Building dim and aug chords in theory

A

Alexxxander

Member
Hi,
So theoretically:

Question 1.
Any chord can have #5. And those that are major ones can be called augmented chords. Any fukn major chord with all its extensions can be made augmented, right??

And any chord can have b5. And those that are minor ones can be called diminished chords. Any mother fukn minor chord with all its extensions can be made diminished??

Question 2.
And if I take a minor6 chord with all its crazy possible extensions and flatten the 5th, I should get a crazy fully dim chord, right??

Am I right? Thnx bros and sis. Cheers
 
If this was a serious question, then I suppose we should really think about what a chord actually is - You can do almost anything to a chord and change and add to the notes. The trouble is you quickly start to get crazy chord names, and worse, while it technically might be the correct 'name', the actual notes might make it a simpler explanation of a differently named chord. like Am7 vs C6, and once you start adding 11ths, 13ths plus augmented and diminished notes - it's often necessary to sit and look at a keyboard and try to work out what it really is?

I kind of got the idea you knew the answer to the question - so what's going on behind the scenes?
 
I've actually made up some chords.
I think.
I don't know if they were augmented, diminished or b5#11ths because as far as I knew, I made them up.
It's funny listening to the recordings of the songs with those chords. They're years old, I remember the songs, they sound cool but I can't, for the life of me, remember the finger positions !
 
rob aylestone said:
If this was a serious question, then I suppose we should really think about what a chord actually is - You can do almost anything to a chord and change and add to the notes. The trouble is you quickly start to get crazy chord names, and worse, while it technically might be the correct 'name', the actual notes might make it a simpler explanation of a differently named chord. like Am7 vs C6, and once you start adding 11ths, 13ths plus augmented and diminished notes - it's often necessary to sit and look at a keyboard and try to work out what it really is?

I kind of got the idea you knew the answer to the question - so what's going on behind the scenes?
Click to expand...
U think my question is not serious?? Then u shouldn’t answer it.
And the music is not about naming things but it’s about sounding things.
Well , I knew the answer 90%, but wanted to know maybe there’s any hidden things here.

Cheers mate. Thnx
 
grimtraveller said:
I've actually made up some chords.
I think.
I don't know if they were augmented, diminished or b5#11ths because as far as I knew, I made them up.
It's funny listening to the recordings of the songs with those chords. They're years old, I remember the songs, they sound cool but I can't, for the life of me, remember the finger positions !
Click to expand...
Same here. Me too.
Cheers
 
There are websites where you can put in any notes or finger patterns and it will tell you what the chord would be named. Given a set of "rules" any chord can be built. Whether that chord is pleasant, or proper in the scheme of other chords in the song is another matter.
 
Here's a website I tripped across which tells you what the HAIL you just played. I use a couple single-note chords which I figured might not be actual chords, but this thing gave them a name. These "chords" have a single-fretted note played with the other 5 strings open.

Chord Namer

JGuitar's chord namer will automatically name almost any chord shape. Simply tell it where on the fretboard you're placing your fingers.
jguitar.com jguitar.com
 
spantini said:
Here's a website I tripped across which tells you what the HAIL you just played. I use a couple single-note chords which I figured might not be actual chords, but this thing gave them a name. These "chords" have a single-fretted note played with the other 5 strings open.

Chord Namer

JGuitar's chord namer will automatically name almost any chord shape. Simply tell it where on the fretboard you're placing your fingers.
jguitar.com jguitar.com
We
Click to expand...

Well I think I’ve made myself misunderstood. Sorry. In fact I know exactly what and where the notes are, and can name things more or less quite precisely. At least so I can understand myself what I’m doing. This thread is about dim and aug chords. I started to dive deeper into music theory and wandering maybe there’s any more hidden things about these dim and aug fuckers which I like so much for their tensions and resolutions.
Have a nice day.
 
