home studio confusion

J

Jeb

New member
Hello all

I'm new here, so bare with me. My name is Jerry and I will be building a home studio with aspirations of turning it into a semi-pro studio in a couple of years. The problem is that I have found it easier to buy a car. So I need help from people who know what I'm going through.

First, I wanted to build 2 iso booths , one is a drum cage and the other I will use for guitar/vocals until I can afford to build 2 more.

Equipment
Mackie 24/8 Mixing console
Mackie sdr24/96 24 bit recorder
Behringer/DBX/ART for my rack untill i can afford to upgrade DBX EQ's and Behringer Compressors for my drums and an Alesis clx 440 for vocals as com/limiter/expander.

Well I now have a big problem. Every time I go to a local shop and tell them what I am looking for, I always get: "no, you dont need all that. This is much better." Then they attempt to sell me the Yamaha AW4416 or the Roland vs-2480 and how these are way better than what I want to buy.

So my question is this, what would you do? Go my route or go with them on this one. I have a budget and can afford either one, but I demand good sound and quality recording. I don't care for the prossesed sound of all digital studios. Am I wrong or right? Please give me your 2Cents.

Jerry
 
Don't listen to the guys at the local shop. They just want your money.

Basically you just need to do research, and this bbs is a great place to get the information you are seeking.

First, think about your needs. What kind of music you play and how you plan on recording will help guide you in your purchasing decisions.

Are you getting music catalogs from Musician's Friend or American Music Supply? If not, go to their websites and request a mail order catalog, but DO NOT buy anything from the catalogs yet, because just like the local store owner, all they want is your money. The best use for these catalogs is that they have a variety of equipment to look at and think about. Once you get and idea of what you think you may want for your setup, then use the SEARCH function on this bbs, enter the product, and read everything the users say about the product you are considering. Usually when someone says a product is total crap, then they will mention a much better product. You will never get this kind of information from any catalog or magazine spouting a "product review" because again, they just want your money.

When you have made your selection, shop around to find the best price possible. Your music catalogs will now make for decent bathroom reading, and the page that has your product on it can now be used as toilet paper.

Rinse and repeat.

Cy
 
Jerry,
You are neither wrong or right, other than you won't be able to drive your studio to work;) . Seriously, remember...salesman, 9 times out of 10 are there to make money, and it's obvious that the plethora of portable CDRW HD recorders on the market, make it a hot piece of equipment. Also, I'd guess that not one salesman you talked to even engaged in suggestions for your desired direction. I desire to go in sorta the same direction you are going, except my studio building budget is not as large (going from a corner in the finished part of the basement, to an 18' x 10' unfinished part).

You are hanging out in the right spot, I suggest you repost in the Studio Building and Display forum, where you are bound to get good answers and advice. Studio construction is brand new to me, but I am slowly learning things.
 
Thank you for the info and i will repost in the studio building forum
and by the way i will be recording mostly rock ans alternative.
I thought the were trying to seel me stuff i dont want i fell that when it comes down to it im the artist and its up to me but i need good advice on my canvas.

thanks alot
Jerry
 
Jeb, welcome to the board. You have a long road ahead of you. In the last year or so, I have done what you describe. As it turns out, my studio is based on a Roland VS1824 CD, but there are many routes you can go. If you choose to use a computer, the computer recorders here will give you good advice. The main thing is to create a realistic total budget that includes everything, and change your equipment list many times before you buy. Your first purchase should be books on home recording. Read now, buy later!
Here's a basic list of stuff you may or may not have thought of and some popular pieces of hardware to fill the niches:

Recorder- Stand alone DAW vs computer vs HD recorder. Analog is either cheap entry level 4-trackers or pricy (and beautiful) machines often older. The computer is cost effective, upgradeable, and can involve some extra learning curve. It's a good way to go. DAW's used to be pretty bad, but quality is improving a lot. I happen to like the 2480 you mentioned a lot. Because they include a basic bit of everything, you can get started real fast by plugging a mic into it. Good for learning curve. The real HD machines like Alesis HD24 just record, and need to be fed from outboard gear, but can produce spectacular sound quality. I use a DAW because it's quiet and it meets my needs.

