Hi and please critique my gear before I invest

[Zydeceltico]

Hi all – So happy to be here. Excellent resource. I am a music industry “veteran” who had a lot of recording time in the 80s and 90s. So…while not being a noob to the recording music world, I have been away a long while. I am a little familiar with DAWs and the recording culture of 2012 - -but only a little.

I am ready to get back in and am hoping to get your feedback before I commit to a path that is ignorantly not where I want to go. I’ll be focused primarily on songwriting and producing my own songs to be placed with publishers and various other connections. So I want more than a little control and quality with out breaking my measly budget for a complete startup – roughly $2000.00.

I already have an HP dv7, 8GB Ram, 7200 rps, 500GB hard drive. I am planning on getting the following: Pro-Tools 10 (mostly because I am familiar with what it will allow me to do); a Roland Quad-Capture (I would like the Octa but the price difference breaks my budget); EZ-Drummer, and I can’t decide between Guitar Rig 5 or a Line 6 Pod HD. Then, of course, various mics and such.

My goals are to spend the next 6 months writing pretty much solo which makes me feel better about getting the Quad instead of the Octa as the most inputs I’ll ever have will be stereo mics on acoustic guitars, mandolins, fiddles, etc. I am hoping (maybe against all hope) that one of the amp modelers I mentioned will be able to deliver a nice Fender Twin to over-driven JCM 800 for me.

And speaking of guitar amp modeling, I am really hoping – and this is probably number one or two on my list of needs/desires – that I can 1) not only find an amp modeller that sounds good, but 2) setup a system that will allow me to monitor the tone of the amp modeller while recording the track but only record a dry track so I can play with amp tones after the fact and not have to re-record the guitar everytime. I know that’s probably nothing to those who know but – like I said – in my time “away” there are some things I just don’t know anymore and I don’t want to buy a bunch of gear and software just to find out I can’t route things the way I am comfortable recording with.

For what it’s worth as far as tones go, I am focused more on all forms of country from bluegrass to arena-country with a big huge sound. I say that because I notice a lot of emphasis on super overdriven metal tones for a lot of the amp modelers and I am not going to need that very much. I’ll need overdrive - just not Pantera or Nine Inch Nails.

I’ve chosen EZ drummer primarily due to good reviews. Again – it sounds like I can find the tone I’m looking for - - but it seems to me there was another piece of percussion software that had an entire country-focused suite of drum tones. The second most important issue to me (and it really is a tie for first) is that whatever drum emulation system I am using will allow me to output each drum (especially kick and snare but preferably all of them – including the cymbals) to a single track in order to play with the tone of each drum isolated from the others.

Wow – this is getting long - - sorry – but thanks.

So…Thank You for your time and please, please feel free to critique any and/or all of my gear choices or methods - I am seriously looking for feedback before I invest. And of course – What am I missing? Advice on low cost, high quality monitors would be a big help too.

 

[mjbphotos]

Welcome to the HR forums!
I just got EZD, and it's pretty good - others like it's big brother, Superior Drummer ,for its ability to customize the drums more. You can always upgrade with Toontrack.
I haven't used Guitar Rig, but I can tell you that Line 6 PodFarm does allow you to monitor wet sound and record dry. I can't tell you how to set it up, as I use the free version. I like Line 6's sound, others don't. There's no question that modelers tend towards the overdriven sound, but Line 6 has lots of sound options. I think its purely a personal choice.
Don't forget that you will need monitors.
I'm not familiar with the Roland interfaces, but there are lots of choices with more than 2 or 4 inputs for very reasonable amounts (I just got the close-out Tascam US-800 with 6 inputs).

 

[Hakea]

And speaking of guitar amp modeling, I am really hoping – and this is probably number one or two on my list of needs/desires – that I can 1) not only find an amp modeller that sounds good, but 2) setup a system that will allow me to monitor the tone of the amp modeller while recording the track but only record a dry track so I can play with amp tones after the fact and not have to re-record the guitar everytime. I know that’s probably nothing to those who know but – like I said – in my time “away” there are some things I just don’t know anymore and I don’t want to buy a bunch of gear and software just to find out I can’t route things the way I am comfortable recording with.

