Fender....Squier....Indonesia...Rosewood...MightyMite?..CORT...Alder C-grade...

CoolCat

CoolCat

Well-known member
Review. Opinion. Comparison. Guitar Manufacturing Globally stuff...

I grabbed a Precision Bass, Squier. 2002, Rosewood neck, plays really nice.
The Squier S/N shows IC02 xxxxxx....Indonesia CORT factory w/ CNC, woods builder for many many companys etc.
02 for 2002, and a 20th Anniversary plate to show Squier is 20yrs old, for Fender.
paid $150 for this thing


Rabbit hole items noted:
*The neck at the nut a little smaller than the US PBass. Does CORT change this or does Fender order this done, I wondered?
*The Tuners and hardware suspect to be secret (mighty mite) and looking at pictures, some Shcector mighty mites look exact and with the same quantity of teeth and forensic viewing showed same (but without any stamps= generic) ssshh. No one can convince me they arent at this point after I counted all the teeth on the gear and measured the tuner and holes, exact copy, twins?
*The tone might be a little thinner, weaker on the Squier...but I dont know anymore, I have a volume knob on the preamp if I want louder. I listened to my USA PBAss tracks and the Squier didnt sound that much different....both are really really quiet compared to my single coils(im in a small place with transformer preamps).
* I read CORT pumps out 100,000's of guitars, they have their woods and film/video of the factory shows its High Tech, its not elmers glue and wood chips, this is a full blown High Tech factory...so not surprised the necks are great and familiar to the dimensions Fender approved. Cheap labor, Automation, No EPA, less taxes, and maybe Rosewood and Alder,Basswood etc are plentiful?
* a nice feature fior Neck Adjusters, the Squier Black PLastic, like the MIM allow tweaking without chipping the wood clearcoat like the wooden/USA Ive had.
* the strings on this one seem original, this was probably a beginners Bass that was never played, the strings are like brand new, red cloth tips.
reading didnt really clarify where the strings were made or by who. I give up chasing that Globally elusive manufacturing shell game...

Opinionated gear end notes:

Seems I paid a normal price and didnt do anything spectacular in shopping. $150 (with a bad tone pot) maybe on the high side. Seems some get them for $60!
Some love them some hate them, again is it a QC issue? probably. I played about 6 Fender basses in the store today and it was amazing how some I loved and some I had no love for. Very subjective decisions.

REPAIR DIY:
Ok plugged it in, tuned it , felt good, no issues imo....until I turned the Tone pot and it was like shortying fuzzing out. Bad pot.
Read about pots, 250k or 500k(brighter)....some reviews said "mini pots"....so I went to GC and the Guitar Expert told me "the BIG POTS would work fine and are actually better and he'd never had a problem ever!."..so I bought them, got home through rush hour traffic...and they didnt fit and I wasnt going to start drilling and filing, so I went back and was refunded, and got "mini pots" and they fit perfectly and was soldered in quickly. Tone Pot $4.50. So Im at $154.50 now!
again...MINI POTS, short shaft... for the Squier Affinity Indonesia 2002 CORT factory ones at least! :eek::eek:

Shall I Upgrade? Am I nuts? Is it WORTH it on a $150 bass?
Then the "GAS" happens, the "UPGRADE Syndrome" of the cheap stuff. It always happens for me and its always confusion.
So $140 for some 62 Fender pickups seems to be a very positive upgrade from Bass forums and players for these Squiers.
Others add the Bourn or CTS pots and Orange Drop vol/tone kit $35 and claim its pretty good.
Some say not much tone change in bridges and nuts. So I like tinkering with gear..

Option 1:DIY is $175 approx.....brand name tone/vol caps and Fender 62 pups.
Option 2: Loaded Pickguards for PBass. $29 No Name- Alnico 5,
Option 3: $60 Squier higher end,
Option 4: $99 MIM loaded , $140 MIJ, $199 USA Fender loaded...$25,000 for custom pups Leo Fender touched with his wanger...you get the idea...$$$$

But upgrading starts seeming off, because a Brand New Affinity is only $299, a used MIM $400-$450, $600-$700 MIJ...or Used USA Fender $900-$1000...new $1800.
A USA Loaded pickguard would put me at $354.50...on an Affinity Squier. Somethings never change....so Im curious what to think about this UPGRADE topic? I do believe the Pickups are a huge part of the sound, more than anything, so I can dump a little on some pickups and put them in myself, no problem. But where does it stop? new necks, new bodys , new bridges? lol Does one end up with a $1000 Squier Affinity. That seems whacked.

