How important are scales and theory in your guitar playing?

Do you use theory and scales in your guitar playing?

  • Total voters
    110
..'So what you are saying is you are a shit teacher then, right? Because I'm sorry, but that is a bullshit "test" for who you will teach.;






I had an argument with a teacher, who was one of my most talented guitarists ever. This was in the late 70s. He kept telling everyone that he had a student for over 12 years.

He finally had to admit that his student was his 'Cash Cow'.



I don't believe in taking advantage of people, or to take their money on false pretenses.

You, remind me of that guy.

I helped my students by teaching them everything, including guitar setup and repair.

You'll figure that out soon enough.

Until then, you're just another Internet nutjob.
 
Heavy stuff. Now I'm all confused. I suppose I suck. I can live with it though, I'm having fun.

I agree about the rhythm bit - you got it or you don't. I got lucky there. The singer in my band is awful. We call her "White Girl Rhythm Section". Tap yer foot or die (FZ). Fortunately she has a voice.


lou

PS - Scales is on fishes.
 
ocnor said:
Sorry but that's total bullshit. You are either born with a sense of timing or you are not. When my children were infants they could wave their hands in time with music. Also you can't "learn" to play with feel you either have it or you don't. That would be like "learning" to love someone which would make it artificial.
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jimistone said:
I tend to agree with this.
People that don't have natural timing or sense of melody can learn to play and they can get pretty good...but there is something missing.
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Flat, dead, and completely WRONG.

Why is it all the guys I (personally) know who say that still play the exact same shit they were playing when they were 18? And none of them have ever come up with anything of their own, either, they are just clones of who ever they happen to worship. They never grow, and they never get better.

The guys who get better are the ones who practice - they may have talent, they may not, but they certainly would never say that it was a prerequisite to being a good player.

There is something far more important than talent - call it dedication, passion, obsessive compulsive disorder, whatever, but the thing that makes a guy one of the best is practice, pure and simple. The ability to sit in a room 8-12 hours a day, and enjoy it, the ability to recognize, focus on, and eliminate your weaknesses matters more than talent. Getting up on stage and playing in front of an audience as often as possible matters more than talent. Playing with guys who are older, more experienced, and better players than yourself matters more than talent (in that, you could almost say the ability to hang maters more than talent, since that will get you more gigs).

Talent makes it easier, but the only thing that will make you one of the best is practice.

And frankly, if you are going to think of yourself as any kind of teacher, you need to learn to teach anyone, and you need to be able to teach people how to groove. That, more than anything, is where your idea that talent should be some kind of prerequisite, is a gigantic load of crap. Hell, I'm living proof on that one.

As a teen, my time was awful, and I had no groove. I loved to play, but I kind of sucked. Then, I got a couple of teachers who really made me focus on my time, told me to use a metronome any time I was practicing, to play things slowly but in perfect time before I tried to speed them up, and whacked me up side the head if they saw me play without taping my foot, and after a year of that every player I jammed with was commenting on my groove ("Holy shit man, where did you learn to groove like that," was a comment from a guy who played with Prince at the time, and who knew me well enough to know how much I had improved.) It can be learned, and it's not even all that hard to learn - you just have to work on it every second you have your instrument in your hands. And of course, have the instrument in your hands at least half your waking life. And I know many other guys who have gone through the same thing.

I unfortunately developed hand problems (mind numbing pain if I played more than about 10 minutes) that ended my playing career for 10 years, and I'm having to work on it again (I'm still better than when I was a kid, but not what I was, and my hands are in much better shape these days), but I do work on it, and I will get it back. And I know that because I've done it before.

As the old joke goes;

"How do you get to Carnegie Hall?"

"Practice, practice, practice."

Anyone who tells you differently doesn't know what they are talking about.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
cephus said:
you can't play guitar and not have rhythm. Sax, maybe. Not guitar.
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Sure, but you CAN learn it. That's my point.

Well, and you sure can't play funk sax without a groove.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
I was born without talent, rhythm or an ear for music. I'm no Vai, but i'd hope i'm more than "serviceable".

"Also you can't "learn" to play with feel you either have it or you don't."

This is the biggest load of arrogant shit i've ever read on this forum. Dare i ask how you quantify "feel" when it comes to playing guitar?
 
Light said:
Flat, dead, and completely WRONG.

Why is it all the guys I (personally) know who say that still play the exact same shit they were playing when they were 18? And none of them have ever come up with anything of their own, either, they are just clones of who ever they happen to worship. They never grow, and they never get better.

The guys who get better are the ones who practice - they may have talent, they may not, but they certainly would never say that it was a prerequisite to being a good player.

There is something far more important than talent - call it dedication, passion, obsessive compulsive disorder, whatever, but the thing that makes a guy one of the best is practice, pure and simple. The ability to sit in a room 8-12 hours a day, and enjoy it, the ability to recognize, focus on, and eliminate your weaknesses matters more than talent. Getting up on stage and playing in front of an audience as often as possible matters more than talent. Playing with guys who are older, more experienced, and better players than yourself matters more than talent (in that, you could almost say the ability to hang maters more than talent, since that will get you more gigs).

Talent makes it easier, but the only thing that will make you one of the best is practice.

And frankly, if you are going to think of yourself as any kind of teacher, you need to learn to teach anyone, and you need to be able to teach people how to groove. That, more than anything, is where your idea that talent should be some kind of prerequisite, is a gigantic load of crap. Hell, I'm living proof on that one.

