How do YOU set up your room for guitar amp recording?

[RecordingMaster]

Just curious what everyone else does to prepare your room for recording guitar amps? Everyone has different ways of doing things (myself included), so I wanted to hear your methods. To keep it generic, let's say we are close mic'ing and maybe also an occasional distant mic (additonal) for a rock distorted guitar cab.

Since the rooms I was recording in were not "ideal" in my old studio at the old house, what I have always done in the past was put up a baffle around the guitar amp, but give it a couple feet of space around it (baffle behind the amp and to the right and left, but 4th side left open, no treatment above) with sometimes a carpet underneath and sometimes just the hard floor surface. See pic 1.

Now, with close miking, i always wondered "does it really friggen' matter if I put up baffles or not"? But to be honest, i wanted to be safe so i always set everything all up before tracking day just to be safe. I sometimes wondered afterwards "Would I have gotten more brightness without that carpet under the mic/amp"? But to be honest, I have removed it on different sessions but it's always a different player/amp/tone/song/guitar, etc so it's hard to say.

Sometimes I have put treatment around the amp, but basically just on the walls around the amp. See picture 2.

One thing I CAN attest to, which i will probably always do now, is raise the guitar amp up off the floor to reduce it's boominess. i will put it on a chair but ontop of tht chair I will have my home made Auralex Gramma riser to decouple it from the chair. If all else fails and I have no chair, I MUST use the Gramma, because I have heard the different and the clarity is just so much better with it.

Now, the biggest reason I ask is because I am currently constructing a new studio in my new home. Perhaps you have seen the thread. It will be treated with broadband absorption, diffusion (down to about 800 hz) and super chunk bass trapping. There will be a bit of room ambiance but not much, especially near the mix position, but my intention is for the room to have a good flat tone to it and not sound stuffy nor overly reverberant (since it doubles as a mix room and a tracking room). It is 30x11x7.

I know, I know, I will have to try it out, but I am wondering, with the room being treated the way it is, if I just stick a close mic up on the cab and go, if I would be happy and smooth sailing. Or wondering if I should avoid the potential room ambiance and baffle around it as I always have.

Just over thinking it as usual but looking for YOUR ideas of what you do and what you WOULD do in my room (solely based on educated guesses of course).

Thanks!

 

[Greg_L]

 

[miroslav]

If I want that really dry/close mic sound....I do this:








Otherwise, I don't do anything to the room, and these days I rarely use the tent setup when recording guitars. Instead I just stick a mic out in front of whatever amp I'm going to record, and that's it....IOW, whatever the roomm adds, is part of the sound.

 

[TyphoidHippo]

^^As goofy as it may look to some (it certainly does to me!), what Miro does there works great when close mic'ing, and I've personally rigged up similarly "homemade" looking contraptions made of blankets and rugs completely surrounding the amp and mics in the (pretty mainstream) studio I worked in for a while, too. If nothing else would do the trick in the available room at the moment the recording had to be made - that always works, even if it looks like there's some 5 year olds having a living-room campout underneath, lol.

So put me down for a +100 on that, I guess is what I'm saying, heh....it works in all the rooms I've recorded guitars in. Sounds like your new room is gonna be pretty cool, too, man - looking forward to seeing pics and hearing stuff made in it

 

[bouldersoundguy]

I see in the first pic the amp is on a chair. I would always do that if possible.

 

[RecordingMaster]

I now you're probably joking (or not), but let's say you are serious, in your modestly sized room (as fair as I remember seeing in past pics you've posted), wouldn't all that spl in the room severely impact your room's response in the tone captured?

 

[RecordingMaster]

I see in the first pic the amp is on a chair. I would always do that if possible.

Absolutely. As mentioned in my post, I will be doing that going forward whenever possible. If you look just below the amp you'll see I even have the amp on top of my pseudo "Gramma" decouplers, then on top of the chair. haha probably overkill but who wants wooden chair resonance as part of their cab's tone? lol

 

[RecordingMaster]

If I want that really dry/close mic sound....I do this:

View attachment 87094

View attachment 87095

View attachment 87096


Otherwise, I don't do anything to the room, and these days I rarely use the tent setup when recording guitars. Instead I just stick a mic out in front of whatever amp I'm going to record, and that's it....IOW, whatever the room adds, is part of the sound.

Neat. Looks like a kick drum tent! I guess in pic #1 that i posted I was kind of doing that but with way more space and nothing on top. Did you find in compariosn to when you DID do this as opposed to now, if there was any notable high frequency loss? I mean I guess all the high frequencies SHOULD be coming from the amp in the first place, like even in an an-echoic chamber. So if they are dull under a tent, that just means you need better mic placement, a brighter guitar, amp or settings or pre.

