how good dynamics can be??

ches1

ches1

New member
hi everyone!
a few questions here:

-I am thinking about this for a time now, vocal recording wise(rap) how good can a dynamic mic be compared to an entry-level condenser like the M-Audio Luna(I'm using this one)???

-My bedroom is untreated but it's filled with furniture+when we record we put a matress and duvet behind the vocalist, a thick carpet under him and mic and we hang 4 layer of blanket on both side with air between them by the waterpipes thats running just under the ceiling.
it kills most of the room sound very effectively but do you think it is enough to do justice to a better condenser( 700-1000$) or should I invest in a high-end condenser????? that brings my next question,

-what are the best dynamics mic on the market for recording vocal, I mean the higher-end one????
I heard about the RE20 but didn't like the bass comments, also about the sm7 is that pretty much top of the line dynamics or I am missing out


thanks for everyone taking his time to respond.
Peace.
 
SM7 is a great mic, without knowing the rest of your signal chain it is difficult to assess if a better condenser would serve you well. My guess is nah........
 
ches1 said:
-I am thinking about this for a time now, vocal recording wise(rap) how good can a dynamic mic be compared to an entry-level condenser like the M-Audio Luna(I'm using this one)???
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There are dynamic mics that will blow the doors off of some better quality condensers. Just because a mic is a dynamic doesn't mean it is something less than a condenser.
 
signal chain goes like this: M-Audio Luna-->DMP3-->TC C300(Compressor,used as a "safety"comp)-->Delta1010

what about the high-high-end dynamics mic??
 
ches1 said:
signal chain goes like this: M-Audio Luna-->DMP3-->TC C300(Compressor,used as a "safety"comp)-->Delta1010

what about the high-high-end dynamics mic??
Click to expand...

I would bypass the C300 unless you are recording somebody with bad mic technique. I record my vocalist/wife almost exclusively with dynamic mics. At first she needed compression going in but then she "learned" her mics and it isn't necessary anymore. Now I add the compression to the recorded track. This may not be best for you but I have found an improvement by going this route.

That said, yeah I prefer dynamic mics with her. After an exhausting and costly search for the perfect dynamic to suit her I have settled on a Sennheiser 441U. This mic almost sounds like a good condenser but with the qualities of the dynamic that I am seeking. This is considered one of the best dynamics by some.

I'm not sure if I would use it for male Rap or Hip Hop vocals... Whatever it takes, try as many as you can before you buy. I drove the local music store salesman nuts. They got paid at the end of the week so I have no sympathy. Also search and read as much as you can about dynamic mics here. My final decision was narrowed down nicely by folks here with advice and digging through old posts.
 
If Som hadn't said it, I would have suggested the 441.

The fact that they have excellent off-axis rejection, have an almost smooth as silk sound, 5 position bass roll-off, a treble boost switch, etc., etc., kind of puts them close to the top of the dynamic pile. The only downside is if you break the plastic mic clip, as a genuine replacement is bloody expensive.............I got mine (off Ebay) from the US and the clip needed replacing :( .

:cool:
 
Somnium7 said:
I would bypass the C300 unless you are recording somebody with bad mic technique.
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yeah my rapper is almost at the same stage at rapping that I am at recording, example: one day we tried to record a verse, punching-in at every bar, so he could sustain the last syllable as an effect. it didn't turned out well, it's hard to explain but you could exactly spot where all of the punch-in occured, like at the beggining of the bar he was closer than at the end and you could hear it I told him to stand still but it did not solve it.
anyway, now what I want to know is what are the top notch dynamics mic on the market.

Peace.
 
ches1 said:
yeah my rapper is almost at the same stage at rapping that I am at recording, example: one day we tried to record a verse, punching-in at every bar, so he could sustain the last syllable as an effect. it didn't turned out well, it's hard to explain but you could exactly spot where all of the punch-in occured,
Click to expand...

Been there - I feel you. Honestly, the only way I've found to eliminate this entirely is to record straight through from start to end. If you listen to our Sculpture of Despair you can easily hear all the punch-in problems... :eek:

like at the beggining of the bar he was closer than at the end and you could hear it I told him to stand still but it did not solve it.
anyway, now what I want to know is what are the top notch dynamics mic on the market.

Peace.
Click to expand...