Hi,

You might like to check out the Eleven Rack . It has a huge range of programmable effects, amps, cabs etc and you can record both a dry signal and a processed one at the same time onto separate tracks. Using it for re-amping later seems to be well catered for. It comes bundled with Pro Tools and some other plug-ins. I'm not sure what the current bundles include but it probably includes a drum one Click here for Eleven Rack details. I think there's a video there about re-amping, among others. Buying a bundle that includes Pro Tools can be a good way to go. If it comes with 9 the upgrade to 10 should be free.

All the best with your gear quest and your songwriting.

Cheers,

Chris

 

[Zydeceltico]

Thanks for the info guys! You both gave me great feedback and got me to thinking some more about my immediate needs versus my longer term plans. Since getting some songs written first is my immediate focus and quality production will follow several months down the road, (think budgets - lol), I've decided to go with Reaper, EZ Drummer, and the Line 6 Pod HD Pro which should double as my amp modeller and as my interface as it apparently has several mic pres behind that XLR. I'll need to get another (read dedicated) interface in very short order but it will be easier to get the rack modeller first (with my initial budget) and kill several birds with one stone and later save for the dedicated interface.

I'll let you know how it goes!

Thanks again.

 

[jake the snake]

Reaper is a great sequencer... and cheap. And the Reaper forums are filled with lots of helpful users.
You will like Pod Farm, it is very easy to use and the sound possibilities are endless... and yes you can record dry and modify your set up as many times as you wish and apply it.
I had a Line 6 ux2 and hated it. You will probably want to uprade your audio interface but yes, this will get you started and familiar with the current world of home recording.

 

[jimmys69]

Welcome Zyde! I would have to say that Addictive Drums, is far better sounding than EZDrummer. I have both. It is a bit more involved tho for a beginner. Tho, that is a good thing if you plan on really digging into this recording thing. You can modify each drum/cymbal within the program as well (kit, compression, reverb...etc..), without necessarily having to separate each track. Though, you will want to do that too eventually. It is not much more expensive either..

 

[Hakea]

Thanks for the info guys! You both gave me great feedback and got me to thinking some more about my immediate needs versus my longer term plans. Since getting some songs written first is my immediate focus and quality production will follow several months down the road, (think budgets - lol),

Doing it in stages, as you can afford it, is a great idea. I'd rather have at least one or two reasonable items that I can use for a fair length of time than a whole host of cheap stuff which quickly proves why it was cheap.

One thing that I lashed out on a bit further down the track was a Roland RD-4 electronic drum kit. If you're already a drummer, and know exactly what you want played - bar by bar all through the song - then programming something can work OK. But if you're not a full bottle on drumming then the risk is that you'll end up with a somewhat generic drumming track, that has been largely chosen for you. Over time this could make your songs sound a bit predictable. Of course, if you know all about drumming and percussion in general, and know exactly what you want.... then why not play it yourself anyway.

When I started song-writing I realised that I really didn't know much about drumming and that, although I could operate the programs, I didn't have enough experience or knowledge to write tracks that I'd really be satisfied with. So I took some drum lessons. Well worth it - sitting next to a good pro drummer was both an ear opener and a mind opener. My electronic kit has a range of inbuilt sounds but I can also use it to trigger a whole load more, including different drums and percussion from around the world.

When I write songs I like to establish pretty quickly what the underlying pulse, rhythmic skeleton (or whatever you might call it) is going to be. Then I can hang the lyrics on it so that the key words punch along in step with the right peaks in the structure of the music. (That might sound like a load of waffle, but I expect you know what I mean! )

So, no matter what comes first - a phrase or two of lyrics, a bit of melody, some chords, etc - I can sit down reasonably early and play around with some scratch rhythm ideas on drums. Programming a drum track would be far too tedious and mechanical for that purpose. It would also lock things in more than I want to at that stage. I need the freedom and general hands on 'feel' of doing it myself, to play around with ideas. There's also no guarantee that I'll want a full drum track for a song anyway - in fact I usually don't - but it's always useful in the early stages to have some kind of replayable rhythm reference, even if it's only so that I'll remember it the next day!

And you really can’t get round the fact that hitting things is fun....

Cheers,

Chris