How do you know when to sing then pause then sing again?

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Now, can I get directions to the market closest to my buddies house please

Step out of his house, take a left, but watch out for the dog crap, when you get to the end of the street take a right and keep walking down there untill you get on to the main road, take aleft there and its right in front of you. If this fails, say "wal mart" three times and one will appear before you.
 
I asked a specific question. "How do you know when to sing - pause - and then sing again without the aid of a karaoke machine?" (A karaoke machine would help keep the singer on time with the song - so I mentioned it for that reason.
still pretty vague dude but I'll take a shot at helping out.
First ...... are you saying you want to sing and record it without any backing tracks? Alcapella?
Because if that's what you're intending .... there's no way to help. You'll have to keep the time in your head .... keeping it even while singing and likely having notes to sing that will be synchopations against the time ..... and you'll have to keep it on pitch without any reference point .......... there no way anyone can tell you how to do that because it's not some secret technique you learn. It's the result of years and years of work. Good luck ifyou're gonna record with no tracks ......I look forward to hearing them.

If , on the other hand, you're gonna use tracks ..... then you'd listen to them and sing along just like karaoke.
And if you mean that you need the words and the little bouncing ball .......... :rolleyes: ....... thennnnn ..... I would record it as you sing along to a karaoke track. You'll have to do several takes until you get the volumes balanced.

whew .......... I'm gonna go warm up the hot tub ......
 
54 years ago when I was in the fifth grade I decided to take up the trumpet. My Mother who was an accomplished pianist was aware that I was not playing according to the written notes but rather by rote. She trapped me in the breakfast nook until I learned the notes and the figering for them on my instrument on my instrument. To help you at this stage most music stores have music minus one programs which preceded Karaoke which include a CD which you can load to your computer and use just like Karaoke. Also included are the music and the lyrics. The music is easy to learn to follow even if you can't read the notes which a vocalist doesn't need to do other than look for direction of pitch and intervals(jumps etc.)
 
Sorry for the late reply.

There's no such thing as a silly question; only silly answers. (You get the idea.)
My dad lives out of state; so...the exchanging of digital files appears to be the best solution.

I recently told my dad that I sing popular songs. Some examples of my favorites would be: "Maria" from West Side Story, "Vincent" (Starry, Starry Night), "Are you lonesome tonight?"

Yes, I have recorded before, I guess you'd call it as a "DJ enthusiast." I would buy my records, and then as soon as I got home, I'd record the record on my Pioneer RT-707 - reel to reel for posterity. Also, recording the playing of the record, would give you the cleanest recording you could get before any scratches developed, over time.

The right and left channels had to be managed/engineered; and as I recall the recording levels were maintained from the first recording to the last. i.e. the vue meters weren't recording inconsistent values, so that the volume would have to be adjusted on playback at the end of every record. **However** that was 30 years ago; and you know what they say: if you don't maintain your skills, you lose them.

My other experience includes using a microphone from Radio Shack. I wouldn't be surprised if it dynamic mic. I would provide the voice over as a DJ would with the help of my RT-707. It has Line in and L and R recording levels. I'm being generous when I say this was 30 years ago.

I also had one of the portable cassette recorders with a handle slid up from the sides, so you could carry it. And after that the CTF-2121. Another Cassette Deck, that had VUE meters.

So, ok, I have experience; but I think it's going to be a lot harder recording myself singing to background music, engineering the levels all by myself all at the same time. (No one else here has the technical background to assist me.)

(SNIP) I'm curious; why can't you sing live to your Dad ? If that's a silly question, I have a second point of curiousity > what has given your Dad the impression that you sing ? And why does he want a recording as opposed to hearing you some other way ? Have you ever recorded at all ? Even on a basic cassette ? Being wet behind the ears doesn't necesarilly mean you've never done anything.
I often tell my kids that their voices and their writing at school are not for their benefit, but for those who have to hear/listen to them or read their stuff, so they should speak clearly and write in such a way that they can be relatively easilly understood.
 
How do you know when to sing - pause - then sing again without the aid of a karaoke machine? That way, you are right in time with the song that you are singing...

I know because I know because I've spent so many years listening to and playing music that I know when to do everything. This is not a magical process, but a learned one, it's just that I've been doing it for so long that it's automatic.