For $154.50 I can say its a awesome P-Bass.:thumbs up:

If I drop another $200+ in it will it be worth it?
 

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moving into the setup- intonation, closer listening to string buzz and other fun stuff..

Plugged this into my ISA430 for a preamp and listening a bit closer. I notice my heavy hand was too much for the strings and pickup height....
I was hearing some buzz. If I play softer it got better.

Played with the Pickup Height first and read online , but in the end I set the pickups up using the VU meter-
1) find the weakest lowest output string and set the pickup height....it was my D string.
2) then adjusted the other pickup height to match the output.
This got me a nice equal output, per the VU meter, as I played.

Tuning I checked the intonation and the D-string was out, so I pulled the saddle back, as instructed and the intonation came closer.
This thing has really decent intonation. Everything is in a acceptable 10% for me. Using a rackmount Fender Tuner, I like it better than my software tuners because it doesnt bounce around as much.

Nothing exciting, until I really thought the buzzing heard when I was in the 12th ..14th area, high on the neck was a bit much.
To overcome this string height aka Saddle Height was next. I noticed the previous owner had bottomed out the saddles, probably to make it feel like a 6 string, low action?. Anyway, I raised the saddles considerably and the buzzing went away and I could hit some notes in the 12th 14th frets without buzzing (I dont even do this really often and 99% of my playing is in Frets 1 through 8.

This String Height is really the most subjective imo. If I was a softer player, no pick, higher volume, more professional maybe I could have lower
strings and no fret buzz. But I play as I do so whacking the strings with my .73MM dark gray pick, I raised the strings to get rid of the buzz.
It was a really noticeable "tone change", smoother and less aggressive metal/punk sounding, now it was more jazz, mellow.
Of course raising the Saddle height moved the strings further from the pickups too, so this probably "smoothed out some tone-buzz".
The tiny #3 allen worked well, all adjusting in the mm world of strings and frets.

Revisited the pickup height with the calipers but instead kind of went with my ear and the VU meter on my Bass DI and decided to keep the pickups lower than spec, of 2.8mm to 3.6mm, further away from the strings, flatter to the flush of the pickguard and then just turn up the preamp gain.
1 mm, isnt the end of the world and all the strings VU meter outputs were close as I played around the neck.

Its really "custom" setup for my thick pick, hobbyist playing approach....good intonation and very low buzz, smoother volume between strings, but the strings are a bit higher up in the air, off the neck. I might mess around some more and lower the strings until I here some fret buzz....
but at this point we are talking .5 mm +/- 2?? lol half a thousandths of an inch?
Its kind of nuts, its a hobby....I doubt my sons bass player with Punk live music going would hear the difference, but maybe a acoustic session player in a Jazz bass studio environment might enjoy not having buzz's at the 16th fret and best possible intonation etc..

So far Ive got to give this 2002 P-bass Squier Affinity very high ratings.
Im truly impressed and expected much much less.
Through rabbit hole reading details and todays setup ....other than the sticker on the headstock, theres nothing really "cheap/bad" about this thing.
I am fine with the lighter body and kind of like the slightly smaller neck/nut
US Jazz 38mm
US P Bass 43mm
Squier Affinity P Bass 41.3mm

Being a gearhead I'll probably spend $2 on a Switchcraft guitar jack and solder it in, and maybe toss in $10 on some Bourns and a $3 Orange drop cap for geargeek time. That could put me at $154.50 + ~$15 to $20....$174.50 ish.

Still on the fence for swapping pickups.
Thats getting into more cash right? Is it worth it? hmmm?
 

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When I recently replaced the La Bella flats with Fender Nickel Steel rounds on my Yamaha RBX170Y bass, I had to make similar adjustments to improve the playability and intonation.

I think if you still have that USA Fender P-Bass, it doesn't make much sense to make the new Squier sound more like that - for your use, anyway. OK, though, if you're just seeing what it will sound like then resell it to recoup the money for another project.

I bought my low-priced Yamaha with the intent of using it as a platform for several modifications, the first being swapping out the pups and pots for EMG GZR Passives. Eventually, I hope to put something like those '62 Fender pups into it. But if I get the new Fender Jazz Bass I'm eyeing before that happens I'll probably look for some non-Fender electronics and pups, as I will then have the basic Fender sound I need.
 
Yes , actually a very good point. Why have a bunch of guitars all sounding the same!

Anyway, I just got a killer deal on Reverb with some SDuncans Quarter Pounds! $40 but with 2qty brand new packs of ROTOsounds Bass strings...($60 with charges/shipping.) So its almost a Free set of used Pickups or a Free 2packs of strings... (and has a pot/volume and jack kit tossed in off Fender MIM.)
So at $25 per set of strings, I grabbed it.

