I have been trying to record for ages and I cant!!

B

bluepowder

New member
Hey guys,
Guitarist here interested in recording my solo stuff and sharing it with the world but I just cant seem to get a song recorded well.

What am I using??


Computer:
Core 2 duo
4 gb RAM
Creative X-Fi soundcard
Creative 5.1 speakers

Softwares
Fruity Loops 4
Cool Edit Pro
EZ Drummer

Other Equipment:
Shure SM 58
Line 6 toneport UX1

I record my guitars and bass with mic'd amps
I record piano parts using Fruity Loops plugins and I generally mix using cool edit pro(havent figured out how to record instruments and mix using fruity loops)

Ok now here is the thing....I follow the basics when it comes to recording...I record using my toneport(should i go straight into soundcard?)

I mic the amps near the cone for a warmer sound....the clips come out ok but not great....(maybe its cos of the toneport)

when it comes ot mixing...im completely lost....everything sounds cluttered and all over the place....:(...I want my mixes to sound like Joe satriani's newer stuff.

How do I learn? Where do i begin?? I have 8 songs composed but none recorded...so im incredibly frustrated:)...can u tell?:D

Any help is appreciated...
 
is a toneport a DI/amp modeler?

are you useing a pre-amp before your soundcard? i guess you are if your recording mic'ed amps.

make sure you are recording at a good quality setting, 48kHz 24bit.

mixing seems to be the problem here. all you can do is practice, i think the main things to look at are, level (volume), panning (left and right), EQ, then effects and reverbs later.

in my opinion mixing many electric guitars and basses is very difficult, think of trying to find 'a space' for each instrument in the mix. using a spectrum analyser plug in can help by showing the current EQ of a given track. with guitars you should try and eq them all slightly different so they dont add up, also panning similar sounds can seperate them. start with one, get the sound you want, then add another and another so on always trying to keep everything audible and seperate. remember electric guitars dont need to fill the whole eq spectrum, it will likley get muddy when a bass is added if you do.

as for fake drums, well i dont think you will ever make them sound good.

:)
 
Monitoring and the room. And the Creative stuff to a smaller extent...

A 5.1 gaming system is for gaming -- It's to make pretty much everything, no matter how bad it might sound, sound like everything else (no matter how good it might sound).

Some decent monitoring and at least a minimal application of BROADBAND absorption (i.e., NOT a bunch of foam, or carpeting, or egg cartons and drink holders) should be the absolute top priority on ANYONE's list.

You can not tweak what you can not hear, period. You will only ever hear as good as your monitoring chain allows you to. Your monitoring will only ever be as accurate as the room allows them to.

Everyone says there are no "rules" in audio -- There are a few to chew on.
 
Keep in mind... recording yourself is harder than recording someone else. I'm a guitarist also, nor a great one but I play better than a lot of people I've recorded. It's usualy a lot easier to record (and make sound decent) another guitar player than it is to record my own stuff. The interesting thing is I have played on other people's recordings in other studios and other people make me sound better than I seem to be able to when recording myself. Whenever someone else records me, I pay cloce attention to what and how they do it then try their ideas when I get back to my humble little studio.
 
bluepowder said:
I record my guitars and bass with mic'd amps

Ok now here is the thing....I follow the basics when it comes to recording...I record using my toneport(should i go straight into soundcard?)
Click to expand...

Are you micing your guitars, then sending the signal through the toneport? The toneport's probably unecessary. Get a decent mic preamp if you don't have one. The Creative card have a preamp built in, but they aren't too great. If you can afford it, I would advise getting a new soundcard that's more geard towards audio production. Don't get me wrong, the Creative stuff is great for gaming and movies, I have one myself, but they aren't too hot for recording. You can get a reasonably decent card for a lot less than a Creative card costs.

elly-d said:
as for fake drums, well i dont think you will ever make them sound good.
Click to expand...

This isn't true. It just takes a lot of time and attention to detail. All my drums are done with battery, and I think they sound pretty good. It's just that I spend more time on the drums than I do on anything else...much more time. A lot of people don't want to put that sort of time into it, and the results therefore don't come out as good.
 
elly-d said:
is a toneport a DI/amp modeler?

are you useing a pre-amp before your soundcard? i guess you are if your recording mic'ed amps.

make sure you are recording at a good quality setting, 48kHz 24bit.

mixing seems to be the problem here. all you can do is practice, i think the main things to look at are, level (volume), panning (left and right), EQ, then effects and reverbs later.

in my opinion mixing many electric guitars and basses is very difficult, think of trying to find 'a space' for each instrument in the mix. using a spectrum analyser plug in can help by showing the current EQ of a given track. with guitars you should try and eq them all slightly different so they dont add up, also panning similar sounds can seperate them. start with one, get the sound you want, then add another and another so on always trying to keep everything audible and seperate. remember electric guitars dont need to fill the whole eq spectrum, it will likley get muddy when a bass is added if you do.

as for fake drums, well i dont think you will ever make them sound good.