I remember having a guy over to my place once with friends - he bought his guitar and as the evening went on and a few beverages were consumed, he got it out and started strumming and singing. He played Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here, a busking classic - incorrectly as it happened, but close enough - and sang it as well. I picked up my guitar and played along, even though I had no music and it'd been years since I played the song, and at the same time sang a perfect harmony over the top. Afterwards a couple of people said "That was great - how long have you guys been playing together?" - the answer being that we'd never played together before at all, but that this was a well known tune and a relatively simple exercise in harmony.

This is what musicians do - and what I did could be done by most musicians with any skill at all who knew the melody - no magic but years of learning in an informal way of how things fit together, what happens when and why etc - learning by absorbing...

So you start somewhere, and if you don't yet have the skills to allow you to know *automatically* when to start and stop, you can gain them by breaking things down into measures, bars, beats, counting etc... by analysing what it is you're trying to do and counting the gaps and measuring the time. Exactly what steveb said above...

One way or another, this is the way we all start - not very sexy, not very magical, but it works. Music is quite mathematical and logical in structure - you just have to learn to speak its language. Some people get it more easily than others.

And you practice, practice, practice... and if it all gets too hard then maybe you don't want it enough in the first place...?
 
I know because I know because I've spent so many years listening to and playing music that I know when to do everything. This is not a magical process, but a learned one, it's just that I've been doing it for so long that it's automatic.

I remember having a guy over to my place once with friends - he bought his guitar and as the evening went on and a few beverages were consumed, he got it out and started strumming and singing. He played Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here, a busking classic - incorrectly as it happened, but close enough - and sang it as well. I picked up my guitar and played along, even though I had no music and it'd been years since I played the song, and at the same time sang a perfect harmony over the top. Afterwards a couple of people said "That was great - how long have you guys been playing together?" - the answer being that we'd never played together before at all, but that this was a well known tune and a relatively simple exercise in harmony.

This is what musicians do - and what I did could be done by most musicians with any skill at all who knew the melody - no magic but years of learning in an informal way of how things fit together, what happens when and why etc - learning by absorbing...

So you start somewhere, and if you don't yet have the skills to allow you to know *automatically* when to start and stop, you can gain them by breaking things down into measures, bars, beats, counting etc... by analysing what it is you're trying to do and counting the gaps and measuring the time. Exactly what steveb said above...

One way or another, this is the way we all start - not very sexy, not very magical, but it works. Music is quite mathematical and logical in structure - you just have to learn to speak its language. Some people get it more easily than others.

And you practice, practice, practice... and if it all gets too hard then maybe you don't want it enough in the first place...?

Do you think using an online metronome would help?

Thanks.
 
Get a program like Reaper, record the backing tracks into it, then play them back and monitor through headphones while you lay down the vocal on another track.

The levels on the karaoke track have already been "engineered" or normalized/leveled so once you get your signal peaking between around -12dB to -9dB in your recording software let them be. You riding the input faders isn't gonna make anything better.

Same goes with your vocal track. Get your signal peaking around -12 to -9dB and leave it be. Use some technique ----back off the mic when you're belting it out, get closer for quieter parts. You can use compression after the fact to level your vocal---i.e. make the louder parts a little quieter and raise the volume of the quieter parts. Add some reverb on your vocal track too so it doesn't sound like it was recorded in a casket. Don't get carried away with either effect or you'll start sounding like John Lennon recorded in an airport men's room.

Then mix everything together down to a two-track final mix.

It's not rocket science.

And yeah, your original question was dumber than a box of hammers.
 
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So do you know the perfect moment to erupt into a cowbell solo that melts people's faces off?? :p

No - moresound is da man with the cowbell... I'm a mere amateur!

OPO - using a metronome is good for all sorts of stuff, but get a non-digital on-online, physical machine one... preferably one that you have to wind up... so old school
 
Get a program like Reaper, record the backing tracks into it, then play them back and monitor through headphones while you lay down the vocal on another track.

The levels on the karaoke track have already been "engineered" or normalized/leveled so once you get your signal peaking between around -12dB to -9dB in your recording software let them be. You riding the input faders isn't gonna make anything better.

Same goes with your vocal track. Get your signal peaking around -12 to -9dB and leave it be. Use some technique ----back off the mic when you're belting it out, get closer for quieter parts. You can use compression after the fact to level your vocal---i.e. make the louder parts a little quieter and raise the volume of the quieter parts. Add some reverb on your vocal track too so it doesn't sound like it was recorded in a casket. Don't get carried away with either effect or you'll start sounding like John Lennon recorded in an airport men's room.

