Jars, Bells, and you

laj35

laj35

New member
So I haven't been back here in quite a while, switched coasts again and yada yada. It's been a really long time since I've put anything up for review and I think I/we've come pretty far since then.

Anyways, the main track I'd love opinions on is "Jars & Bells & You" which is one of the first re-attempts at doing vocals again, this time with the (more) polished sequenced stuff. I think this one is about as good as I'm capable right now with know-how and setup. Would really love production thoughts (ie pannings, volumes, etc).

Oh and I know I probably won't get many hits right off, but I'll be reviewing whenever I have time to get some returns.

laj


"Slash 107" is also fairly new and is a pretty cool track as well if you get a chance.
 
laj - you forgot to include a link in your post!

Anyway, I got it off one of your other posts - its here

http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=1335&alid=-1

How long did this take you? There's an entire major international incident going on in this track ;) Very inventive, very interesting rhythmic things going on there. Not my genre and I don't feel qualified to make constructive comments - I felt that there was a bit too much going on in the high frequencies in the early part of it, was very interested how you used the delay, would have liked a more solid bass.

I hope you get some more listens and posts - good stuff.
 
Ok here goes pal... see your influenced by Radiohead ....can only be a good thing :)

Long silence at the start ...can just make out some sounds ...might wanna raise the levels there... some atmospheric jungle type effects

Love those drums coming in... the sound of the snare is really dramatic, got me in anticipation of the coming minutes. Ohhh those keys/piano? that comes in are beautiful, got me somewhere else for a second... you may have to up the levels certainlly on the 4 mins ...i not listening all that loud but i shouldn't have to strain at this level.

Vocals remmind me of the trainspotting theme, Underworld - Born Slippy i think ....the vocals could be better.. i can sense you seem uncomfortable and unconfident in the vocals.. voice aint bad ...just need to keep it in tune a little... i do like how they come in ...fadeing in. nice.

Im still waiting for some track progression ...some hard drums to kick in. Kinda left me waiting for something that never came.... a nice track but never really took off.
 
Cool, you guys checked this out for me.

Gotta say, as I should've in the first place (let alone post the link, errrrr??!??!!) this is not by any means a final mix, sooo the volume in general is flat and the annoying high frequencies (though an unfortunate trademark of mine) are not so permanent.

Garry, this one has about 40 hours (roughly into it), and yes it's a major international incident here! The delays are an icident all their own. I recorded alot of it using two Kaoss (KP 1 & 2...ooohh..aaahh..) pads and a Digitech RP-80, then brought em into Cubase and used various delays in there and processed each track in Wavelab individually, warranting even more delays at times). The bassline is my first attempt at playing and recording a "real" (ie not sampled) bass so maybe you have some ideas on how to make it work more. Thanks alot for listening man.

Absense, f#@&in love that you hear the Radiohead connection, they are my life-blood, gurus, dudes straight saved my life, so that to me is a huge compliment. Your comments are pretty spot on too. I am really unconfident/uncomfortable with my vocals and am really untrained in keepin in tune. Fact is I'm really just starting to try out the whole vocal thing as it seems a lot of people, specially Americans NEED the words to have any connection to it. I usually just keep it all instrumental, but sometimes the words flow and I'm compelled, ya know? As for the volumes your right, I have yet to do any "mastering" so the whole thing is super quiet, which will be fixed. As for the whole track progresion, I tried to do that with the second break, any ideas?? Thanks again for checking this out for me, we should keep in touch maybe even collaborate sometime, but I think our ears ride the same waves.

laj
 
I argree with absense I was looking for some heavy drums to come in but as far as the track concept goes.....One word man AWESOME!
 
Absense, f#@&in love that you hear the Radiohead connection, they are my life-blood, gurus, dudes straight saved my life, so that to me is a huge compliment. Your comments are pretty spot on too. I am really unconfident/uncomfortable with my vocals and am really untrained in keepin in tune. Fact is I'm really just starting to try out the whole vocal thing as it seems a lot of people, specially Americans NEED the words to have any connection to it. I usually just keep it all instrumental, but sometimes the words flow and I'm compelled, ya know? As for the volumes your right, I have yet to do any "mastering" so the whole thing is super quiet, which will be fixed. As for the whole track progresion, I tried to do that with the second break, any ideas?? Thanks again for checking this out for me, we should keep in touch maybe even collaborate sometime, but I think our ears ride the same waves.
Click to expand...

