with the unit you're using? I read in several reviews that all left channel compressors worked for both channels when set to stereo, but maybe they never tried it, they just read it in the manual.
If it's not stereo, I'm not getting one either.
Cheers
/Henrik
alanhyatt
PMI Audio Group
Carmen,
The VCTwinQ is an awsome unit, and you can do stereo compression, but the left side does not "really" master the right. There is a bit of setting up you have to do, but the end results is very good on the VCTwinQ for stereo operation, but you know me and my big mounth, good or bad, theirs or mine, I tell the truth, and the truth is it is not a VCA compressor, so it can't link.
The way the Joemeek Stereo units do it is by using dual ganged pots, so there is no setting up. It uses only one cell for both channels and gangs them via the pots. The Stereo Compressors are killer, and you can get pretty much the same results with the TwinQ, but you have to set both sides of the TwinQ to be the same.
regards,
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
The VCTwinQ is an awsome unit, and you can do stereo compression, but the left side does not "really" master the right. There is a bit of setting up you have to do, but the end results is very good on the VCTwinQ for stereo operation, but you know me and my big mounth, good or bad, theirs or mine, I tell the truth, and the truth is it is not a VCA compressor, so it can't link.
The way the Joemeek Stereo units do it is by using dual ganged pots, so there is no setting up. It uses only one cell for both channels and gangs them via the pots. The Stereo Compressors are killer, and you can get pretty much the same results with the TwinQ, but you have to set both sides of the TwinQ to be the same.
regards,
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
alanhyatt
PMI Audio Group
Ok guys, let me be very clear on this.
The VCTwinQ must have both left and right ratios set to the same setting. It must have the same input gain set on both channels, otherwise if you just turn up the left input, only the left input volume changes...not the right, so they must both be set. The left attack and release are masters and work for both channels, so essentially you can turn the right channel attack and release all they way to left or right, because they do not work in stereo link.
Like I said, the VCTwinQ is not a VCA compressor where true "Linking" can be performed. In Photo-Optical devices, "Linking" means the photo cell. In this case, Ted has used a Sum/Difference circuit for the compressor, but the input and output gains as well as the ratio settings must be the same. From there the attack and release control over both channels. It is not hard to set up guys, and it works very well, but it is not the ture definition of what you think is "Linking"...but it works, and works well.
As long as you know what to expect, and I don't care what the manual says, I use the unit, and if I turn up the left input gain or left output gain, the right does not move. These are the issues you have to deal with, but it does work.
The value of the TwinQ is outstanding, and it does it all...So you have to set a couple of pots when doing stereo. That is not hard at all, but I must make sure you understand that you cant shut down the right channel entirely when using it. No matter what others say, I still have my reputation, and I can't mislead you guys despite the British definition of what Linking may be. The USA definition is different.
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
The VCTwinQ must have both left and right ratios set to the same setting. It must have the same input gain set on both channels, otherwise if you just turn up the left input, only the left input volume changes...not the right, so they must both be set. The left attack and release are masters and work for both channels, so essentially you can turn the right channel attack and release all they way to left or right, because they do not work in stereo link.
Like I said, the VCTwinQ is not a VCA compressor where true "Linking" can be performed. In Photo-Optical devices, "Linking" means the photo cell. In this case, Ted has used a Sum/Difference circuit for the compressor, but the input and output gains as well as the ratio settings must be the same. From there the attack and release control over both channels. It is not hard to set up guys, and it works very well, but it is not the ture definition of what you think is "Linking"...but it works, and works well.
As long as you know what to expect, and I don't care what the manual says, I use the unit, and if I turn up the left input gain or left output gain, the right does not move. These are the issues you have to deal with, but it does work.
The value of the TwinQ is outstanding, and it does it all...So you have to set a couple of pots when doing stereo. That is not hard at all, but I must make sure you understand that you cant shut down the right channel entirely when using it. No matter what others say, I still have my reputation, and I can't mislead you guys despite the British definition of what Linking may be. The USA definition is different.
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
Henrik
Member
Hey Alan,
yeah I really appreciate your honesty here. Also, now I more understand what you were saying. I knew from before that the mic input gain buttons never are linked. It was news to me that you have to set the Slope knobs, but since these have five preset positions (right?) this should not be very difficult.
What I was concerned about was the attack and release buttons, since these don't have set positions (right?). If they weren't linked it would be pretty difficult to get them right. I thought you were saying that NONE of the compressor buttons were linked.
So I might buy the unit after all, hehe. The only thing I would have wished for is that the EQ had a sweepable mid. I suppose you can't have it all.
So, to sum this up, would you say that apart from the setting issues we have been discussing, the compressor sounds similar to the SC2.2, or is it still something different?
Also, how would you say the mic pre's of the TwinQ compares to those of the VC6Q? Is it the same chip?
Thanks
/Henrik
yeah I really appreciate your honesty here. Also, now I more understand what you were saying. I knew from before that the mic input gain buttons never are linked. It was news to me that you have to set the Slope knobs, but since these have five preset positions (right?) this should not be very difficult.
What I was concerned about was the attack and release buttons, since these don't have set positions (right?). If they weren't linked it would be pretty difficult to get them right. I thought you were saying that NONE of the compressor buttons were linked.
So I might buy the unit after all, hehe. The only thing I would have wished for is that the EQ had a sweepable mid. I suppose you can't have it all.
So, to sum this up, would you say that apart from the setting issues we have been discussing, the compressor sounds similar to the SC2.2, or is it still something different?
Also, how would you say the mic pre's of the TwinQ compares to those of the VC6Q? Is it the same chip?
Thanks
/Henrik
alanhyatt
PMI Audio Group
Henrik said:
Henrik,
I still prefer the SC2.2 for stero compression becuase it has the Dark/Normal switch, which I find very useful when doing drums. It ads another dimention to the SC2.2., but the TwinQ is 85% of the SC2.2 and it has a 15:1 slope position the SC2.2 does not have. I find that useful for limiting and heavy squashed sounds, but you can turn it back and the TwinQ is very good.
The mic pre is better than the VC6Q, it is the CS circuit, so the mic pre is better.
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group