Then mix everything together down to a two-track final mix.

It's not rocket science.

And yeah, your original question was dumber than a box of hammers.

I appreciate your post; it contains good information.

As for the question I asked, it was vague as others in this thread pointed out.

You may find it helpful to take some time to review your post, for comments like the one above, (for example,) before posting. That's what I do, 99.99% of the time, and that practice has served me well.
 
My other experience includes using a microphone from Radio Shack. I wouldn't be surprised if it dynamic mic. I would provide the voice over as a DJ would with the help of my RT-707. It has Line in and L and R recording levels. I'm being generous when I say this was 30 years ago.

I also had one of the portable cassette recorders with a handle slid up from the sides, so you could carry it. And after that the CTF-2121. Another Cassette Deck, that had VUE meters.

So, ok, I have experience; but I think it's going to be a lot harder recording myself singing to background music, engineering the levels all by myself all at the same time. (No one else here has the technical background to assist me.)

So you're going to give your dad a cassette? Do they even sell those anymore?

Technical background for what? Brushing your teeth? Making your vocal track produce itself? Growing money on trees?
 
So you're going to give your dad a cassette? Do they even sell those anymore?

Technical background for what? Brushing your teeth? Making your vocal track produce itself? Growing money on trees?

I do apologize if you found my previous post unclear; and I thank you for bringing that to my attention.

Allow me to realign the time line so as to put it in the date of acquisition.

First my parents bought me a portable cassette recorder. I loved it, and I was hooked. Then, years later that was replaced by a cassette deck; a cassette deck with the analog vue meters.

There was a learning curve involved, but with experience, I actually got pretty good at it. ("It" meaning engineering/recording my own music.)

When I showed an interest in dj-ing, the CTF-2121 was replaced by RT-707 (reel to reel.) That had the analog vue meters plus the functionality of allowing me to play a 45 on my turntable, and with a dynamic microphone (if I recall correctly,) that I bought from Radio Shack, I could add a voice over "track" during the time the intro to the music was playing. I have no idea where that microphone is today. Hopefully in the hands of an aspiring DJ. ;)

It was fun walking down memory lane; as I stopped using the RT-707 some 30 years ago. I think it began to malfunction around then.

Today, the recording media I have at my disposal are: an internal DVD/CD drive. That's it.

Having said all that, I'm the only one here that has the technical knowledge to "engineer" a recording. There's no one here to assist me. So, the whole thing would have to be done by me.

I hope this clarifies the time line.

If you have any questions, let me know.
 
First my parents bought me a portable cassette recorder. I loved it, and I was hooked.
Speedy, people may mock - allow them. I too was hooked on cassettes back in the 70s and I still use them now. All my records, CDs and MP3s end up on tape. I nearly had world war 7 with my boss a few years ago when he tried to lean on me to keep the CD player in my van after a tape deck had been agreed ! :D
I'm a hopeless tape head. :(

And thanks for clearing up the earlier mystery.
 
OK, so you have a computer. . . Does it make sound? Does it have speakers, either built in, or sitting on the desk beside it? Have you ever played music on it? Does it have a place to plug in headphones/earbuds? Almost all computers nowadays have these things, but you need to be sure. Do you have headphones or earbuds or such that you can plug into the computer and listen to music on? If not, you need to go get some. $10 at Best Buy or Radio Shack will get you a set of earbuds, a couple bucks more for cheap headphones. I think cheap earbuds sound better than cheap headphones, but I can't back that up. You will need these for hearing the music while you are singing.

I will assume from here on that you can get sound from your computer, ie. if you go to youtube and play a random video you get sound with it. I will also assume that you can put your earbuds in and hear that sound only in your ears, not out in the room.

Ok, so we can get sound out of your computer, and we can put that sound into your ears while keeping the room quiet. Next order of business is to make sure you have a way to get the sound of your voice into the computer, which is to say... Do you have a microphone? If yes, does it have the right size connector on it so that you can plug it into the computer? On the computer, you're looking for an input that says something like Mic In, or it may have little picture of a microphone. If your mic has the right size connector to fit into this jack, it is probably the right kind of mic to use without anything else between the computer and the microphone, so go ahead and plug it in. We'll test it in a minute. If you don't have a microphone, does your computer have one built into it? Most laptops do and some desktops. Neither the microphone you can plug in directly nor the one built into your computer are suitable for high-end recording, but if you're just looking to make a simple recording as a place to start either one will work.

