Hardware vs Software

Nakatira

Nakatira

That Norwegian Bastard
I've been wondering about getting me some outboard compressors eq and ect lately just to try it out.
I'm still stuck on one big issue for me at least:

I like keeping my tracks clean when put onto daw, I've used preamps with eq and compressors on board (pretty decent ones too).
But out of of fear of messin up a great take I decided to go clean and then work with compressors eq or ect after it came into my daw using plugins.

The only real value I can see with having outboard gear is taming a very dynamic source or removing some low end.
because usually in my expreience I need to twiddle em eq's and compressor a few times before I'm happy, doing this threw a daw is very forgiving, doing it before it enters daw, you'd better know what your doing.

So please tell me why should I buy outboard gear, (not talking pres)?
 
Nakatira said:
But out of of fear of messin up a great take I decided to go clean
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The only reason that fear still exists is because you haven't done anything about it yet. It doesn't - or at least shouldn't - take very long to overcome that fear; with just a little bit of practice you'll know what you need to do, and setting it up on the way in won't be all that much harder than setting the right input volume level.

I don't know that I'd bother much with external EQ just yet, but get yourself a *good sounding* compressor, perhaps something with optical varistor-based compression and a nice tube-based input stage, and you'll get a smoothness of sound that you just don't get with plugs.

That difference in sound character, along with the speed and convenience of handling it during tracking and not as much during mixing and probably the two main reasons why one would want to go that way. But don't expect magic; you're probably not just going to plug your new compressor inline and hear magic the first day. The differences will be sublime but subtle, and will probably require a bit of practice with the iron to get to know it's character first before you'll get the best out of it.

G.
 
The only reason I can see to use outboard gear is if it's superior to what's in the box or if it lets you do things you want to do.

This last year, I changed over to a setup that involves all the tracks come out of the computer into a passive homemade mixer where I add an outboard tube eq to the lead channel or do whatever else I want to do to other channels.

Then all the tracks get summed into a L/R out and that goes through two tube compressors for makeup gain, and back into my computer and that's the master. It sounds completely open and without crap.

I keep wondering if one of those cheap Art VLA ll compressors would work for makeup gain. Even a pair of the Summit 1/2 rack tube compressors wouldn't be that much. That's a cheap world class setup. I don't think you'd ever need better.

There's musical value in things like guitar stomp boxes, and cheap stuff too.
 
dintymoore said:
I keep wondering if one of those cheap Art VLA ll compressors would work for makeup gain.
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I've been using one of the original Pro VLAs since 1999, and we have it installed in the new studio. I think it's one of the more underrated/underappreciated boxes out there, and a real bargain for the price. It's no LA-2A - that's way too much to expect for the price - but it's got a somewhat similar personality with a similar style of optical compression.

I like using it especially for vocal tracking and 2-mix pre-mastering, but it's "smoothness" of sound can come in handy for many purposes.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I've been using one of the original Pro VLAs since 1999, and we have it installed in the new studio. I think it's one of the more underrated/underappreciated boxes out there, and a real bargain for the price. It's no LA-2A - that's way too much to expect for the price - but it's got a somewhat similar personality with a similar style of optical compression.
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Haha, actually in a Tape Op review of the VLA II they referred to it as "the poor man's LA-2"
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I've been using one of the original Pro VLAs since 1999, and we have it installed in the new studio. I think it's one of the more underrated/underappreciated boxes out there, and a real bargain for the price. It's no LA-2A - that's way too much to expect for the price - but it's got a somewhat similar personality with a similar style of optical compression.

I like using it especially for vocal tracking and 2-mix pre-mastering, but it's "smoothness" of sound can come in handy for many purposes.
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Thanks; I'd like to check one out.

I've also heard that there was an early and later versions. It sure has nice big VU's. :)

I'm surprised that Art VLA's are not talked about more here, it seems like it would be one of the first pieces of gear I'd get if I was building a studio up.

I have a pair of Summit TLA-100 tube compressors and I use them when I record (always) and also for makeup gain for my mixer. I paid $2700 for them near 20 years ago. Worth every cent, I love those things. They are a very mild, soft compressors... you can't get any brick wall stuff with them. They always sound good, but subtle.
 
a good friend of mine made me get one about a year back and i just started using it for master buss compression... sounds awesome on a budget i got mine on craigslist for $150, plus you can mod them to sound way better ;)
 
dintymoore said:
I've also heard that there was an early and later versions. It sure has nice big VU's. :)
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Yeah, there's the original Pro VLA, which is what I have, there's the VLA Gold, and the Pro VLA II, in order of their time on market. I've never actually used a Gold or the II, so I can't comment on them directly, but from just about everything that I read, there were small-but-not-unimportant incremental improvements in each one.
dintymoore said:
I'm surprised that Art VLA's are not talked about more here, it seems like it would be one of the first pieces of gear I'd get if I was building a studio up.
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Unfortunately ART has gotten kind of a bad rep around this BBS because of the large number of home recorders with the entry-level stuff like the TubeMP and so forth, OK for what they are, but nothing to really purposely cross the street for in the big scheme of things. And even some of ARTs bigger boxes could arguably fit that description. So it's not exactly one of the most revered brands around these parts. But they seem to have hit a nice sweet spot with the VLA series, and it's a shame that more folks don't give ART the props IMHO they deserve for the VLAs.

G.
 
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I recently picked up a pro VLA (Original one) for $90 on craigs list. I'm finding it very useable as a tracking comp for vocals and will shortly be auditioning it in linked stereo mode for a bus comp.

I'm also going to switch the tubes out and try a couple of different types to see what effect it has on the sound, got some Mullards and JAN Phillips on order.

Even for the price brand new (under$300 for a new VLA 2) I think this comop is an absolute steal for the home recorder.
 
This is one of the best threads I have read on here, it was short and provided very useful info. I just ordered a Pro VLA II thanks to this post.
The one thing that sticks out for me when making the decision to use plug ins or hardware is CPU load, although I have a powerful machine, its always on my mind, So I try and use outboard processors when ever possible, especially when I can get exactly the sound Im looking for that way.
Most of the time I will record my tracks raw(except for the Pre's of course) then route them back through my board with the outboard gear in my inserts.
As big of a fan I am with outboard gear, there are some truly amazing plug ins out there now, but it always seems to me that the better the plug in the more CPU load it takes.
 
machinetodd said:
although I have a powerful machine, its always on my mind, So I try and use outboard processors when ever possible
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The only processing that is highly taxing to a CPU is reverb, and that's the one place where hardware still seems to win over plug-ins. Compression and EQ and phaser effects etc are not very demanding, and IMO good plug-ins sound just as good as hardware. I have a Dell computer that's almost three years old, and I've had projects with more than 100 tracks and more than 100 plug-ins including four reverbs at once. That does push the CPU meter in SONAR! But it still all works perfectly. Smaller projects should not be a problem at all.

--Ethan
 
machinetodd said:
The one thing that sticks out for me when making the decision to use plug ins or hardware is CPU load, although I have a powerful machine, its always on my mind
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Look up the "lock" or "freeze" function in your multitrack editor software (which it's called depends upon the brand of software.) and not only will CPU load NEVER be an issue, but your track edits will be safe from accidental mis-edits.

G.
 
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