Indeed mate i'd love to collaberate... im really into akward electronic, think el p. Just to clarify i wasn't telling you not too sing ...in fact a i think you should and vocals are really something you just become more comfortable with. So just keep at it and i promise it'll come

..you'll hate your voice, get used to it, begin liking it... love it and use it to its best.

Doesn't come overnight, but it will. Let me know if you have any messenger ...MSN, AIM ?

G'luck with the final version.
 
Very cool tune. As Garry said it's very creative !

Maybe the vocals should come down a bit as I'm thinking they should be there to compliment the track.

Other than that I cant think of any major issues. I love all the percussion going on and the little ending. I love listening to instrumentals..

Thanks for the listen man !

Dave
 
The phrasing in the decending vocal line reminded me of "the chaufer" by depeche mode.
The music, while definetly being its own incarnation, did remind me of the "KID-A" vibe quite a bit.

Sorry if im pigeonholing too much.
I enjoyed it quite a bit.
 
Thanks a ton for takin the time fellas.

Bigwillz, you got any ideas on how to make the beat bigger?

Vestast, yeah you're right with the levels on the vocals, they are definitely meant to be a sort of complementary part, and need some re-working in general. I'm in the process of doing a final mixdown of the tune and then am going to work on the final take(s) of the vocals, which should sure up the track levels, thanks for listening.

Finster, though I can't remember "the chauffuer" vocal line, I have always somewhat modeled my vocals after Gahan's, as his mastery of the whole deep baritone thing is perfect to me, and maybe the only way I can actually sound acceptable. Don't worry about the whole pigeonholing thing, honestly if there is in any way a comparison to Depeche Mode, and Radiohead, especially Kid A, than I am a happy man. Thanks again for listening.

laj35
 
I'm loving this

sorry, I'm not qualified to offer any kind of advice on production but it sounds great

to create that level of ambience in a peice of music takes a great deal of talent

A+
 
laj35 said:
Finster, though I can't remember "the chauffuer" vocal line, I have always somewhat modeled my vocals after Gahan's, as his mastery of the whole deep baritone thing is perfect to me, and maybe the only way I can actually sound acceptable. Don't worry about the whole pigeonholing thing, honestly if there is in any way a comparison to Depeche Mode, and Radiohead, especially Kid A, than I am a happy man. Thanks again for listening.

laj35
Click to expand...

Try sending the kick and snare to one stereo aux fader.
and then compress them both in a way that the compseeor pumps WITH the beat.
Like a 10:1 (or lower, some ppl like 4:1) ratio, maybe -3to-6 db of attenuation.
Start with a long attack and short relaese and work your way in from there until you can hear/see the compressor pumping with the beat.
Now make up the gain that youre attenuating.
Provided you did it right, your drums should sound more "robust".

P.S. you can also add the bass guitr into that aux fader and really make the rythm section "pump".
Good luck.
 
not qualified to comment on Electronic but my attention span didn't make it thru the 7 min.s of Bells, 107 was more interesting. Very smooth sounds, I have no idea how you get that stuff, but it's very high quality and mixed well. I'll now have to go search for some Radiohead....
 
xfinsterx said:
Try sending the kick and snare to one stereo aux fader.
and then compress them both in a way that the compseeor pumps WITH the beat.
Like a 10:1 (or lower, some ppl like 4:1) ratio, maybe -3to-6 db of attenuation.
Start with a long attack and short relaese and work your way in from there until you can hear/see the compressor pumping with the beat.
Now make up the gain that youre attenuating.
Provided you did it right, your drums should sound more "robust".

P.S. you can also add the bass guitr into that aux fader and really make the rythm section "pump".
Good luck.
Click to expand...

I'm gonna have to try that one.... Still learning that fine art of compression.