Now to test whether your mic is working... I'm not sure if windows xp is the same for everybody, but on my machine you would: Click "Start" in the lower left corner of your screen. Select "Programs" from the menu. Click "Accessories" in the popout menu that appears. Click "Entertainment" from the next menu, and finally click "Sound Recorder" from the next menu. A little box will pop up with record and playback controls. Click the "Red Dot" button to start recording and start talking (into the microphone if you have one. Just into the air if using a built in mic). After saying something, click the "Black Square" button to stop the recording. Now plug in your earbuds and click the "Single Black Triangle" button to play back the recording. Do you hear yourself? If yes, your in business. If not, on the menu bar at the top of the little recording box, click "Edit". In the menu that drops down, click on "Audio Properties". The audio properties box will pop up. In the middle of this screen there's a box where you can select your audio input source. If it is blank, open the list by clicking the little black triangle just to the right of the box. If the list is empty, it's the end of the line for my instructions. If not, select an option from the list. If there's more than one option in the list you may have to try them one by one til you find one that works. If the box wasn't empty to begin with, or you were able to select an option (or a new option) from the list, now click on the "Volume" button just below the selection box. Another window will pop-up listing the actual inputs for the selected audio source. Typical examples would be line-in, internal mic and external mic. If you are using a plug in mic, and there's also a built in mic, this is where you would pick the one you want to use. Each input will have a slider for adjusting the sensitivity of the input (for controlling your recording level, just like on your old reel to reel machine). Below the sliders there will be little square check boxes for selecting which input to use. You can only check one at a time. Check the appropriate one and repeat the test above.

Once you have succesfully recorded a sound and played it back, you'll know your hardware is capable of doing what you want to do. Now you just need to have some software to work with. The purpose of the software will be to play your background track (like the karaoke machine would) which you will listen to in your earbuds, and at the same time record your voice as you sing along. This is the step where you will need to adjust the sensitivity of the mic for the loudness of your voice. After you've recorded your singing, the software will let you play back the karaoke track and your recorded voice at the same time and adjust the relative volume of each. This kind of software is called a Digital Audio Workstation or DAW. Most of the ones folks talk about in this forum will do lots of other things, but at the heart of them all is the ability simultaneously to play back the background track (or previously recorded tracks) and record the musician(s) or singer(s) as they play or sing along in time with the music they are listening to. As for knowing when to sing and when to wait, it is just a matter of knowing the song well enough to follow along with the sound of the music, or counting out the beats during the parts where you aren't singing as several others have commented above.

As for which software to use. To my knowledge, windows XP doesn't come with anything that will work for what you want to do. There are two shareware/opensource/freeware packages that I know of. The first is called Audacity, which you can download here:

Audacity: Download

The other is called Reaper (the one I use), which you can download here:

REAPER | Download

There are also many you can purchase, and there may be even simpler free versions you could download for your purposes. Downloading, installing and setting these up is beyond what I can type here, but if you can get through the test listed above, any of these software packages will do what you want to do (albeit with limited fidelity depending on the microphone you are using). The only remaining thing you would need would be the actual soundfile you want to sing along with. Could be for example a karaoke machine disc.

Good luck,
J
 
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I appreciate your post; it contains good information.

As for the question I asked, it was vague as others in this thread pointed out.

You may find it helpful to take some time to review your post, for comments like the one above, (for example,) before posting. That's what I do, 99.99% of the time, and that practice has served me well.

I'll make a note of that.

:rolleyes:

Maybe you should review your inane questions before you go wasting everybodys' bandwidth and time.
 
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I read this whole thread, and still don't have a clue exactly what kind of answer is desired, or why the necessary clarifications still have not been made despite very specific advice being given by multiple posters about what to clarify.

@Speed Of Sound

Was c7sus' response what you were after?
Also - Do you have a son named JordanD?
 
An internal DVD drive??? WTF does that mean???

Are you posting to this BBS over a smartphone???

If you have a puter the HARD DRIVE is the recording medium.

Did you even bother to read the FAQS page of this site???

You DON'T HAVE THE TECHNICAL KNOWLEDGE to "engineer" your way out of a wet paper bag.
 
Okay. Again, this is the Newbs section, so keep it constructive. It's quite possible the guy doesn't even know enough to ask the right question. So, we cut newbs slack in the newb section and offer help, not insults.
 
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