grace, RNP, or ? w/d1200mkII

bubbleboy

bubbleboy

New member
what's up. before i start this--i am not just posting without using the search function, etc. i've read half a dozen reviews and scoured everyone's posts on these preamps. However, maybe someone who owns or really knows about the Grace 101 and the RNP can tell me something. Shops around here don't stock these or rent em.

my first reason for this thread is that I have been considering the Grace 101 as my first choice for an external pre to give as good a signal to my d1200mkII as I can afford at the moment ($600 is my upper limit). It is available in a 70db gain version, which would be good once I can afford the Royer 121.

Looking back at posts about the 101, the one thing that I am having trouble interpreting is how people say it is clean/real "to a fault". I want this pre mainly for recording my vocals (soft, but dynamic male vocals--not gritty, yelling,etc--indie/emo type stuff), so will it make it sound very upfront in the mix, or will it add some kind of unreal realism to the signal that can be unflattering? just having trouble understanding the "real to a fault" concept.

With the RNP, I have heard there is a bit of color to it. can yalls say it is a warm pre or still relatively transparent.
thanks
 
I like them both quite a bit and owned both at one time. The Grace puts a bigger image in the monitors which is better for lead vocal tracks generally or instruments that feature in the song. The FMR RNP is a lightly colored mic pre which is good for adding some flattering smoothing out of things at times. It also layers fairly well when it comes to mix time. I've heard projects where the entire song was tracked through one or the other. You can make impressive recordings with either one.
 
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oz thanks. explaining it with the 'bigger image' makes a lot better sense to me. i like the sound of that right there
 
You should take a look at the Groove Tubes Brick....an all tube mic pre that sounds very impressive and has a great DI
 
cradle thanks for the heads up. will do.

kinda leaning twds the grace now, but will look at tha brick.

i'll hijack my own thread--i read something disturbing on another board, where they were saying that even if you get a really good external pre for your all in one studio (d1200mkII in my case), you will not get the pre's full utility/sound/etc because you'll still be going through the SIAB's own pre's. is this wrong? i mean, there wouldn't be all these threads about 'what's the best pre for me' if that was the case, or is there something i'm not realizing?
 
I have a Korg D16, and yes it is true that you can't totally bypass the pres on the Korg units unless you go digital in. However, you can still get a much better track by turning the unit's channel trim right off, especially with a Grace or RNP. Personally though, I would get an A/D converter and one of the two pres you mentioned. I have one of these which works suprisingly well with my D16 in combination with a Focusrite Voicemaster: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=23790&item=3752879568&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
(This unit is extremely flexible and very useful for many other functions as well as bypassing the Korg pres).
 
future--thanks for the rockin advice on when to call on a a/d converter for some help.

i know nothing about converters and which brands are good. time for search function.

for now, the trim will go all the way down......
 
Just wanted to mention - if you CAN afford more, get a better converter than the Behringer. I only use it with my D16, and for that it serves it's purpose. I have a PC rig as well, and I have no need for it there because the converters in my soundcard are very good. The converters in all in one units are never great - you can't expect miracles with an "everything but the kitchen sink for $1000" unit I guess. :-)

The thing to keep in mind - a pre like the Grace is very clean, but unless you can bypass the Korg pres with an equally clean converter, your signal has to pass through the Korg converters, where the THD is about .05 at best. No matter how good your preamp is, it will only sound as clean as the converters you are using. (I use my D16 for pre-production only, so I don't really care). A good converter will have specs in the range of .0003 THD (or maybe better) which is a big difference in clarity. Because you have a Korg unit, I would actually recommend you look at something like this as another option:
http://www.mercenary.com/beadandad.html
Kills two birds with one stone ... probably costs a little more, but you will always be able to use it if you upgrade your recording rig later.
 
The Focusrite Voicemaster and Trakmaster come with an optional SP/DIF out card. I use it and it's fine. Cheaper than an external A/D unit, too. I've tried the Roland MMP/2 Preamp and the Lexicon MPX-500 for A/D conversion at times too, along with a Roland M-1000, but the Focusrite converters are fine. You can also piggyback two (mono) trakmasters onto the one card (stereo).
 
future that benchmark box looks insane. wish i could afford it. what you guys are saying makes a lot more sense now. been wondering about the trakmaster and voicemaster for a long while now too. so the trakmaster is "fine" as in nowhere near as good sounding as the grace, or fine as in it is fine but nothing special?

i'm not going for the extremest clarity and lowest possible THD--i know i'll never get that w/what i have here. I'm just hoping that if i drop $600 on a grace, for example, the difference between going straight into the d1200 and going from the grace into the 1200 will be 'noticeable' in a positive way, and hopefully that larger image everyone's talking about will translate into more potent recordings.... but you guys are seriously schooling me on a/d's


and yes...i had thought about the behringer a/d converter and then thought about going to confession
 
The Grace is a definite step up from the Focusrite Platinum series from what I know, even though you can buy the A/D add on for the Voicemaster pro/Trackmaster. You'd still need to convert the spdif to optical as well, because the Korg units all have optical digital ins/outs. BTW, I'm no expert on A/D converters - not even close. I'm just learning about them myself. There are some very good people on these boards though, with a lot more experience who could guide you in the right direction when you decide to get one. Personally, I would do it sooner than later. My original point was that no matter how much you spend on a pre, you're not going to really hear the true quality of it until you bypass the Korg converters. I'm sure it will sound much better than the Korg pres, but nowhere near as good as it would using a converter.
 
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