Just had brand new set of strings at the counter at GC Friday, but put them back last minute. Now I have 2 new sets for the Peavey and the Squier PB.

What pups are in the Squier PBass Affinity- from Cort , Indonesia?
Doing some rabbit hole surfing, the Pickups in the Squiers P-Bass Affinity are most likely the Cort Factory, Indonesia made by Cort Factory. MODEL: VTB-P.
Im willing to assume these "stock" would be those. The Cort factory loads up their P-Bass with their own pickups would be logical and cost wholesale.. https://www.cortguitars.com/cortBBS/board.php?bo_table=News&wr_id=1266
*it mentions the wires are enamel coated so this sounds like the ones in my guitar.

The SD Quarter Pounds w Stings x 2 and control wiring set is some spares.. A lot of good reviews Quarter Pounder..will see.
Maybe they'll sound a little different. If I dont hear some big change the old Peavey needs a pups worse than the Squier. The Peavey has the amazing Maple neck though, and its survived decade in this house, the Squier Jazz has lasted 30yrs which is kind of amazing as almost everything gets sold or trade around here, sometimes out of boredom.

The "game" here is not tossing a lot of money into this Squier Affinity. Been there done that. Never recoup the money it seems, due to the decal.
Hell if the decal had said CORT P-Bass it would get less chance than a Squier Affinity even though probably same "parents dna".
Fender US Models Ive owned, they have that "professional polished, extra- care, high quality feel" imo, if I was a pro Id have that in a second.
But for playing in a small room, or leaving and loaning stuff to others to play, the high dollar stuff tends to be kept "locked away" like a museum?
a different vibe for some reason? I was reading Paul McCartney mentioned even today he still thinks of Fenders as being too expensive for him, even though he could buy the factory now...I kind of relate. All my expensive stuff seems to get sold before something happens to it, while the Squiers and cheaper stuff can get
used and played and dinged and who cares?
 
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I considered a Squier Affinity for most of last year and would have actually bought one but my color choice wasn't available. I can't even recall what color I had the hots for.. think it was some shade of red. I'm still curious to see how close the Affinity sounds to a "real" Fender. But that's a no-go now as I'm going for another Fender.
 
Jazz bass is another Leo Fender and Company piece of art. So you got your eye one....bidding? or local?

Ever since having the P-Bass theres a nice "set" to have both it and the Jazz. imo.
Necks and pups and whatever it is, but its totally a different instrument. With how many years of making these instruments theres a lot of detail differences too. Somedays my Jazz is it, sometimes the P-Bass sound with its tones is desired, or just some change.

great stuff! never tried the flatwounds yet, I get tempted then I read it can "twist your neck" and odd comments.
you removed the Flats? whats up with that story?
 
Originally, I was going for the American Original '60s Jazz Bass. I was really attracted to the Sonic Blue color but I already have a Daphne Blue Strat, so I talked myself into the old school 3-color sunburst. While waiting around for a new one to become available, I keep checking stores and Fender's site for availability.

Then on Fender's site I spot their 75th Anniversary Commemorative Jazz Bass and I'm blown away by it's Bourbon Burst finish and Custom Shop pups - not to mention the rest of the goodies. AND.. it's less expensive than the American Original I was hooked on previously.

Right now neither is available [sigh]

___________

On the flatwounds.. My Yamaha came with roundwounds, which sounded great through the floor amps at the store but failed the DI recording test at home. So for a combination of reasons, I decided to put some flats on. I remembered my first "real" electric SG bass came with flats and I didn't know any better so I was raised on them, so to speak. All we were doing at the time was playing in basements and recording stereo reel-to-reel. They got the job done. So I decided to try a set.

After reading many online discussions and reviews, I landed on the La Bella Deep Talkin' flatwounds Heavy 052, .073, .095, .110. I should have filed down the nut or replaced it altogether but I left it alone with the E & A strings riding slightly high in their grooves. That raised the action to it's tolerable limit for me and was just barely playable. Those worked well for the one song I got them for.

The next song needed a better tonal quality and more presence and that's why I switched to the Fender Nickel Steel roundwounds. I'm very happy with these and will be using them for the next few songs at least.

About the flats "twisting your neck", I read lots of cautions on that, too. Especially since I was putting Heavy gauge on a neck that wasn't designed for them. I wasn't worried as I didn't plan on keeping them on for long. I was worried about the flimsy looking string tree on my Yamaha not being able to handle the strain. There's only a couple of skinny screws holding that in - I kept expecting it to pop and slingshot across the room every time I played it. None of the bad stuff ever happened. Even the nut survived the pressure and the new roundwounds are comfortable there.
 