Alexxxander said:
Well I think I’ve made myself misunderstood. Sorry. In fact I know exactly what and where the notes are, and can name things more or less quite precisely. At least so I can understand myself what I’m doing. This thread is about dim and aug chords. I started to dive deeper into music theory and wandering maybe there’s any more hidden things about these dim and aug fuckers which I like so much for their tensions and resolutions.
Have a nice day.
Click to expand...
I would not get too hung up on chordal theory. There are plenty of great songs that use quite simplistic chords. Just please play what floats your boat. Blackbird by Paul McCartney he just uses two fingers up and down the neck. South City Midnight Lady by Pat Simmons Doobie Brothers is in open G. There is a pattern in Aja by Steely Dan where they use an Eminor 13 pattern moving up and down.
Just play what you like and feel, thats all I would say.
Take care xxxx
 
Smithers XKR said:
I would not get too hung up on chordal theory. There are plenty of great songs that use quite simplistic chords. Just please play what floats your boat. Blackbird by Paul McCartney he just uses two fingers up and down the neck. South City Midnight Lady by Pat Simmons Doobie Brothers is in open G. There is a pattern in Aja by Steely Dan where they use an Eminor 13 pattern moving up and down.
Just play what you like and feel, thats all I would say.
Take care xxxx
Click to expand...
I think there's two values to most music theory: descriptive and exploratory. The descriptive aspect allows you clearly communicate what is going on with other similarly-versed musicians.
I think what Alexxx is describing here is more of an exploratory aspect of it. i.e. "Given XYZ constraints, what happens if you push the limits this way?" Which is why I say he should just go for it. He's already sussed out the rules that he wants to bend. The only thing left is to see if he likes how it sounds.
 
It sounds like maybe you're talking about enharmonic equivalents?
In C Major G# is a raised 5th and Ab is a flattened 6th so, while they're the same pitch, they're modifications of different notes of the scale.

It's possible to have two chords of the same make-up but with different names, depending on what they're derived from.
Often the context, the piece of music or what the other instruments are doing, reveal what the chord really is.
 
Steenamaroo said:
In C Major G# is a raised 5th and Ab is a flattened 6th so, while they're the same pitch, they're modifications of different notes of the scale.

It's possible to have two chords of the same make-up but with different names, depending on what they're derived from
Click to expand...
That has always mildly amused and flummoxed me.
I remember a story of George Martin and John Lennon where some sax players were doing an overdub on "Good Morning Good Morning" and Martin was giving the notes to the players and Lennon pointed out that he was giving the wrong notes. Martin tried to explain that his F was their Ab because "their Ab is your F." To which he replied, "That's bloody stupid."
I often thought it was a cute story until I started playing music with a clarinettist and discovered my bass guitar Bb was her C.....
 
VomitHatSteve said:
I think there's two values to most music theory: descriptive and exploratory. The descriptive aspect allows you clearly communicate what is going on with other similarly-versed musicians.
I think what Alexxx is describing here is more of an exploratory aspect of it. i.e. "Given XYZ constraints, what happens if you push the limits this way?" Which is why I say he should just go for it. He's already sussed out the rules that he wants to bend. The only thing left is to see if he likes how it sounds.
Click to expand...
Yes. I wanna know all the helpful rules, and bend them if needed. Rules+creativity is a good pair. Both equally important. Thnx for understanding me.
 
Steenamaroo said:
It sounds like maybe you're talking about enharmonic equivalents?
In C Major G# is a raised 5th and Ab is a flattened 6th so, while they're the same pitch, they're modifications of different notes of the scale.

It's possible to have two chords of the same make-up but with different names, depending on what they're derived from.
Often the context, the piece of music or what the other instruments are doing, reveal what the chord really is.
Click to expand...
Ye. Raised forth gives good lydianish satrianish shit to anything. Sharp five to me is very inspiring and most often upliftin. And flattened sixth is always good for that j bond tension shit. Also as a real minorish attribute., to add aeolian spirit to many things. Many are afraid of the min second, but it’s a perfect shit for these Phrygianish tensions Exotic. Thnx
 
Another neat thing about both diminished seventh chords and augmented triads is that they're both symmetrical.

Dim7 = nothing but minor 3rds stacked
Augmented triad = nothing but major 3rds stacked.

This makes it easy to learn fingerings on the guitar especially, because all the inversions look exactly the same. 🙂
 
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