Mics- you will need 2 or 3 utility dynamics (Shure SM57), one kick drum mic (AKG D112, Shure Beta 52, Audix D-4). Next, a main vocal condenser mic. Here's where the real pain starts. Price runs from about $80 to about $8000, and none of them sounds good on all singers, so you have to find the right mic for the singer you've got. Cheap-Studio Projects B-1, Marshall MXL V67B Mid range-Studio Projects C-3, Rode NTK, AKG Solidtube AKG C4000 Higher-Neumann TLM 107, B.L.U.E. Dragonfly. Higher- Neumann U-87, B.L.U.E. KIWI, Soundelux U99, AKG C 12 VR, and many others.
You will need a pair of mics for overheads and for acoustic instruments. Cheap-Behringer ECM8000, Marshall MXL603, Oktava MC012 more-the new Studio Projects C4 looks like a no-brainer. more- Neumann KM184, AKG C414B-ULS. You should have at least one higher end dynamic- Shure SM-7B, Sennheiser MD421 II.

Preamps- 2-4 channels. More pain from $80-$2500 per channel
Cheap= M Audio Audio Buddy (in a class by itself) more-Studio Projects VTB-1, M Audio DMP3 more- FMR Audio RNP, Grace Design 101, Joemeek VC1Qcs more-Avalon, Pendulum, Great River, Davisound and a host of others-big bucks.

Power conditioning- check Furman Products
Room conditioning- check Auralex
Furniture- go to the right yard sales, find chairs that don't creak.
Headphone amp-many models-needed for more than one pair out of the board.
Headphones, at least two pair. Closed design. I like Sennheiser HD280 pros, many people like AKG.
outboard compression- FMR's RNC rules the lower price range, and there are many high end options that start at about a grand.
effect/reverbs- For cheap, Lexicon and TC electronics. For high end, Lexicon and TC electronics, different models, and many others.
Guitar modelers- Cheap- VAMP II. POD and J-station both have many fans.
cables- will cost more than you think, don't get cheap ones. Mogami, Monster, B.L.U.E- good. Don't buy HOSA cables. Yeah I know they're cheap.
Monitors- cheap- M Audio SP5B or SP8B Mid range- Tannoy, Mackie, KRK. I recommend powered speakers to start, to avoid the need for a preamp, and there are a bunch of tricks you can do with them.
A mixer will be needed if you're going to record a whole bunch of tracks simultaneously. Generally Mackie with designations ending in "pro" and Soundcraft boards get the nod. Behringers are cheap but notorious for mechanical as well as sound quality issues, but many people do good work with them. Higher end mixers/consoles I know nothing about, but plenty of people on this board do.
Mic stands- You'll need a couple of real heavy duty models, a couple of lighter duty stands, and a good mini/kick drum stand. I like On Stage SB96 PLUS.
a *good* tuner- try a high end KORG
A good pop filter or 2, I like Sabrasom personally (check The Sound Room on line)
monitor stands- more useful if height adjustible

That should cover the basics. There's always a weakest link in the signal chain, and your sound can be as good as that link permits. If the player, instrument, music, mic, preamp, recorder, and engineer suck, electronic boxes with blinking lights will not help. If they are all good, it will be easy to record good sounding stuff. I also recommend that you hire or beg a good tracking engineer to make suggestions on room conditioning and to assist with initial setup for tracking. The time you save will be your own. Best of luck- Richie

P.S.-Check the pictures off the project page of my web site at www.bardwire.com to see how I went about doing what you are talking about. If you don't count the guitars, I think we're up to about $15,000.
 
You're right, but lots of amateurs charge for what they call "professional services". The best I can do is not to give advice on what I don't know. You'll notice I don't have a lot to say about computer applications, high-end monitors, or acoustic tech. That's because I'm not a pro, I'm a serious amateur. Posts like that are just my way of paying back the debt I owe to the people on this board who have helped me get this far. I find I do have the advantage of being able to boil down technobabble to the simple level, because that's the limit of what I've been able to learn. I ain't a engooneer...yet-Richie
 
Don't let these salesman push you around. Tell them to get you what you want, or you'll take your business down the road.

Screw 'em.
 
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