Glyn Johns Drums

acattoir said:
UH, I think you just went above my pay grade.
ac
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haha...sorry. makes me feel like marty at the prom

r7untv.jpg
 
second skin said:
lately if i'm using 4 mics or 400 i tend to put pretty standard mild compression on the track inserts with a mild limiter on the overheads and bus that to a stereo aux. the goal here is to get a nice natural sound. then i send the the whole mix to another aux with a really squashed compressor that is pumping with the music. this gets mixed in and really helps the drums stand up in the mix. it gives everything more sustain in general. it can sound un-natural if it's too high in the mix but i really like what it adds.
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This is very similar to what I'm doing. I just have to try and restrain myself, because I tend to push everything to the max. Then again, if we REALLY wanted a "natural" sound, we would just put a stereo pair up and call it a day, now wouldn't we?

ac, where's my tracks? ;)

Peace!

~Shawn
 
eyema_believer said:
This is very similar to what I'm doing. I just have to try and restrain myself, because I tend to push everything to the max. Then again, if we REALLY wanted a "natural" sound, we would just put a stereo pair up and call it a day, now wouldn't we?

ac, where's my tracks? ;)

Peace!

~Shawn
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well thats the thing. what sounds natural soloed and what sounds natural in the mix are often two different things.
 
acattoir said:
Here's a oldie moldy covered with this drum recording method, just a rhythm track.
My observations first:
I was trying to stay true to the Johns method, that was the whole point to me and the drums sounded pretty cool as you all have mentioned.

BUT the whole large drums simply mic'd may only be useful for a very empty recording or a drum solo. AND as much as we all wax sentimental about the Bohnham sound, I think most of us don't really want their recordings to sound like that. Glyn Johns was said to have engineered those. (I have offended someone I know)

SO, I had to raise the pitch of all the drums to punch through the mix.

I couldn't tolerate how bad the 57 on top of the snare sounded no matter where I put it. Doink, doink, just doesn't cut it. So I mic'd the shell with a condenser.

AND, I am feeling less and less enamored with the big drums. When you tune them down to their sweet spot they tend to get thuddy and lost in the mix. The big kick is awsome to listen to in the room or record without any other instruments but that low fundimental gets masked and many system won't even reproduce it.

Rant complete.

The song: I will not be using this so I didn't spend a lot of time on it.......my excuse I guess.
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Lol. Tonight there's gonna be a jailbreak......

That's what I figured would happen. Old style recording techniques don't work as well with modern sounds. Powerful bass and overdriven guitars stomp all over raw drum sounds. I personally like modern punchy drums. Old Zep and Beatles recordings are timid by today's standards. Even us modest home-recorders can make mixes that blow the old stuff away. There's nothing wrong with the old stuff - it's great - but not even the legendary Bonham drum sound would stand up in a modern mix.

There's nothing wrong with close mics if you want an over-the-top drum sound. Hell you need them for that. But raw is good too. It just depends on the music.
 
Fantastic, Accatoir, killer tone!(and all that people said, with a much better english than mine:D).
(I see some traps,do you have cloud(s) above the kit too?)

In the whole mix frequencies between 100/200 hz (includes bass guitar and even snare), are jumping out a bit ...a little cut, and all works even better (IMHO...).
Top notch recording!

Ciro
 
would you happen to have a sample of that big giant bass drum that you would like to share with us? or even a solo'd track of it. i'd love to hear it by itself
 
Thanks a lot Ciro. I'm sure there are a number of things I could improve on this. I mostly was trying to determine if a simple 4 mic recording solution would be usable in a modern recording.

The traps are GIK acoustics, all bass dampeners. I've got 13 total. I'm not using any other sound dampening. The space has lots of natural high frequency diffusion and a carpeted floor.

If I pulled some 150 or so from the guitars maybe the kick would jump a little more. I probably won't pursue this recording any more but am in the process of a colaboration with eyema believer on his tune. I'll be sticking with the Glyn Johns micing method for on that.

Thanks for checking it out.
ac
 
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second skin said:
would you happen to have a sample of that big giant bass drum that you would like to share with us? or even a solo'd track of it. i'd love to hear it by itself
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Standby. I'm working on a project with eyema believer and will need to provide him with a solo'd kick. I'll post it after I get to that point.

In the mean time I don't know if you have heard this odd thing I did with bass and drums only. It has a mean gong drum recording that you may enjoy...........or not. Quite a bit of it at the very end of the tune.

 
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Nice drums and nice Thin Lizzy cover.

The only problem I have - and it's most likely a problem with me , not your recording - is that the snare and kick sound very alike to me. The kick does seem to really cut through, but it just seems like there's alot of top end ocming through.

Am I wrong? And if I'm not wrong, is this normal? Gerg?
 
TelePaul said:
Am I wrong? And if I'm not wrong, is this normal? Gerg?
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It's just the tone of his snare. It's low. The initial attack of the beater does kinda sound like the snare. The highly defined snare crack that we've gotten used to is a relatively new thing in rock music. Listen to Bonham's drums. The snare is snappy and present, but it's not an ear splitting crack like many of todays modern snare sounds. The OP's drums are a pretty good example of old school. ;)
 
What praamps and recording system are you using? Also i'm a bit confused is there eq and compression on the drums only track? Thanks Also is the reverb added or natural?
 
c_corie said:
What praamps and recording system are you using? Also i'm a bit confused is there eq and compression on the drums only track? Thanks Also is the reverb added or natural?
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This was recorded on an Akai DPS 24 using it's own mic pre's. No compression and about 3 db scouped out of the kick mic at around 250hz. I think I may have added a very small amount of "drum booth" to the overheads but not much.
ac
 
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