joe meek vc6 vs rnp8380 and my mic

S

steelpetals

New member
hello,
I thought you might be able to help me. I have a joe meek vc6 meekbox and a at3525 condensor mic. I'm having a bit of trouble with vocals in the sense that warmth seems a bit lacking. My room is acoustically treated but nonetheless I feel as though I'm coming up short. I have heard that the new FMR rnp8380 is gaining popularity amongst recordists. Am I better of dumping the meek and buying one of these or is my mic selection potentially the problem? If so, any ideas?
Thanks,
Blake
 
"Warmth" is a fairly useless word, because it means different things to different people. First, what is this mic/pre combo plugged into? You can take the cleanest signal on earth and plug it into a cheap soundcard or a cassette 4-tracker and make it sound like shit.
Also, it gets more difficult to diagnose, because certain mics/pres just suit certain singers, and some don't. Also, some mics do or don't sound good with certain pres. Now, I have to extrapolate here a little. I'm quite familiar with Joemeek products, especially their optical compressors, but I've only read the specs and some reviews on the VC6. My first guess is that the RNP is simply a better preamp to begin with. However, "warmth" is exactly what the Joemeek compressor does well. It tends to act as a filter, and it does change sound even when the compressor's not doing anything, just because it's turned on.
Try this- turn on the compressor and set compression all the way down, slope all the way up. Attack all the way up, release all the way down. Now in theory, the compressor should do nothing set that way. Now try singing into it, first with the compressor turned on, then with it turned off, and check the subtle difference.
I have to tell you, I like the Joemeek sound a lot, and I use it- a lot. However, it's wrong for some vocal tracks, and I use other preamps for them. You have to trouble shoot the signal chain one component at a time. First, you have to figure out if that AT mic will give you the sound you want plugged into anything. Have you ever gotten that sound you're looking for, and if so, what mic and pre were you using at the time? My point here is that there are lots of other components in the signal chain besides the Joemeek that may not be giving the sound you want to hear.-Richie
 
thanks for the tip. I'm using a korg d16 hard disk recorder. The preamps are fair but I suppose I'm looking to push the "pro" envelope a bit further without driving my cost up too much (isn't everyone!!!??). I have yet to find "that combination" that I like no matter what and I suppose I'm a bit inexperienced at what other LD condensors would or would not make a difference.
Blake
 
Im confused. Are you using the preamps on the Korg ("the preamps are fair") or are you using the Meek as the first posting seems to suggest.
 
The Meek VC6Q is a nice box IMO. I don' think it is your problem. You should keep it and get the RNP to compliment it.
 
the preamps on my korg unit are 'fair'. The vc6 meekbox is the preamp I'm using for snare and mainly for vocals. It sounds as though the general concensus is to keep the meekbox. So....is the AT3525 the limiting factor or should I take a bit more time to tweek the meek along with my at3525. I was possibly considering the AT4033cl. Any thoughts?
 
Sing closer. The AT is cardoid and hence should have a proximity effect, so that you get more bass when you sing closer.

Another mic to try is the SM57. Dead cheap ($90?), and "warm". I usually use my Tube MP asa preamp on vocals because it is "warm", that is it's lacking in treble, and the SM57 has a similar high-end rolloff.
 
steelpetals said:
hello,
I thought you might be able to help me. I have a joe meek vc6 meekbox and a at3525 condensor mic. I'm having a bit of trouble with vocals in the sense that warmth seems a bit lacking. My room is acoustically treated but nonetheless I feel as though I'm coming up short. I have heard that the new FMR rnp8380 is gaining popularity amongst recordists. Am I better of dumping the meek and buying one of these or is my mic selection potentially the problem? If so, any ideas?
Thanks,
Blake
Click to expand...

You have to be sure that you are by-passing your recorder/mixer's pre-amps. Some of these recorder/mixers have a XLR mic/IN and a Line (1/4") IN. On some units, these two inputs still use the unit's pre-amps. Look at your manual and see if there is a channel Insert. Your problem is (maybe) that you are still using your fostex's pre-amps. This makes your Joe Meek useless.
 
is this to say that even if I have the gain totally turned down on the korg preamps that they will still color the sound? I had not even thought of using an insert for the meekbox
Blake
 
I checked and I have no insert points. The line in and mic inputs coexist together. With the gain all the way down on the Korg, I'm fairly certain I'm not using the korg preamps.
 
steelpetals said:
is this to say that even if I have the gain totally turned down on the korg preamps that they will still color the sound? I had not even thought of using an insert for the meekbox
Blake
Click to expand...

Gain is the electrical boosting of the signal. The PATH is always through active devices (transistors, op-amps, etc.) An insert bypasses the pre-amp path altogether. Just because the gain knob reads zero, does not mean that the path through the pre-amp is bypassed. It just means that the gain is unity. Unity gain is a 1:1 (usually). The pre-amp path makes an outboard pre-amp fairly useless. I read your manual and there is no reference to using an outboard pre. Maybe someone who is familiar with this unit (or Fostex) can help you.

Good Luck.
 
steelpetals said:
the preamps on my korg unit are 'fair'. The vc6 meekbox is the preamp I'm using for snare and mainly for vocals. It sounds as though the general concensus is to keep the meekbox. So....is the AT3525 the limiting factor or should I take a bit more time to tweek the meek along with my at3525. I was possibly considering the AT4033cl. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

Yes, tweek the Meek. And different vocalist's and styles may require different settings. I've got a 4033 and love it. I think the 4033 is now replaced by the 4050? Not 100% sure on that. One thing I was doing wrong with my VC6Q is running the compressor too high. Things got better once I backed that off some.
 
Do you have any aux or effects inputs? You might try plugging the preamp into that to bypass the preamp circuits.
 
thers is a way to conect an external effects unit through what the korg refers to as "sub inputs" that are directed directly towards the master bus. I believe this may be the only option I have.
Blake
 
You can't bypass the pres on your Korg. turn the trim all the way down. This does not make an outboard pre useless but I'm sure it would be better to bypass the preamp stage in the recorder. A good outboard will still make a huge difference.
 
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