I'm not sure if I would call this a Sonar, Midi, ESQ-1 or Reason Issue but PleaseHelp

X man Da Legend

X man Da Legend

New School Boom Bap
I am using an ensoniq esq-1 with Reason 3 and a Roland Juno 2. I sequence on the ESQ-1 and I would like to track my audio to Sonar Home Studio. Is there anyway I can record the Midi from Reason that I recorded into my ESQ1 and rewire it in a way that I can record audio directly to Sonar?
 
Is it the midi data generated from Reason (in the form of a Standard Midi File) or the audio from Reason that you are concerned with syncing?

In Sonar 6 Producer Edition you just plug in external gear to the designated midi out and go, but as I remember it wasn't so simple at the time of Sonar Home Studio 4. Not having a copy here makes it even more difficult to look at this question from the Sonar angle. You can do yourself some good by looking at the manual and seeing if it even mentions ReWire, which is what the Propellerheads call syncronizing two audio applications on the same computer.

Also, I understand that there is a certain charm to using a 20 year old keyboard for sequencing but if you learn to sequence on the computer you will find a whole new world of tools available to you as well as no more pesky memory limitations. For now, put the ESQ-1 in external sync/external clock mode. Back in the day keyboard workstations only supported midi clock as a sync standard, so if you have a choice in Sonar Home Studio choose that. Then you should be able to at least have sync between the computer and the Ensoniq, so connect the audio outs from both to your mixer and you should be ready to go.

If Sonar Home Studio does support ReWire, just follow the instructions to get both programs going at once. The outputs from the computer will have the audio from both Sonar and Reason.



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ssscientist said:
Is it the midi data generated from Reason (in the form of a Standard Midi File) or the audio from Reason that you are concerned with syncing?

In Sonar 6 Producer Edition you just plug in external gear to the designated midi out and go, but as I remember it wasn't so simple at the time of Sonar Home Studio 4. Not having a copy here makes it even more difficult to look at this question from the Sonar angle. You can do yourself some good by looking at the manual and seeing if it even mentions ReWire, which is what the Propellerheads call syncronizing two audio applications on the same computer.

Also, I understand that there is a certain charm to using a 20 year old keyboard for sequencing but if you learn to sequence on the computer you will find a whole new world of tools available to you as well as no more pesky memory limitations. For now, put the ESQ-1 in external sync/external clock mode. Back in the day keyboard workstations only supported midi clock as a sync standard, so if you have a choice in Sonar Home Studio choose that. Then you should be able to at least have sync between the computer and the Ensoniq, so connect the audio outs from both to your mixer and you should be ready to go.

If Sonar Home Studio does support ReWire, just follow the instructions to get both programs going at once. The outputs from the computer will have the audio from both Sonar and Reason.



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I can sequence on computers. I've used Reason's sequencer for years. Since Ive gotten these boards I have also used Sonar's sequencer but I don't really care for linear sequencing. As opposed to pattern sequencing which is why I want to use the ESQ-1 sequencer. I have Reason slaved to my ESQ-1 and I make my songs without Sonar in the beginning and I just want to track the audio to Sonar for mixing. I am not using a mixer and Home Studio 4 does support rewire and I have them both going at once. The problem lies more so in that I am not sure how to dump the midi notes into sonar and I know when I tried to bounce my midi to audio from either of my boards it didn't work the same way it would with vsti.
 
The problem lies more so in that I am not sure how to dump the midi notes into sonar and I know when I tried to bounce my midi to audio from either of my boards it didn't work the same way it would with vsti.
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As far as I can see there's no reason to want to 'bounce (your) midi to audio'.

You have three separate pieces here --- the ESQ-1 for midi sequencing, Reason for providing midi sounds and Sonar for audio recording. Together they make a whole package and it makes sense now that you would prefer the ESQ-1 for midi sequencing. I prefer the MPC-1000 for very similar reasons and use it for midi sequencing all the time.

If you've already got both Sonar and Reason going and all you need to do is add audio, do that within Sonar while listening to the Reason backing track thru the headphone jack of your interface in the case of vocals or over speakers in the case of direct or mic'ed instruments like guitar, bass, percussion or keyboards.

Hope this answers your question --- if not, post again and we'll talk more.



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ssscientist said:
As far as I can see there's no reason to want to 'bounce (your) midi to audio'.