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man, you are a lot more serious a bass player than me! changing strings for songs.
Your neck doesnt get whacked with the flatwounds each change out?

Im so tempted for flatwounds because I dislike the screech-sound when sliding on the strings, same as acoustics, the screech becomes a large distraction.
Flatwounds sounds good, turning the tone a bit can help. I like smooth fat bass (love my Jazz sound best though it gets a lot of single coil noise!)

funny, I was thinking this Cort- Fender P-Bass (Squier) is like buying a KlarkTeknik 76 comp, or a WARM U47...... its a P-Bass really built by CORT, with Squier-Affinity decal. ..so its a CORT built , using Fenders approval from their P-Bass, but with Squier series ...like WARM building Neumanns without the exact components....but they work well. Im still impressed with the sound and especially the instrument for such little cash. I suppose when recording a lot of the sound is the pups, so still curious about that part.
 
LOL - - You should check in with @TalismanRich about bass strings :guitar: https://homerecording.com/bbs/threads/recommendation-on-bass-guitar-strings.413450/

Well, I will probably stick with roundwounds for a good while now that I have them dialed in. The flats don't seem to bother the Yamaha, I didn't notice any neck movement.

You'll probably get that smooth, fat bass from different pups and pots. I don't know what they are but the ones I notice on basses having that sound look like fat humbucking units. One thing I found, a GK bass head lends some of that sound to roundwounds. I recently picked up a MB150S VST and an 800RB VST. Much smoother than the Ampegs.

I was just listening to some Squier basses and they do sound close to their big brothers. I have always wondered about their playability and feel - you mentioned yours is nice, so that ties that loose end.
 
Coolcat,

I'm hoping to do the restring on the Peavey bass tomorrow. I'll do some playing with the roundwounds (probably 10yrs old, but still plenty of boing), then I'll put the Bright Flat half rounds on without changing anything on the amp, mic etc. Will post some MP3s after I'm done.
 
Thanks, that will be interesting to hear. Flat half wounds... :eatpopcorn::thumbs up:

I will guess, using QC as the main factor, that US models are much much more consistent and the Squier-lines wherever or whenever they were built are more likely to be "all over the place" for quality over the years. This one is 2002 and yes its decent to play imo. The PUPS sound I will keep looking into. Been reading a lot and wow...subjective and genre, which seems much more important than I recall.

Maybe Im wrong and the CNC Robot made stuff is just
My korea Squier has survived my GAS and Trade/Sell-addiction for 30yrs, its really nice and heading to 30yrs. yikes!

Possibly one of my biggest regrets was selling my US Pbass for $750, and I only paid $545. Its was 5 star. easy.. no question asked.
 
Why don't you look for a used Music Man bass with dual humbuckers. I've never played one but I hear they've got some good low end. Or at least find a low budget bass you can put similar pups and electronics in. Do you own a router? [ just kidding :p ]
 
I too am considering bass guitars. Ideally, a player jazz bass with frets and flatwound, plus another the same but fretless. That would make me happy.
Guitar prices are zooming up, so I am also looking at cheaper brands. I'm sure I'll find something.
 
The prices are nuts!
Old internet searches show old prices and the gradual increases, sometimes not so gradual.

Sometimes I go too far into the details and today started reading about the Psychology of Brand Names.....because I question why?is there certain gearlusts and blindfold tests etc.... the articles explain well why we like certain brands and why we might prefer one or the other. But reading doesnt seem to change anything.

Strings and height of thousandths of an inch world, seems large at times on guitars.
Moving the pickup heightss can go from Metal to Metal sounding - to Mellow and thick further away.

Strings make a difference. Everything seems to have some impact.....and the decal can have a psychology impact.

Ive had two US PB and one was beautiful the other was easy to get rid of. Ive a gorgeous Jazz Squier player and sound, and a Peavey Fury that has a great neck, maple, but its pups are really weak but then in an amp, turn the volume up,,,lol
 
TalismanRich said:
CC, I did the string swap yesterday, and have posted a quick comparison of the roundwounds to the "Groundwounds" (GHS Brite Flats). You can find the files here under the Guitars and Basses section. The strings made a difference, for sure. A bit darker, much quieter, and easier on the finger tips for this ol' guitar player.