I have been told by people with much better ears then mine that the Beyerdynamic M88 is killer. I haven't tried it myself though.
Other mics I have tested and liked but not enough to buy are Sennheiser MD421 (this is pretty good for male vocals), Heil PR40 and PR30, EV RE20/27, and a few other I can't remember after this many beers. ;)

Neuman has a dynamic too which is based on the Sennheiser MD-431 which I have been dying to try. BTW I almost went with the MD-431 based on advice from this forum. Apparently another great dynamic.

The RE-27 is next to be added to my collection. Very nice mic.

Remember that I rejected the mics I tested based on my vocalists needs... All were very nice.
 
Best dynamics used for vocals include:

SM7
RE-20
Sennheiser MD431
Sennheiser MD441
Beyer M88
Heil PR30

I have all of these except for the Heil. Of these, the one that gets used the most for vocals is the SM7. For vocal duties, it has beat out my more expensive condenser mics, including Neumann Gefell M582h tube, AT-4050, GT MD1a, GT MD3, and Beyer MC834 among others. It was being used so much I bought a second one.

The Beyer is nice, but has quite a bit of proximity effect. It's good with thinner voices. The MD441 and 431 sound a bit more "hifi" to my ears than the others. While I don't do rap, based on the comments that I've seen from those that do, the SM7 is probably the most popular choice there too. I'd start with that one and see how well it works with your vocalist. It has been used by lots of musicians in lots of genres - Michael Jackson, Chili Peppers, Wilco, Metallica, etc.

There's not anything better than these for dynamics, perhaps with the exception of the Neumann, although I haven't used it. I'm flagging it solely because of the name. It may not be an improvement.
 
pohaku was one of the wise and generous people that helped me in my search. I agree with what he said though I've never tried the SM7 so can't verify his claim. Based on reputation alone it's worth the effort to try it out.

I'd like to also add that there are some low budget dynamics that will also surprise you with their performance. Don't let sticker price be your only determining factor. I have found some mics for $100 and less that can be very useful depending on vocalist and application.
 
Somnium7 said:
pohaku was one of the wise and generous people that helped me in my search. I agree with what he said though I've never tried the SM7 so can't verify his claim. Based on reputation alone it's worth the effort to try it out.

I'd like to also add that there are some low budget dynamics that will also surprise you with their performance. Don't let sticker price be your only determining factor. I have found some mics for $100 and less that can be very useful depending on vocalist and application.
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How about the good old sm-57? It's one of the best and most used mics I own!
 
pohaku said:
the SM7,(...) It has been used by lots of musicians in lots of genres - Michael Jackson, Chili Peppers, Wilco, Metallica, etc.
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was it used by these bands as a vocal mic on the actual record???
if so I'll just go buy one, if these people made hits record with a sm7 the only reason I wouldn't achieve the same result is my inexperience.

xstra speacial thanks to everyone that contributed knowledge in this thread, this forum is fabolous!!

Peace and enjoy the soon to be summer,(here in the north we had the craziest winter of all time, more than 6meter of snow has falled down on our head, beleive it or not but in the snow-deposit area it will NOT entierly melt down before the NEXT winter...)
 
Yes. For example, its fairly widely known that MJ's vocals on Thriller were recorded using an SM7 - which for a time was owned by frequent poster and HomeRecording BBS sage Harvey Gerst.
 
pohaku said:
Yes. For example, its fairly widely known that MJ's vocals on Thriller were recorded using an SM7 - which for a time was owned by frequent poster and HomeRecording BBS sage Harvey Gerst.
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Nope I didn't own Bruce Swieden's SM7 that was used on Thriller, but I did have Bruce Swieden's SM7 that was used on the "Bad" album. I gave it back to Bruce.
 
Harvey Gerst said:
Nope I didn't own Bruce Swieden's SM7 that was used on Thriller, but I did have Bruce Swieden's SM7 that was used on the "Bad" album. I gave it back to Bruce.
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For some reason I thought it was the Thriller mic, not the Bad mic. A very generous gesture nonetheless Harvey. :D
 
what about SM7 with harmonica?

I asked this question in another thread, but ran across you guys talking about he SM7, so I'll ask again...I'm also looking for a vocal mic, but I'm doing folk rather than rap. My voice is not very loud (more in the talkative folk style of Dylan or Prine) I play harmonica (hanging around my neck) inbetween verses of lyrics and so I need a mic that can pick up the nuances of my comparatively quiet vocals and be able to handle a blazing harmonica (it can get very loud). Would the SM7 still be a good choice here?
 
I would think it would work fine a sm57 works good with a harmonica
Most things you would use a Sm57 for can be substuted with a SM7
guitar cabs, snare, whatever
 
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