:)
Click to expand...


Hi,

I am back after a huge hiatus....working in the IB World...the last 6 months have been a blur....as most of u must be aware of the financial crisis....

My apologies for not replying any earlier..

OK..in response to your question...

The toneport does modelling and acts as a DI too i guess...i connect into the toneport which goes into USB...



I am mic'ing my amp....shure sm58....

the drums are OK but I have not yet figured out how to get the drum sound sitting well in the mix....

i am mainly using fruity loops and cool edit pro..could you recommend a spectrum analyser plugin(free if possible)....mixing electric guitars and bass seems to be my biggest problem....
 
Massive Master said:
Monitoring and the room. And the Creative stuff to a smaller extent...

A 5.1 gaming system is for gaming -- It's to make pretty much everything, no matter how bad it might sound, sound like everything else (no matter how good it might sound).

Some decent monitoring and at least a minimal application of BROADBAND absorption (i.e., NOT a bunch of foam, or carpeting, or egg cartons and drink holders) should be the absolute top priority on ANYONE's list.

You can not tweak what you can not hear, period. You will only ever hear as good as your monitoring chain allows you to. Your monitoring will only ever be as accurate as the room allows them to.

Everyone says there are no "rules" in audio -- There are a few to chew on.
Click to expand...


I am not too sure on what broadband absorption is...but im recording in my bedroom so soundproofing would be difficult...(rented room)....

I like the sound i hear in my room....so i dont mind keeping that...

Is there any particular mic preamp that is good in a beginner range....

Also..to capture room dynamics..do i need 2 mics?
 
legionserial said:
Are you micing your guitars, then sending the signal through the toneport? The toneport's probably unecessary. Get a decent mic preamp if you don't have one. The Creative card have a preamp built in, but they aren't too great. If you can afford it, I would advise getting a new soundcard that's more geard towards audio production. Don't get me wrong, the Creative stuff is great for gaming and movies, I have one myself, but they aren't too hot for recording. You can get a reasonably decent card for a lot less than a Creative card costs.



This isn't true. It just takes a lot of time and attention to detail. All my drums are done with battery, and I think they sound pretty good. It's just that I spend more time on the drums than I do on anything else...much more time. A lot of people don't want to put that sort of time into it, and the results therefore don't come out as good.
Click to expand...

Any recommendations for mic preamp or soundcard? this particular soundcard has an audio production mode etc and is supposed to be decent...i could use an external mic preamp....preferably not too exp....
 
legionserial said:
I was going to ask something similar. There was a mention of things sounding cluttered and all over the place. Could that be a timing issue?
Click to expand...

By all over the place I meant that the mix was not gentle to my ears....every band of frequency seemed full....you know what i mean?
 
One comment about the SM58. If recording at close range this mic sounds a little boomy, which may make it crash with your bass sounds (and other sounds).

You could try one of the following:
- Record the amp at a longer distance
- Record the amp at a lower volume
- Skip the amp altogether. If the Toneport does amp modelling, you may get a better sound if recording the Toneport output directly.
 
If you're struggling with EZ drummer, then EQ is probably needed. Most frequently I need to boost the bass and cut the trebles to make it fit.

PS! Why don't you post an MP3 or two? I'm sure people can give better input if they can hear what you are hearing.
 
still at work..need to go back and dig out the mp3 i recorded...

its basically just drums and guitars right now...recorded raw...with no effects or EQ done....so i can gather feedback as to what to do with each layer of the guitar part....

will upload it onto soundclick once i go back home...or is there a better source to upload a big file like .wav
 
bluepowder said:
Any recommendations for mic preamp or soundcard? this particular soundcard has an audio production mode etc and is supposed to be decent...i could use an external mic preamp....preferably not too exp....
Click to expand...

I wouldn't pay too much attention to their touted 'audio production mode'. Sounds like a gimmick to me. You can either record and play back with it, or you can't. The problem with Soundblasters is that the converters aren't great and the latency is pretty crappy. I've heard a lot about how the 24bit converstion isn't true 24bit. One thing I did notice with mine was that what I recorded often sounded 'artifacty' (if there's such a word).

I use an M-Audio Delta 44. Cost me about £90 (not sure what that is in dollars but it's still a hell of a lot cheaper than an X-Fi). It has 4 ins, 4 outs, and the converters are pretty damn good.

When I switch from a Soundblaster (Audigy 2 ZS platinum pro) to my Delta 44, I noticed a massive difference in audio quality both going in and coming out, and my latency was way way less.

As far a preamps go, a lot of people like the DMP-3. I don't have one and have never used one, so I can't really give an opinion. I use a Joe Meek 3Q, which I like a lot. That cost me about £100. It has an optional EQ and Compressor built in, although I never use them really. You'd be better of using a mic preamp and have that go straight into the soundcard than using the toneport. If you're miking well, you don't really need to put it through a modeller.
 
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