Also, I noticed you had a ribbon mic in the first pic...wouldn't putting a ribbon underneath the tent sort of defeat the whole purpose of a ribbon? (to catch rear ambiance)? Whenever I use my ribbons on anything, especially a vocal, I don't put up my homemade SE reflection filter behind the mic, because then if I did, the back half would be picking up just muffles and when combined with the front side, a duller sound than without anything behind the mic. But of course, more ambiance. If audible ambiance is not desired I'd be saying to myself "well I should use something more directional in this case".

 

[Mo Facta]

My method is quite simple. Most of the time I use one mic, an SM57, on the grille. I'll move it closer to the center of the cone for a brighter tone and closer to the edges for a darker tone. Occasionally I'll throw a second mic up there and blend the two if I feel like being clever but I only ever take a single track of the blended mics. For lead sounds I'll almost always throw up a room mic anywhere from six to 12 feet away and delay it a bit to put some air in between the guitar and the room. It works very well for that big ACDC lead.

As far as "getting a sound" goes, it's entirely up to the player. Whether it's me playing or someone else, I'll get the sound I want in the room first before I start placing mics. I'll sometimes move the amp around or get it up on a crate if I feel it's necessary. Getting it up on a crate, particularly a 4x12, helps minimize bass buildup on the floor. However, sometimes I want big bass on the guitars so often I'll leave the cab on the ground and mic the top speakers.

The amp goes as loud as it needs to to reach the proper breakup and for the room size. I like the amp to reach a point in level where the cabinet and the speakers are influencing the tone of the guitar. Often I find this is where a lot of the midrange push of the amp comes from.

Once I've got the tone I want, I mic up and move the head to the control room. From there we can make minor tone tweaks and change channels, etc.

That's about it.

Cheers

 

[miroslav]

No HF loss with the tent....it's all coming from the amp...you just don't get any room ambience.
Same thing with the ribbon mic....the sounds aren't "muffled", there's just less being reflected into the back of the ribbon with the tent. Plus, I'm adjusting the tone based on how everything sounds WITH the tent over it.

 

[Greg_L]

I now you're probably joking (or not), but let's say you are serious, in your modestly sized room (as fair as I remember seeing in past pics you've posted), wouldn't all that spl in the room severely impact your room's response in the tone captured?

No, not for me, because I close mic, and when you close mic something that's loud as shit with dynamic cardioids, you don't have to turn the mics preamp gain up much at all, thereby minimizing the mic's sensitivity to everything except for what's beating it in the face. I would say that even at low volumes a cardiod mic right on the grill isn't going to be significantly influenced by room sound. They just don't pick up signal that way.

If I were using omnis, figure-8 ribbons, or general room mics, it might be an issue, but even then I'd just move the mic(s) around until I found a good spot for it.

No room mics, no amps on chairs, no blanket tunnels, all big volume all the time with dynamic cardiods right up on the grill. Bam. Done. That's how I do it. There's no reason to get all silly for rock and roll guitars. Dial in a good sound, turn the fucking amp up, and stick a mic on it in a good spot. It's not rocket science.

 

[RecordingMaster]

No, not for me, because I close mic, and when you close mic something that's loud as shit with dynamic cardioids, you don't have to turn the mics preamp gain up much at all, thereby minimizing the mic's sensitivity to everything except for what's beating it in the face. I would say that even at low volumes a cardiod mic right on the grill isn't going to be significantly influenced by room sound. They just don't pick up signal that way.

If I were using omnis, figure-8 ribbons, or general room mics, it might be an issue, but even then I'd just move the mic(s) around until I found a good spot for it.

No room mics, no amps on chairs, no blanket tunnels, all big volume all the time with dynamic cardiods right up on the grill. Bam. Done. That's how I do it. There's no reason to get all silly for rock and roll guitars. Dial in a good sound, turn the fucking amp up, and stick a mic on it in a good spot. It's not rocket science.

Yep and that's how I'd LIKE to approach it. In my new room, I'll be less paranoid about room tone so I can have some serenity in knowing that if I need to move the mic back off the grill a little, I won't be getting a huge influx in room tone.

But as for the amp on the chair, I'm a convert. Maybe it was my old house, but a loud heavy COMBO amp on the floor made it bassy as hell...no matter how low the "low" was dialed down on the amp and no matter which amp/guitar/player/mic/pre was being tracked. Maybe it was the 100 year old basement floor foundation? Who knows.

 

[RecordingMaster]

For lead sounds I'll almost always throw up a room mic anywhere from six to 12 feet away and delay it a bit to put some air in between the guitar and the room. It works very well for that big ACDC lead.

Absolutely man! I don't put up room mics for rhythm stuff anymore because I never used them, but for leads it's killer! Although i don't f*ck with delaying it any (check phase mind you). I seemed to like (in my old room) a cardioid condensor back about 10' and raised up a little higher then the amp and pointing down towards the speaker grill. Much rather use the room mic than a fake room verb later. Or just a ribbon up close because you get the benefit of the close mic sound with the added room ambiance. i almost always use ribbons for leads now. Get it all in one mic, done.

