Can Sonar Generate MTC/SMPTE?
- Thread starter miller325
- Start date
Sure it can - look in the Sonar help if you can't find it in the manual.
What it won't do - without an external converter box, is produce the SMPTE audio signal used to "Stripe" the time code on a tape - Sonar only uses the Midi version of SMPTE.
Anyway, the MTC settings are under the Project options menu.
What it won't do - without an external converter box, is produce the SMPTE audio signal used to "Stripe" the time code on a tape - Sonar only uses the Midi version of SMPTE.
Anyway, the MTC settings are under the Project options menu.
Jim,
Thanks for the information. That's good news. I really didn't think it could generate MTC. The reason I don't look in the manual is that I don't have Sonar. I use Performer on a Mac but I also use Acid Pro (chasing Performer via MTC) and would like to put everything on one computer. That's why I've been looking at Sonar. I bought a cheap copy of Pro Audio 9 off of ebay and loaded it into my PC. I also installed the Sonic Foundry Virtual Midi Router so I could control one program from the other. Much to my surprise, however, I found that PA9 could not generate MTC. Fortunately, Acid can both Trigger From and Generate Midi Time Code. So I have PA9 chasing Acid through the VMR. It works, but I wouldn't want to make the big switch unless I am positive that Sonar can generate MTC. I want to control Acid from Sonar, not the other way around like I have to do with PA9. So....you are positive that under the Project options menu there is a setting where you can have Sonar "Generate Midi Timecode"--it says this for sure? You're sure they're not talking about Midi Sync? The peolpe at Smart Loops, who include some of their loops with Sonar, were 99.9% positive that it could not generate MTC. All of the info at the Cakewalk site is vague on the subject. But..if you're positive?
Philip
Thanks for the information. That's good news. I really didn't think it could generate MTC. The reason I don't look in the manual is that I don't have Sonar. I use Performer on a Mac but I also use Acid Pro (chasing Performer via MTC) and would like to put everything on one computer. That's why I've been looking at Sonar. I bought a cheap copy of Pro Audio 9 off of ebay and loaded it into my PC. I also installed the Sonic Foundry Virtual Midi Router so I could control one program from the other. Much to my surprise, however, I found that PA9 could not generate MTC. Fortunately, Acid can both Trigger From and Generate Midi Time Code. So I have PA9 chasing Acid through the VMR. It works, but I wouldn't want to make the big switch unless I am positive that Sonar can generate MTC. I want to control Acid from Sonar, not the other way around like I have to do with PA9. So....you are positive that under the Project options menu there is a setting where you can have Sonar "Generate Midi Timecode"--it says this for sure? You're sure they're not talking about Midi Sync? The peolpe at Smart Loops, who include some of their loops with Sonar, were 99.9% positive that it could not generate MTC. All of the info at the Cakewalk site is vague on the subject. But..if you're positive?
Philip
That's another big plus for Sonar. That's why it's the top consideration for me. From everything I've read Sonar can automatically change the tempo and key of acidized loops just like Acid. I've also read about peolpe who prefer Acid for working with loops over Sonar's looping section and they either sync the two, as I plan to do, or place their Midi tracks in Acid and work there, which doesn't sound too good to me. I was trying o nail down if this first group of people had to control Sonar from Acid or if Sonar can truly generate MTC. If it can, apparently it's the first Cakewalk sequencer to be able to do so. It's very nice having both programs on one computer (PA9 and Acid) instead of having to use two computers. So far I like PA9. I've only been using it about five days now. Used Performer for about twelve years. Performer is fantastic but I've come to depend on Acid for my drum parts. I need to upgrade my computer but can't afford two new ones. I use Mac about 50% of the time and PCs the other 50. I won't make any comments here, just let me say this is going to be a tough decision, OS wise. But just speaking of Sonar, the reviews have been great. It tied Perfomer in this year's Electronic Musician for sequencer of the year. Sorry to go on for so long.
My apologies Philip. There is no Transmit MTC option. I was confused with MMC - Doh! I should know better. 
But it occurs to me, that if Acid can respond to MMC (transport control), and if it can be set to use a soundcard audio clock, as Sonar can, then as long as they start together, they should stay in time if using the same timing referance.
As you probably now realise, Sonar can use acidized loops so you might consider producing the loops in Acid and use Sonar for mixing. But you can make the loops in Sonar too.
Consider downloading the Sonar demo - it's not the latest version but is fully functional (you can save your work) for 30 days.
But it occurs to me, that if Acid can respond to MMC (transport control), and if it can be set to use a soundcard audio clock, as Sonar can, then as long as they start together, they should stay in time if using the same timing referance.
As you probably now realise, Sonar can use acidized loops so you might consider producing the loops in Acid and use Sonar for mixing. But you can make the loops in Sonar too.
