Cabling qestion

S

Smoulders

New member
Hi there everybody.

Just wondering. If you are taking the output of some outboard gear that has a choice of either balanced XLR output or balanced 1/4" Jack output but you are going into the in of a patch bay which takes jack only, is it better to use a balanced XLR to Jk cable or a balanced jk to jk cable of equivalent value or is there nothing in it. Also, just to confirm am I right in saying that a stereo jk lead will always be balanced? whereas a mono jk will be unbalanced, so even if you are taking a mono out it would be better to use a stereo cable over a mono as it will be balanced?

Many thanks in advance

Nick
 
It's not stereo or mono at that point -- It's just balanced or unbalanced.

A "stereo" line-level cable is actually acting as two unbalanced cables (in the case of headphones, etc.).

Semantics and what not aside -- TRS is balanced, TS is unbalanced, you will never go wrong running balanced (even to unbalanced connections).

HOWEVER -- As long as you're going to be grabbing some cables, make sure your 1/4" outputs are actually balanced. If not, go with the XLR to TRS cabling.
 
Hi Massive Master.

Thanks alot for the quick response. That has really helped.

1 thing....If a male XLR goes to a TRS jack is it definately balanced?

Many thanks
 
The cable will be balanced. Assuming the signal is balanced, then yes. If it's an unbalanced connector on the unit, the signal will remain unbalanced.
 
Technically, the signal is balance or not balanced, not the cable. A cable with 2 conductors and a shield is capable of carrying a balanced signal, if you feed it one.

A cable with 1 conductor and a shield can only carry an unbalanced signal.

Also, don't confuse the connector with the type of signal it's carrying.
 
Never saw the advantage of a balanced line out or in on a patchbay in a home recording studio.Balanced lines are advantagious when you are running long cables or mic lines of 30 feet or more such as a PA snake on a live feed to a PA or broadcast application.I have used unbalanced lines in my patchbays for over 35 years.Now digital to digital is a different story.If your mastering equipment (DAW) has a fiber optic output to a CD fiber optic input as my DAW and CD recorder has,then that makes a difference.But analog to analog makes no difference in the final sound balanced or unbalanced in the final "Patch." tip,ring,sleeve 1/4" phone jacks are more expensive then tip,ring 1/4" phone jacks and it's alot easier to work with a ground and a hot wire then working and wiring 3 wires.Just my opinion and that and a buck fifty will get you a cup of coffee at the waffle house.
 
kennyboy37 said:
Never saw the advantage of a balanced line out or in on a patchbay in a home recording studio.Balanced lines are advantagious when you are running long cables or mic lines of 30 feet or more such as a PA snake on a live feed to a PA or broadcast application.I have used unbalanced lines in my patchbays for over 35 years.Now digital to digital is a different story.If your mastering equipment (DAW) has a fiber optic output to a CD fiber optic input as my DAW and CD recorder has,then that makes a difference.But analog to analog makes no difference in the final sound balanced or unbalanced in the final "Patch." tip,ring,sleeve 1/4" phone jacks are more expensive then tip,ring 1/4" phone jacks and it's alot easier to work with a ground and a hot wire then working and wiring 3 wires.Just my opinion and that and a buck fifty will get you a cup of coffee at the waffle house.
Click to expand...

I'm going to disagree with you. If you've used a lot of unbalanced stuff via patch fields over 35 years without issues, you've been lucky...but the potential problems are the sort that can sneak up and bite you when you least expect them.

First off, the reason I'm saying this is NOT to do with audio quality. All things being equal, there should be no audible quality difference between balanced and unbalanced. The purpose of a balanced signal is not to improve the audio quality--it's to protect you against outside electrical interference. Such interference can come from all sorts of unexpected sources--for example the thermostat in your room can suddenly start arcing after years of quiet service. Or somebody can walk by with a cell phone switched on and give you that bleepity bleep sound. Using all balanced, I can put my cell phone on top of my mixer with no issues (bad idea I know!) but even one unbalanced feed into the mixer and it's bleepity bleep time.

That brings me to a second point specific to patch fields. Mixing balanced and unbalanced on the same patchfield row can mean that any interference on the unbalanced inputs can also affect every other input on the row. This depends a bit on how the patchfields are wired--but it's bad practice.

As for cost and difficulty, the difference between a TS and a TRS connector is pennies (at my old UK supplier it was precisely 5p per connector...ie. about 8 cents difference. The difference in wiring time was maybe 30 seconds per connector I soldered.

Yeah, my back ground is broadcast and the last facility I worked in had literally 80km of audio cabling (and 3 full 19 inch racks of audio patching in the central control area with more in every outlying room) but I have a strong preference for balanced everywhere and would never recommend anyone uses unbalanced if balanced is an option.
 
You make some good points Bobbsy...I guess the reason I have never encountered these problems is I have always used power conditioners in my rack and on my board as well as outboard gear.Furman makes some great power conditioners at affordable prices which I would reccomend anyone using who's serious about their recordings not to mention that a power conditioner also keeps the AC power consistant.Duke Energy will feed my power conditioner in my rack anywhere from 116 volts to 125 volts.And I guess I have been lucky as well.If you are serious about your equipment then invest in some good power conditioners.
 
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