 

[RecordingMaster]

no amps on chairs

But Micheal Wagner does it for combos! So that means you should too! kidding, kidding
En studio avec Michael Wagener - Guitare electrique - YouTube

 

[miroslav]

...if I need to move the mic back off the grill a little, I won't be getting a huge influx in room tone.

With a cardioid mic pickup pattern....you can move it back a foot and you won't be getting a lot of room.
If you like, play very sparsely....you might(?) start to hear some of the room in the tails....but nothing crazy unless you have a very reflective room sound, in which case it would be a problem all around, not just for guitar tracking.

Much rather use the room mic than a fake room verb later. Or just a ribbon up close because you get the benefit of the close mic sound with the added room ambiance. i almost always use ribbons for leads now. Get it all in one mic, done.

Well...in most home studio rooms, you're not going to get anything resembling "reverb"...at most it will be super subtle. If you need a bigger reverb sound, or any kind of large room/hall flavor....you have to use some sort of FX processing, without actually tracking in a large room/hall with natural reverb.

I've put up a Blumlein stereo pair on my guitar cab...so that mic array is picking up everything all around, and I still don't get any *reverb* from the room.....it just gives me a bigger lead guitar image and it sounds a bit more 3D.
As you can see....the mics are almost 2' away from the cab.

 

[Greg_L]

But Micheal Wagner does it for combos! So that means you should too! kidding, kidding
En studio avec Michael Wagener - Guitare electrique - YouTube

Ha, yeah I don't give a shit what anyone does. I just do what I do. If you like your combo on a chair, rock that shit. Whatever makes you happy. I'm bucking the trend of little low watt "recording" amps and sims. I'm waving the flag for big ridiculous Wembley Stadium loud home-recording! I aint putting this stuff on no chair!

 

[TyphoidHippo]

^^^ Fuck yea, dude. I always feel like I get better tones from ballsy amps, anyway...especially for clean tones running just shy of distortion. There's some balls in that pic. Like 9 balls.

 

[RecordingMaster]

With a cardioid mic pickup pattern....you can move it back a foot and you won't be getting a lot of room.
If you like, play very sparsely....you might(?) start to hear some of the room in the tails....but nothing crazy unless you have a very reflective room sound, in which case it would be a problem all around, not just for guitar tracking.




Well...in most home studio rooms, you're not going to get anything resembling "reverb"...at most it will be super subtle. If you need a bigger reverb sound, or any kind of large room/hall flavor....you have to use some sort of FX processing, without actually tracking in a large room/hall with natural reverb.

I've put up a Blumlein stereo pair on my guitar cab...so that mic array is picking up everything all around, and I still don't get any *reverb* from the room.....it just gives me a bigger lead guitar image and it sounds a bit more 3D.
As you can see....the mics are almost 2' away from the cab.

View attachment 87098

As for reverb, yes I agree in small studios, nothing plate or hall sounding. But for short room ambiance on a lead (like ac/dc roomy style) it works great (for me).

Maybe I'm now being a dick, but as for your blumlein setup in the pic, wouldn't that be more of a mid/side setup, but just using two fig 8 mics? At least the way I think of blumlein would be you'd face both mics similar as you would to an XY pattern, except using fig 8 instead of cardioids. In your setup it looks like you are using one pointed at the source and the other off axis. Where as XY are both pointed at the source from different perspectives.

 

[RecordingMaster]

Ha, yeah I don't give a shit what anyone does. I just do what I do. If you like your combo on a chair, rock that shit. Whatever makes you happy. I'm bucking the trend of little low watt "recording" amps and sims. I'm waving the flag for big ridiculous Wembley Stadium loud home-recording! I aint putting this stuff on no chair!

Hey dude, absolutely I also wave the flag for big amps! Just seems more often than not, more "talent" want to record on their own rigs which are almost always combos

"Owning" my own studio which accepts projects other than mine, I SHOULD have a stack or two with different sounds to choose from as "house" amps but I just can't justify it. I'm primarily a drummer so all my money in actual instruments is mostly invested in that - so at least there is a badass house kit with shit tons of drum selection and cymbal choices. As for amps (in the event that their amps are garbage), i have a single combo and single bass combo. womp womp

Althogh I don't call them "recording" amps. lol

 

[Greg_L]

I'm not saying you need Jimi Hendrix's stacks. There's nothing wrong with combos. Some of them are bonafide tone machines. Fender Twins? AC30s? Awesome amps. Combos. Loud as fuck too. I'm just promoting the movement of air. The excursion of speaker cones. The resonance of cabs. You need volume to achieve all of that.