Consider downloading the Sonar demo - it's not the latest version but is fully functional (you can save your work) for 30 days.
Jim,
I'm not sure about the MMC thing, but it's worth a try. I'm afraid that while the two programs might start together they would eventually begin drifting without the MTC lock. But if they are both clocked to the same auido clock maybe not. I have never used MMC. I did find another blurb about Sonar's sync capabilities in a Cakewalk press release where they say that Sonar has "...full SMPTE/MTC sync support..." But that's not really enough information. That could be interpreted in different ways. It's just really hard to believe that Sonar cannot generate Midi Time Code. Acid can both chase and generate, but not both at the same time. Performer can chase one type of time code, like MTC at the same time it is generating a differnet time code, like Midi Sync. Thanks for the clarification.
Philip
I'm not sure about the MMC thing, but it's worth a try. I'm afraid that while the two programs might start together they would eventually begin drifting without the MTC lock. But if they are both clocked to the same auido clock maybe not. I have never used MMC. I did find another blurb about Sonar's sync capabilities in a Cakewalk press release where they say that Sonar has "...full SMPTE/MTC sync support..." But that's not really enough information. That could be interpreted in different ways. It's just really hard to believe that Sonar cannot generate Midi Time Code. Acid can both chase and generate, but not both at the same time. Performer can chase one type of time code, like MTC at the same time it is generating a differnet time code, like Midi Sync. Thanks for the clarification.
Philip
Cakewalk.com now supply a Sonar2.0 demo - that is the latest version.
What I suggested about syncing Acid, I think another possible hitch would be Song position - Again, it isn't clear if Sonar will transmit this under MTC, though it states it will under Midi Clock.
But if Acid can transmit MTC - why not slave Sonar to that?
I consider synchronization a fundamental part of a studio but for some reason, reviewers never comment on it apart from restating the manufacturers top-line spec. They are far too besotted with the Audio plug-in stuff to notice these basic things.
As a user of a hardware multitracker (Roland VS840 - humble I am) I was looking for a PC midi sequencer to replace my old AtariST system - I had a lot of trouble finding one that actually clearly stated that it supported slave to midi clock/MTC. Not one review even mentioned it.
What I suggested about syncing Acid, I think another possible hitch would be Song position - Again, it isn't clear if Sonar will transmit this under MTC, though it states it will under Midi Clock.
But if Acid can transmit MTC - why not slave Sonar to that?
I consider synchronization a fundamental part of a studio but for some reason, reviewers never comment on it apart from restating the manufacturers top-line spec. They are far too besotted with the Audio plug-in stuff to notice these basic things.
As a user of a hardware multitracker (Roland VS840 - humble I am) I was looking for a PC midi sequencer to replace my old AtariST system - I had a lot of trouble finding one that actually clearly stated that it supported slave to midi clock/MTC. Not one review even mentioned it.
Jim,
You're right, reviewers rarely mention the synching capabilities of a sequencer. Right now Acid is chasing Performer on a Mac. I Have PA9 on the PC to see how I like Cakewalk sequencers, to see if I could put everything on one computer. PA9 is chasing Acid through the Virtual Midi Router. But I use Acid mainly for drums and it would be much better if PA9 was the master. Unfortunately there is no Mac program that is comparable to Acid. Oh well, it was worth a try. I like PA9, and I know I would like Sonar even better but I guess I'll just stay with things the way they are. By the way, when I was trying to nail this down I wrote Scott Garrigus. Here is his reply which I received today:
Hi Philip,
No, unfortunately, Sonar's time code sync features work the same way as they do in PA9. Sonar can't be the master when dealing with SMPTE/MIDI Time Code.
Regards,
Scott
--
Scott R. Garrigus - Author of Cakewalk, Sound Forge, and SONAR Power! books
You're right, reviewers rarely mention the synching capabilities of a sequencer. Right now Acid is chasing Performer on a Mac. I Have PA9 on the PC to see how I like Cakewalk sequencers, to see if I could put everything on one computer. PA9 is chasing Acid through the Virtual Midi Router. But I use Acid mainly for drums and it would be much better if PA9 was the master. Unfortunately there is no Mac program that is comparable to Acid. Oh well, it was worth a try. I like PA9, and I know I would like Sonar even better but I guess I'll just stay with things the way they are. By the way, when I was trying to nail this down I wrote Scott Garrigus. Here is his reply which I received today:
Hi Philip,
No, unfortunately, Sonar's time code sync features work the same way as they do in PA9. Sonar can't be the master when dealing with SMPTE/MIDI Time Code.
Regards,
Scott
--
Scott R. Garrigus - Author of Cakewalk, Sound Forge, and SONAR Power! books