As a teen, my time was awful, and I had no groove. I loved to play, but I kind of sucked. Then, I got a couple of teachers who really made me focus on my time, told me to use a metronome any time I was practicing, to play things slowly but in perfect time before I tried to speed them up, and whacked me up side the head if they saw me play without taping my foot, and after a year of that every player I jammed with was commenting on my groove ("Holy shit man, where did you learn to groove like that," was a comment from a guy who played with Prince at the time, and who knew me well enough to know how much I had improved.) It can be learned, and it's not even all that hard to learn - you just have to work on it every second you have your instrument in your hands. And of course, have the instrument in your hands at least half your waking life. And I know many other guys who have gone through the same thing.

I unfortunately developed hand problems (mind numbing pain if I played more than about 10 minutes) that ended my playing career for 10 years, and I'm having to work on it again (I'm still better than when I was a kid, but not what I was, and my hands are in much better shape these days), but I do work on it, and I will get it back. And I know that because I've done it before.

As the old joke goes;

"How do you get to Carnegie Hall?"

"Practice, practice, practice."

Anyone who tells you differently doesn't know what they are talking about.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
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Steaming pile of fail.
 
Greg_L said:
We can tell.
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Theres a link to my band in my sig, i write the songs. If you're going to throw petty insults, at least have the decency to listen and then throw some personal ones at me. I'm not sure where the respect for you on this board comes from, all i ever seem to see from you is arrogance.

Oh, and thats my brother on drums too so feel free to have a go at him while you're at it as well.
 
ocnor said:
You are either born with a sense of timing or you are not.
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The statement is far too absolute for my liking. It is not always an "either/or" situation. There are people with natural exquisite timing, and there are people with none at all. But there is a whole mess of people with a moderate amount of talent that get by pretty well.

There are some who latch onto the groove will little effort. There are others who find it more difficult, but can improve through training and practice.

Music is no different to any other pastime (making furniture, playing golf, racing a car); talent, skill, expertise and knowledge are required to get somewhere in all of these.
 
chamelious said:
Theres a link to my band in my sig, i write the songs. If you're going to throw petty insults, at least have the decency to listen and then throw some personal ones at me. I'm not sure where the respect for you on this board comes from, all i ever seem to see from you is arrogance.

Oh, and thats my brother on drums too so feel free to have a go at him while you're at it as well.
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I've checked your link before. My comment still stands. Thanks for playing.
 
Greg_L said:
I've checked your link before. My comment still stands. Thanks for playing.
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Well then lets take a listen to yours. Not that any ability you have will make you any less of a prick. You're 36? Time to grow up yeah? Start treating other people with a bit of respect maybe?
 
chamelious said:
Well then lets take a listen to yours. Not that any ability you have will make you any less of a prick. You're 36? Time to grow up yeah? Start treating other people with a bit of respect maybe?
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Who am I disrespecting? I'm just stating my opinion. Read your own sig, dummy. Isn't that what we do here? Listen away. I couldn't care less what a member of a semi-male Avenged Sevenfold lite tribute band that shops at Hot Topic thinks of me or my music. ;)
 
chamelious said:
Well then lets take a listen to yours. Not that any ability you have will make you any less of a prick. You're 36? Time to grow up yeah? Start treating other people with a bit of respect maybe?
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Well then, I suggest you start listening to Greg's stuff right now, 'cos if this forum was a kingdom, Greg would be the king........
 
Greg_L said:
Who am I disrespecting? I'm just stating my opinion. Read your own sig, dummy. Isn't that what we do here? Listen away. I couldn't care less what a member of a semi-male Avenged Sevenfold lite tribute band that shops at Hot Topic thinks of me or my music. ;)
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You don't present them as your opinion you present them as "no, this is complete rubbish, i am right", which comes across as arrogance.

Semi-male, are you now having a crack because our lead singers gay? Homophobic as well?

I resent the comparison to A7X, and i have no idea what hot topic is.
 
chamelious said:
You don't present them as your opinion you present them as "no, this is complete rubbish, i am right", which comes across as arrogance.

Semi-male, are you now having a crack because our lead singers gay? Homophobic as well?

I resent the comparison to A7X, and i have no idea what hot topic is.
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I just call it like I see/hear it, bro. No offense. I had no idea your singer was gay. How am I supposed to know that? I assumed you were all semi-male because you look like a bunch of pansy emo fashionistas. Lol @ the teased hair and white belts. But hey, when the music is uninteresting, go for the look. I totally get it. Fashion is the most important part of rock and roll.
 
Greg_L said:
I just call it like I see/hear it, bro. No offense. I had no idea your singer was gay. How am I supposed to know that? I assumed you were all semi-male because you look like a bunch of pansy emo fashionistas. Lol @ the teased hair and white belts. But hey, when the music is uninteresting, go for the look. I totally get it. Fashion is the most important part of rock and roll.
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To be fair i don't actually have a problem being described like that. As you infer/directly say a large part of being a rock band is about the image. If you think the music is uninteresting then thats fair enough. Admittedly we're not Bon Jovi just yet but you're the first person I've head describe our music like that, i'm sure you wont be the last though :)
 
chamelious said:
To be fair i don't actually have a problem being described like that. As you infer/directly say a large part of being a rock band is about the image. If you think the music is uninteresting then thats fair enough. Admittedly we're not Bon Jovi just yet but you're the first person I've head describe our music like that, i'm sure you wont be the last though :)
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I'm just busting your chops, dude. Most of my favorite bands had a "look". Ramones, Turbonegro, Misfits, AC/DC, The Clash, etc.

Their music backed it up though. ;)
 
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