Guest Appearances...

C

crunkthanamug

New member
I was curious as to what the most common procedure is regarding guest appearances -- who does the writing??? For my songs, i tend to write the verse i want the guy to spit. (mainly cuz at that point i already have a firm grasp on where i want the song to go) But, I will usually wait until they write something of their own to see if it goes or not. And if it doesnt, I'll be like "ok, try this..." What is you guys' policy on guest appearances?
 
crunkthanamug said:
I was curious as to what the most common procedure is regarding guest appearances -- who does the writing??? For my songs, i tend to write the verse i want the guy to spit. (mainly cuz at that point i already have a firm grasp on where i want the song to go) But, I will usually wait until they write something of their own to see if it goes or not. And if it doesnt, I'll be like "ok, try this..." What is you guys' policy on guest appearances?
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If I know their style, I know what I can work with. I'd rather have the MCs on my tracks write their own. It adds to your work. But usually, I'll send the verse that I wrote, and let them go off that so they know what the song's about.
 
Fieva said:
If I know their style, I know what I can work with. I'd rather have the MCs on my tracks write their own. It adds to your work. But usually, I'll send the verse that I wrote, and let them go off that so they know what the song's about.
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yeah, unless it's someone who doesn't know how to rap and would like to get into the business i wouldn't bother writing for them. IMHO it's a sign of not having faith in the artist's ability to deliver a hit product. ghost writing is mainly reserved for people who really need help with making hits. in R&B it's not frowned upon but in rap, it is.
i pretty much do the same as fieva, i'll tell them my ideas and if they don't get it right i'll have them keep doing it, but i won't write for them. that way at the end of the day, everyone is happy. I know i would feel funny if someone told me that my verse was hot as hell on a song and i didn't write it. i'm not saying it's wrong, i'm only saying that it's not common practice.
 
jugalo180 said:
yeah, unless it's someone who doesn't know how to rap and would like to get into the business i wouldn't bother writing for them. IMHO it's a sign of not having faith in the artist's ability to deliver a hit product. ghost writing is mainly reserved for people who really need help with making hits. in R&B it's not frowned upon but in rap, it is.
i pretty much do the same as fieva, i'll tell them my ideas and if they don't get it right i'll have them keep doing it, but i won't write for them. that way at the end of the day, everyone is happy. I know i would feel funny if someone told me that my verse was hot as hell on a song and i didn't write it. i'm not saying it's wrong, i'm only saying that it's not common practice.
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Ever written an r&b song before? I have to get with the artist and feel what they're feeling on the song before I even go that route. My mind can and probably will be more off than theirs. I have to get in that mood to write like that.
 
Fieva said:
If I know their style, I know what I can work with. I'd rather have the MCs on my tracks write their own. It adds to your work. But usually, I'll send the verse that I wrote, and let them go off that so they know what the song's about.
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I can see your point, and it would REALLY be nice to write 2 verses instead of 3 for a change! But I dont really consider the guests i use to be collabos (for the most part), meaning i dont really require anything creative from them...I may just want to hear another voice on the song, if it adds more flavor to it.
 
my policy..

if you aint dope or creative enough to mesh into a concept well...i really dont see the purpose in putting you on the song...especially an MC...i dont think you should rap if you need a ghostwriter...

if im writing the verse...im performing the verse...

i can see songwriters for R&B singers..because the main talent lies in the vocals....

for an MC, i think you MUST be a good songwriter...
 
I've ghostwritten for people before and felt kind of dirty doing it, except for my best friend. I knew he couldn't rap and I just wanted to do it for fun so other than that I just felt "man that ain't right". Now R&B and pop songs, I'll ghostwrite all day (I just need the artist's thoughts with me so I can do that).
 