You have three separate pieces here --- the ESQ-1 for midi sequencing, Reason for providing midi sounds and Sonar for audio recording. Together they make a whole package and it makes sense now that you would prefer the ESQ-1 for midi sequencing. I prefer the MPC-1000 for very similar reasons and use it for midi sequencing all the time.

If you've already got both Sonar and Reason going and all you need to do is add audio, do that within Sonar while listening to the Reason backing track thru the headphone jack of your interface in the case of vocals or over speakers in the case of direct or mic'ed instruments like guitar, bass, percussion or keyboards.

Hope this answers your question --- if not, post again and we'll talk more.



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I don't have the I/O or mic available for that. What I have listed is what I have available. Isn't there a way to bounce the audio from reason directly inside of Sonar? I can record the audio tracks from my esq1 just fine but its getting the audio from reason thats giving me issues.
 
If Sonar and Reason are syncronized over ReWire and you can record the ESQ-1 to Sonar I don't know why you would want to print / record / freeze the nice, flexible midi tracks to inflexible audio tracks.

If you leave Reason sync'd over ReWire you have the flexibility to change sounds a lot or just a little right up until you consider it your final mix. Even if your version of Sonar allows you to record Reason tracks as audio and you figure out how to do it, I would advise against it.

One piece of software that CAN do what you're asking is called Reaper. Google it, download the most current version and use it for 30 days, and if you like it as much as I do it's only a $40 to buy a license. There's even a forum for it on this very site...


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ssscientist said:
If Sonar and Reason are syncronized over ReWire and you can record the ESQ-1 to Sonar I don't know why you would want to print / record / freeze the nice, flexible midi tracks to inflexible audio tracks.

If you leave Reason sync'd over ReWire you have the flexibility to change sounds a lot or just a little right up until you consider it your final mix. Even if your version of Sonar allows you to record Reason tracks as audio and you figure out how to do it, I would advise against it.

One piece of software that CAN do what you're asking is called Reaper. Google it, download the most current version and use it for 30 days, and if you like it as much as I do it's only a $40 to buy a license. There's even a forum for it on this very site...


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ive used Reaper I didn't care for it too much. I also think you are missing what my goal here is. I am only using Sonar to host the audio files for storage and mixing. To be quite honest I hate linear sequencing and only want to arrange midi notes ect in Sonar as an absolute last resort. I am much more comfortable arranging inside of the keyboard itself as well. I just love the sounds from Reason and wish I could get them to play nice with one another
 
X man Da Legend said:
I also think you are missing what my goal here is.
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I think you are resisting the obvious here.

Let's step back a minute and take stock of the situation.

You prefer the ESQ-1 for it's pattern based midi sequencing. You have been successful using the ESQ-1 to drive Reason. You're comfortable with your workflow and I'm not going to tell you to change ANYTHING about the way you work. All I can do is offer suggestions.

Suggestion one --- give Reaper another chance, but approach it as you say you intend to approach Sonar --- to host the audio files for storage and mixing. It may even - although I've never tried it - allow you to record the audio from Reason into a track or series of tracks.

Suggestion two --- these are computer programs you are working with. If you're willing to take my suggestion and leave the ReWire link in place, my solution to the 'ReWired Reason file name' dilemma is to make it crystal clear in the file name what other audio application it was syn'ced to, what the name of the project is and to always include a date. An example --- 'Rose03-RWSonar 8-30-07' is a name that contains no 'XP prohibited' characters but gives all the into to recreate the mix if needed.


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X-man --- if you're still with me and I hope you are...

I think I have a solution that you'll like. I was working with Reason tonight and when it came time to export an audio file of my project it hit me that I could recommend to you that you do the same.

Export a wav file from your Reason tracks and import it into Sonar. That will give you what you're after --- a single file for storage and mixing.


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thanks but due to the fact that im sequencing on the esq-1 that would eliminate that option as well even tho I did try it. I did realise something tho. I think my soundcard has a lot to do with this issue. my soundcard has been working as a thru box but hasn't been sending any midi of any sort to the computer. I have happen to have 2 pairs of uno cables (Midi to usb) when I connected them to the pc and attempted to do the same thing Sonar reacted to atleast one midi track. I still gotta work the bugs out but I think my soundcard is probabaly the issue. I've had it for 3 years its time for an upgrade anyway
 
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