Click to expand...
Ok that was a listen and theres no doubt the Flats sounded smoother and better to my ears.
The roundwounds sound more like my PBass, some edgey mids metal bite...which might be preferred to Metal or other genres.
The Flats sounded really thick and smooth, less metal grain slides too when the hands move.
I think I preferred the BOTH sample but the Neck was really nice tone too.

great comparison ..thanks for posting that!:thumbs up:
 
I play jazz and lounge stuff on my loved Peavey International 5 string - gentle playing, fingers only and the action is really low - great to play. In the band I needed to be more aggressive and quite a few songs need fingers and either a pick or nails - I have tough nails so use them. The action just has to be higher and I use an American Jazz 5 string for the band. I couldn't find a compromise to allow me to use the Peavy for everything - so for me, it's always going to be two basses.
 
I've got a range of guitars from the Indonesian Peavey bass, to a Korean made G&L ASAT Tribute, a Korean made DeArmond, several US made Heritages, a US Fender, and a tele style hand made in Louisiana by Gerard Melancon (RIP). Each has it's good points and bad points. I played most of the guitars before I bought them, a few were bought used off Ebay but I had already played similar guitars before.

From a strictly quality standpoint, the Melancon is the nicest. Fretwork and setup were impeccable, which is very common on his guitars. It was also the one I paid the most. 5 were bought new. For minor issue like changing a pot or tweaking a truss rod, I can handle it. I don't have the tools to do fret dressing. I've changed pickups in a couple of guitars. Not a big deal, and really doesn't have to be that expensive. Heck I took the family to dinner last weekend and it cost almost $150. You can buy a Lollar P-Bass pickup for that.

I don't worry a whole lot about the decal. I look for good playing guitars. I hate guitars with sharp frets. I hate certain neck shapes (PRS guitars have never fit me). When I buy a guitar, it should stay in the stable. Flipping guitars is not my thing. Resale value is the furthest thing from my mind. The kids can worry about that when I'm gone.
 
I was really kind of shocked how different the Flats sounded vs the Rounds in those audio samples.
My rounds have a ringing sound that I dont really care for and heard it in those samples too.
While my Jazz w/ old old strings sound like flats and I guess I like that tone best.
Also when I slide my hand up and down the neck, the rounds screeeeech a lot more than my dead Jazz smooth stings making me sound like a better player. But your samples also show the Jazz with Rounds can sound "gritty/metal bite" like my PBass with Rounds? :confused:

so wow, imo if the strings are setup the same, both rounds = same, the sound is really really similar of my US tracks and Squier.
Which leaves the materials as the major cost differences. Quality, built with the best stuff they have available in the Brand Name, "should"
be representative of the materials, more so than the sound...it seems to me. The sound being the electronics and the strings setups.
That makes peace in my brain. But maybe this Squier PB is a decent one, Alder, Rosewood, mightymite tuners and soon will try QuartPounders that comes with electronics wired up. (and two packs of Round Wound...Roto 66...110's? )....

US PBass I had was quality 5 stars...it is the top of the mountain in a way.
but this Squier is Alder, Rosewood, and good CNC neck and plays and tunes excellent and sounds very similar for $150 & gets 5 stars imo. maybe for some different reasons like the cost.

back to strrings.....so my Jazz will be the smooth one= flats....and my P-Bas will be the one with zingy, bit of metal-ness rounds.
maybe Half-Flats sounds like something for the Peavey?!:D:drunk:

I think of smooth, like Sgt Pepper , Jazzy-Blues smooth flat string sound... or half flat tones (or old old strings? like my Jazz)..
but then I like the gritty round wounds too, make me think of Nirvana, OffSpring , Metal and Punk...newer grunge punk harder rock, more bite...is it more treble.

I might have been associating the tones to the Jazz vs Precision, when in fact it was more so the strings!
 
The differences that I hear between a Jazz and Precision bass is mainly in the pickup placement and style. The Jazz can go from warm to spanky and anywhere in between because of the spacing of the pickups. A little bit of blending the two, you can approximate the P-bass sound. The P-bass doesn't have the really the bright spanky sound that you can get with a Jazz because the approximate placement of the single pickup is roughly the same as the neck pickup of a Jazz. Of course the advantage is the ability to have a humbucking winding.

I was curious how the ground down roundwound strings would sound. I think pure flats can be too dull sounding. Using just finger style makes things even more pronounced. Sometimes it makes the notes a little to indistinct for me. So far, I'm liking the sound of the groundwounds with a heavy pick. Nice full sound with just a bit of bite on the initial transient. Not as "boingy" as the rounds, not as dull as the flats. Maybe the best of both styles.

I'm playing more bass, just to get more comfortable with it. I'm sure that's helping my technique. I'm pretty erratic in the consistency of the note volume, especially when I'm a little unsure of the song. That's something for me to work on before the next time I have to fill in on bass (whenever that will be).
 
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