^ haha i would feel dirty too...feel like im feeding into whats wrong with hip hop today..

a lack of artists who can write their asses off.
 
wargasms said:
my policy..

if you aint dope or creative enough to mesh into a concept well...i really dont see the purpose in putting you on the song...especially an MC...i dont think you should rap if you need a ghostwriter...

if im writing the verse...im performing the verse...

i can see songwriters for R&B singers..because the main talent lies in the vocals....

for an MC, i think you MUST be a good songwriter...
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I think a rapper's voice is a bigger part of the equation than you do...first of all, if your rap voice is horrible no one will want to listen to you -- regardless of how tight you are lyrically. Second, the voice plays a huge part in setting the mood for any song (try to imagine dmx spitting ll cool j's verses - it just cant happen!) Voice consideration is the first thing i do when contemplating putting someone on one of my songs, it has to be a good fit (with the beat as well as my voice). Even in RnB, some voices just sound GOOD. Look at Barry White - you must admit his vocal technique was nothing special, but women FELT his voice. Rap is the same way to a certain extent... That was part of Ja Rule's appeal early in his career. Not to mention BIG and Jadakiss. I mean think about it - you wouldnt wanna put Will Smith on a song with the mad rapper would you??? (assuming similar topics of course)
 
But doesn't that all go back into saying if you know the style of the artists you're wanting on the track, then you have confidence in their ability to write their own verses?

I mean just as an example...take some of the members of the forum. Since you can hear all of their music on different topics and see what would appeal best, you'd be able to figure out what kinds of songs you'd want them on and which ones you'd want to tackle alone.

Like if I was recording a love song, I think I could go with chalin, rnb259, and Trumpspade on that and come out good (I don't do those hardly ever, but if the good collab came along, I'd go for it).

If I want somethin' gangsta, I would probably hit up wargasms, gullyjewelz, and jug knowin' that I could trust whatever they wanted to throw on the track.

Somethin' a little deeper, I'd go with any of the above plus changeofpoets.

Luckily, all of us are pretty versatile from the tracks I've heard. Some of my homeboys locally, I'd have to work with them to get a certain flow (unless the beat hit the nerve just right) because they're set in one style and don't seem to expand much, but I couldn't write the lyrics for them.

Note: I would have added more folks to the post, but that was just an example so if you weren't on there don't take it as offense. (end note)
 
you know after think more about your post it finally dawned on me as to what you meant. i do the exact same thing but only for hooks and maybe a few adlibs. what you are saying is you want to borrow someones voice and not thier talent am i right? if so, i can relate to that. if i want a hook done that i think dmx would sound good doing and i knew someone who had similar voice charactoristics but still was somewhat unique 10 times out of 10 since i'm broke, i would get the guy who sounds somewhat like DMX.
 
jugalo180 said:
what you are saying is you want to borrow someones voice and not thier talent am i right? if so, i can relate to that. if i want a hook done that i think dmx would sound good doing and i knew someone who had similar voice charactoristics but still was somewhat unique 10 times out of 10 since i'm broke, i would get the guy who sounds somewhat like DMX.
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EXACTLY :D
 
Well I have ghost written before and not even been on the song I did it for this group that New Editions Old mangers son was managing. It's been so long ago I cant remember his name I was 17 at time and he wanted a mature Kiddy act. Its was a 15 year old female emcee who was a friend of mine. Her group mate though couldnt write but looked every bit of the part or a Kriss Kross type dued. Anyway I wrote his verse and stuff got paid 500 bucks which was alot to me at the time. Nothing never really happend with her or the manager he dropped them cause he started working with TLC I think. Anyway the point i was trying to make was what if they sign the dude off the lyrics you wrote. Then what? If I'm gonna ghost write I'm gonna get paid for it so at least if nothing happens or does happen I did get paid. Folks will sign acts just based off their looks so make sure you cover yourself so you dont get played. Because I have been there I have been told before We want this guy instead of you because of his look or his voice nothing having to do with talent at all.

R&B singers are different though because there voice is an instrument. So folks even believe an emcee's voice is an instrument too but I tend to disagree big time.
 
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