good rhythm guitar sound

W

wire-shock

New member
Ok, We're using a Marshall valvestate vs265 amp. I'm in close with an sm-57 slightly off axis to the cone and I'm getting a "shrinky-dinky" tone. My other mics include a kick drum mic (d 112) an sm-58 and 2 small diaphram condensers. The sound were looking for is "Nirvanaish" Thick, powerful, but not conflicting with the bass. Oh----were running the mic into an ART tube mp before it hits my vs-880. Any tips for a good chunky tone. Compression settings etc....Any help would be greatly appreciated.

-Josh and Joel
 
First make sure you are getting the tone you want coming out of the amp. Just making sure I state the obvious.

Once you have the sound you want in the room, just experiment with mic placement. Sometimes having the mic a few feet back and and strange angles will get the sound you want. What I mean is, there's no hard rules to mic placement. I play the guitar while moving my head around the areas where I'm thinking of putting the mic. When I get something that sounds close I place the mic, put on the headphones and see what I get. Then I make slight changes to the mic location and angle until I get the sound I want. Sometimes getting the right mic placement can take me a few days worth of recording time. But it's all worth it once I get the sound I'm looking for. The compression setting I would use for a guitar track would be Off, but that's just my preference. Try it without the compression since you are going for a thick, lush distorted sound. I use an SM57 for miking all my guitar amps. Since you have the condenser mic, you might try placing the SM57 close and the condenser further back in the room and get some nice stereo miking going. Just make sure to watch out for phase problems and you can sometimes get a fuller sound by blending these two tracks. The SM57 will get the meat of the guitar track, and the condenser will provide more of the room sound and really fill it out. Also, doubling (and beyond) the tracks by playing them several times with slightly different sounds will thicken up the finished guitar parts immensely. I almost guarantee you those Nirvana sounds you mentioned are several guitar tracks of the same part played over and over again, then combined. And if I haven't rambled on enough, I didn't know what I was missing until I started using tube amps. I don't see how I ever played without one.

Of course, you could always try a POD and see if you like any of the direct sounds you get from it. :cool:
 
another tool for your tool kit...

here's another tool for your tool kit...

here's a method that results in a good thick stereo sound, but doesn't converge to mono very well.

double track with two mics, one dynamic up close and off-axis and one condenser back a bit, not to far selectively placed for overall tone (check mono here and balance for minimal nasal quality). also, make sure while monitoring for tone, that you're isolated as much as possible from the cabinet. the bass will go through the walls and will give you a false sense of the bass level that’s going to tape/disc because your hearing the cabinet bass too. check with a lot of sample takes before committing.

now track the same part again. treat these as stereo pairs.

finally, on the second stereo take, swap the L<>R and invert the phase for both channels.

this really works well for stereo, but note the Mono conversion is not that good.

try it and then tuck it away as another tool.

good luck …

Regards,
-kPreston-:)
 
thicker and thicker

Hi,

I'm all acoustic in my approach, but the thicker tracks
are a goal of all of us. I double track only, not more. More than two adds confusion for my ears. The key for me is where I pan the two tracks. 3 & 9 give a nice spread,
but not totally seperate as hard right / left pan, and Not
more than 3 & 9 either because it puts the image more front and center - thin. A touch of delay in beat from one
processor, and a thickener setting from another if you have
one - alesis effects equipment typically has them. Compressors don't work for me on guitar - it just adds
harshness back into the tracks and kills the fat dynamics your trying to build. Hope it helps. We all searching
here...

take care,
Chuck
 
Brother, I've gotta share one with you that I never here... In some of my recordings, I've placed a large diaphragm condenser at a good spot in front and stuck a 57 in the back of the amp aimed at the speaker. It sounds really thick if you mix the two sounds right. Aside from this tip, go ahead and try that kick mic you have. Get a good, warm spot on the grill and mix it low with your initial guitar sound(s). I'd also like to advise EQing the guitar in frequencies that are in the key of the song. I don't know the frequencies for every note off hand, but I keep a chart in my studio. Remember if a song is in A major, play around 220Hz, 440Hz, etc. Look up the formula.
 
To me jonX's first statement was important "make sure you have the right sound coming from the amp" I often see guitarists standing over their amp and bending down and adjusting the eq etc but never putting their head in front of the speaker yet that's what the mike hears. Also don't feel you can't add low end to a sm57 - it often helps - they've got a low end rolloff to stop proximity effect for voice.
cheers
 
The main topic has already been discussed. Just an extra word-you can take the top of your sm-58 and have another sm-57 which you can use for the second mic. As I believe the VS265 has two speakers, you can use the two mics for a nice balance.

Just experiment.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top