Cassette flutter is out of control

A

avieth

New member
Because I am too skint to buy a 2-track open reel machine, I use a cassette deck to record my finished mixes. I'm noticing a lot of flutter on the recordings. I know cassettes are far from a great recording medium, but this is an unacceptable amount of flutter. I tried recording some solo piano. Playing back the take, the piano sounded like a twangy 80's synth with low-frequency modulation.

Instantly I assumed the problem is the pinch roller. I took a look at the transport and everything seems fine, but the pinch roller is shiny and soft. Not tarry, just lacking friction. Is there anything I can do to restore the roller and lose the flutter?
 
You say 'soft'. How soft? Some pinch rollers get shiny and hard and others go soft and gooey. In the latter case, a rubber treatment, such as CaiKleen RBR from www.caig.com may actually make things worse. You can try it but personally I'd wanna make sure the roller isn't bordering on being 'gooey' or too soft.

Your next option could be a replacement and also one for the capstan belt, which are heavily contributing to wow and flutter.

--
 
Last edited:
cjacek said:
You say 'soft'. How soft? Some pinch rollers get shiny and hard and others go soft and gooey. In the latter case, a rubber treatment, such as CaiKleen RBR from www.caig.com may actually make things worse. You can try it but personally I'd wanna make sure the roller isn't bordering on being 'gooey' or too soft.
Click to expand...

It's more shiny than it is soft. What I meant to say was smooth, not soft.

Your next option could be a replacement and also one for the capstan belt, which are heavily contributing to wow and flutter.
--
Click to expand...

Hm, I think the capstan belt might really be a problem. I took this picture:
picturetd6.jpg


As you can see the belt appears to have been glued together. I'm not sure if this is common in manufacturing or if it's actually a problem. Other than the splice, the belt seems to be in good condition.
 
avieth said:
It's more shiny than it is soft. What I meant to say was smooth, not soft.
Click to expand...

OK, got it. I'd use the CaiKleen on it, to restore some of the grip.

Hm, I think the capstan belt might really be a problem. I took this picture:

As you can see the belt appears to have been glued together. I'm not sure if this is common in manufacturing or if it's actually a problem. Other than the splice, the belt seems to be in good condition.
Click to expand...

It's a good thing you took that photo. The belt was indeed glued together which is making the problem worse. You really do need to order a new one and, just in case, order a new pinch roller assembly [along with the service manual, while you're at it]. What type of deck is this? If it's a TASCAM / TEAC, then order one from the factory. Most likely they have 'em.

Snap a nice photo like this for the pinch roller too. Just wanna see.

--
 
This is a Marantz 5025B. I contacted Marantz asking about getting replacement belts or rollers. I don't expect good news, but I had to try.

I have an Akai deck that is missing a timer belt, but has a good capstan belt. Maybe I'll try it on. Anyways, I'll snap a photo of the roller later tonight. It's tough to get good lighting in there.
 
OK, you can probably pick up a generic belt locally or online [on the cheap] but you'd have to know what size of belt you need. This guy, it seems, did the hard work for you but it's a bit more money:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Marantz-Cassett...hash=item360071902802&_trksid=p3286.m14.l1318
...and this:
http://www.vintage-electronics.cc/marantzkits.html

Ask the sellers above if they also carry the pinch rollers for this deck and / or contact Marantz about it too or to give you any leads.

You may also ask http://www.terrysrubberrollers.com/ if he would re-rubber your pinch roller.

----
 
cjacek said:
This guy, it seems, did the hard work for you
Click to expand...

:eek: I think you've done the hard work for me! Thanks for the links :D

Vintage-electronics.com is definitely the solution. That eBay sale is impressive, but he refuses to ship to Canada.
 
picturepf3.jpg


Here's a grainy shot of the pinch roller. It's not gooey or anything, just smooth.

I recorded some test frequencies. Playing them back, the flutter gets more noticeable the higher the frequency. Low frequencies (I tried 20Hz and 200Hz) were actually quite acceptable, but 1KHz and 2KHz were very fluttery. Is there anything else, besides that roller and capstan belt, that could be contributing to this?
 
Last edited:
avieth said:
Here's a grainy shot of the pinch roller. It's not gooey or anything, just smooth.

I recorded some test frequencies. Playing them back, the flutter gets more noticeable the higher the frequency. Low frequencies (I tried 20Hz and 200Hz) were actually quite acceptable, but 1KHz and 2KHz were very fluttery. Is there anything else, besides that roller and capstan belt, that could be contributing to this?
Click to expand...

OK, that's a very good picture and fills me in on the details. The pinch roller is in rough shape. You need to clean it with the special rubber cleaner. I'd also clean the metal capstan shaft, with 90% or higher isopropyl alcohol. It needs to shine. Do it all with a lint free rag.

A bad pinch roller alone will significantly contribute to wow & flutter so it needs attention - with the possibility of replacement if the rubber cleaner reacts badly with the roller. The belt now has a little 'bump' in it [where it was glued], which adds to the problem.

The roller and capstan belt contributes most, if not all, to the problem. Lets fix those 2 things and see what happens.

Is there any reason that you do not mix-down to CDR, via your computer's sound card?

---
 
cjacek said:
Is there any reason that you do not mix-down to CDR, via your computer's sound card?
Click to expand...

When I mix down, I capture both a 44.1KHz, 16-bit .wav file as well as the cassette copy. The digital copy is more portable and sounds just as good, but since I track on tape I just think it's necessary to produce an analog master copy, even if it's just a cassette. Plus I like to have a hard copy of the final mix.

Thanks for all the help! Now I have to wait for the parts to come in the mail.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top