(Quote)"Bigwillz, you got any ideas on how to make the beat bigger?"(/Quote)

Personally I'm no expert in the realm of this music but seeing as how everything in the mix is so ambient you could probably try taking some of the ambience away from the drum tracks as they progress and bring them forward in the mix
OR...
double the drum tracks and take away the ambience to the tracks you copied then mix them back in more than likely your gonna have to bring the drums down a bit because they are gonna get louder than anything you got in the mix...
OR...
hiphop producer Timbaland calls it the Double Beat.... I'm not sure I can describe it but here goes.... Create a Kick Snare drum loop at the same BPM as you song but alter it so that it is differant from your original drum track and place it in the song at different parts usually when i try this i try to match the drums to some other instrument in the mix it works for me sometimes sometimes it doesn't but i'm not Timbaland
 
Phew, thanks alot for listening fellas, and for the great advice.

Kevin, glad you liked it man, and this isn't just to you, but really some of the best critiques to/for me come from people who don't normally listen to these types of tunes, because they/you are more apt to be straight-forward about what they didn't like about a song, or when they got bored, or if it was too intrusive, yada, yada.

So, thanks junplugged for listening, and you should definitely go and get some Radiohead, I lean more towards Kid A, but no doubt OK Computer is their mos "important," and very guitar-oriented, rock and roll, with Pink Floyd-esque turciary loveliness.

Bigwillz, I think I got you with the whole taking away the ambience deal, and I think that would work for sure, probably for like a minute during the break at 3:20, or so, which is when the beat is supposed to get really big. In terms of the Timbaland thing, this interests me. I've tried similar things, but am curious if you, or him, use the loop mostly to accent breaks, or just let it fly the [whole] track? Thanks again for checking back man, really appreciate it.

Finster, now this is some nice advice, for which I'm real thankful. That said my ignorance, especially with terminology, shines through. I'm not sure by what you mean when you say: "Try sending the kick and snare to one stereo aux fader." I'm using cubase5.1 as my recording platform, and wavelab for individual wav processing. These to do any and all compression, and it's all after the fact, as I have no hardware comps. I mainly use waves plugs, the C4, and me comp primarilly for compression, and often me loudness maximizer. So, w/in cubase there is a function called, I think, building groups (?) is this how I would asign them to one aux fader? Should I first (assuming that I figure out what you mean) undo all the previous compressing on said parts? Am I an idiot? Wait don't answer that... Oh, and I'd definitely add the bass to that mix, I think it needs to come out more. How about the vocals, any tips on compressing them? Thanks again for listening (again) man, it's really appreciated and really helpful.

laj
 
Hey Guys,

Just updated the song, tried messing around with the bassline. Re-recorded the vocals, though I can't seem to make them stand out, any ideas? Still working on ways to make the beat bigger around 3:20. Any thoughts would be much appreciated as usual.

laj
 
nice stuff. I am a sucker for ambient/electronic kind of stuff. I'd like to hear things progress a little faster, otherwise in kinda relagates it to background mood music. Recorded and mixed well. Nice reverbs.
 
!

Very cool song!

I'm nowhere near qualified to comment on your recording/mixing technique, but it sounds very impressive to me.

Have to agree with whoever said it, the vocals instantly sound "Underworld" to me, but that's a good thing.
 
Thanks for listening fellas.

Mixmkr, glad you got a chance to listen and you thought the reverbs are nice. I've always considered you the biggest verb advocate around and have hence come to love them, so thanks again!

johannp, thaks for checking it out, must say I've never listened too much or any Underworld, though I know they are somewhat popular, will have too check them out as many have mentioned the similarity.

.....thanks again for the time guys!

laj




---->finster, bigwillz, any new ideas?
 
Very nice... my kinda stuff this!

Would have brought it down somewhere with some sort of low level bass throb to give it some grounding, but not something that would overpower it all.


PS: 'The Chauffuer' is a Duran Duran number.
 
Thanks for listening Budo.

I've considered putting something like that in, made an effort at some point to make the entire line be a sort of extreme low-end rumble. Didn't really work at the time, though now, in the background it might, thanks for the idea man! Would you think I should use the elec bass, or some synth sub shaking stuff?

laj
 
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