Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata - second attempt

[Trent Reznor]

This is my secondattempt at Beethoven's "Moonlight Sonata", solo piano. I just started learning piano 3 months ago, and basically started learning just to learn this piece. I do welcome any advice to improve it. This is my second attempt at it and I recorded it with two mics and did the best mixing I know how to do, but I'm looking to learn more. So please check it out and tell me what you think.

Moonlight Sonata 192kbps

 

[CyanJaguar]

still has the phasing sound. Are you time shifting one mic? or maybe they are just far enough apart to cause that sound.

I would use only one mic for now.

 

[true-eurt]

For only 3 months of lessons, you picked up fast!!

 

[Trent Reznor]

still has the phasing sound. Are you time shifting one mic? or maybe they are just far enough apart to cause that sound.

I would use only one mic for now.

I'm not hearing any phase.

I'm using a bit of stereo hall reverb, but mainly only on one low-volume mix track. Do you have a time mark (M:SS) where the phasing is obvious? The mics were about 3 ft apart, both about 10" above the hammers around G2 and G5

 

[Trent Reznor]

For only 3 months of lessons, you picked up fast!!

Thanks! but I haven't had any lessons at all. I just self-taught myself, spending around 5-10 minutes a day a few days a week for the last 3 months. I HAD to learn this song.

 

[tenkas]

I have to agree that this do not sound like a natural piano at all.

First, if it's an upright, pull it off the wall and angle with (not parallele with the wall).

The piano also seems out of tune.

For 3 months, yes it is very impressive! As a piano teacher, I suggest you work on your dynamics, especially on the arpeggios.


I suggest you post a version with NO FX and only one omni mic.

 

[Trent Reznor]

I have to agree that this do not sound like a natural piano at all.

First, if it's an upright, pull it off the wall and angle with (not parallele with the wall).

The piano also seems out of tune.

For 3 months, yes it is very impressive! As a piano teacher, I suggest you work on your dynamics, especially on the arpeggios.


I suggest you post a version with NO FX and only one omni mic.

Thanks for the input.

The piano is a 1913 grand piano. It does need tuning but someone said that the soundboard is too fragile and may crack if tuned, however I tried to tune a couple of strings with some crude tools and no training and was able to tune it without breaking anything...so I don't know. I just tuned up a couple strings and then left it alone because of fear of breaking it.

The piano has a bit of that "honky-tonk piano" twang, it lacks the warmth of a new steinway. I really don't know what causes that, perhaps old strings. Also the piano is placed so that the opening end is facing a wall and the hinged side faces the middle of a large room. I think turning it around would imrove the ambient tone but it's not really a viable option right now.

I don't have any omnidirectional mics, my mics are rather cheap and not meant for instruments. I do plan on upgrading eventually of course though.

I suppose the dynamics just take a lot of practice, and I can't read a lick of music so I haven't gotten around to learning dynamics, I just play how I feel and by ear. Most of the last three months was spent finding various badly notated sheet music for this piece and writing out every single note, only to get 2/3 of the way through it and realize the notation was wrong, so I'd move on to another version I found. You mentioned the arpeggios, what would you recommend me trying different? I could probably improve my legato if I knew what to practice or focus on.

It's great to see a piano teacher here, I'd love to hear your advice, and thanks for what you've already offered.

 

[tenkas]

Playing the grand piano is a unique art, and it is very very difficult to explain exactly the type of energy you have to transmit through the music without beeing there.

You're right hand technic is very linear, which means that there is not much dynamic and contrast through the song recorded. I would suggest listenning to has many interpretation, and closely taking notes on your scores where you have to play louder and softer.

As I stated before, dynamics are what distinguish one interpretation from an other, in question of musical energy. You have to approach the song by clearly defining the ups and the lows.

My first language beeing french, I have a little bit of difficulty explain things here in English, but I guess this is a good starter.

I would also recommend practicing hands seperate a lot and try to feel the right hands energy.

An other exercice would be to play the piece with the right hand playing soo slightly on the notes that they would not produce sound, but you would see the keys go down.

 

[Trent Reznor]

Playing the grand piano is a unique art, and it is very very difficult to explain exactly the type of energy you have to transmit through the music without beeing there.

You're right hand technic is very linear, which means that there is not much dynamic and contrast through the song recorded. I would suggest listenning to has many interpretation, and closely taking notes on your scores where you have to play louder and softer.

As I stated before, dynamics are what distinguish one interpretation from an other, in question of musical energy. You have to approach the song by clearly defining the ups and the lows.

My first language beeing french, I have a little bit of difficulty explain things here in English, but I guess this is a good starter.

I would also recommend practicing hands seperate a lot and try to feel the right hands energy.

An other exercice would be to play the piece with the right hand playing soo slightly on the notes that they would not produce sound, but you would see the keys go down.

Great advice, that will give me something to work on.

When I just play it, not worry about recording it, I usually have a little more dynamics. But when recording, the micing takes away from that a bit. And I'm more focused on getting the notes right rather than just relaxing and really letting the music flow through me. I think I'll get a lot better at dynamics once I can play the song twice in a row without any mistakes. In a way I kinda rushed into recording it because I was so excited I achieved a lifelong dream of being able to play that song. (I know it sounds corny but I really have dreamed of learning piano JUST to play Moonlight for 20 years now.)

Your recommendations provide a good example of an exercise that will improve my playing. That's tough to do over the internet, and especially in your non-native tongue. So thank you very much for your time and advice.

 

[ido1957]

Hey Trent, again great job for such a short period of time. I think the tuning is better than the last time. Thank goodness the piano took the tuning without anything bad happening. I think the overall performance was better than the last one too. The overall sound was just ok - probably due to the mics - it just seemed kind of flat sounding, with not a lot of dynamics/flavor. Could be the old strings...Can't hear the phasing issue but my ears are not expert either. Maybe try renting a couple of good mics and record it to see if that makes any difference. Anyway nice job on the playing man...

 

[XLR]

Recording quality is good. Good job with that.

The fact that the piano's out of tune causes all kinds of problems with phasiness and other aspects of sound quality beyond intonation. I think one of the most important things to learn about recording is that the source matters more than the gear or engineering.

Beyond that, I'd eliminate the reverb... this is a sustaining piece by nature with the flowing arpeggios and I think it needs clarity more than verb.

Performance-wise, jump starting as a beginner to a harmonically complex piece like the first movement of the Op27 No2 here, learned measure by measure, is fun but don't expect your technique or musical expressive sense to be sophisticated like it will be when you have a lot of playing experience. Watch out too because learning that way can easily lead to very mechanical playing. A good way to develop musicality, and to test it also, is to sing the upper voice while playing the whole piece, then sing the bass line (in any octave you can) while playing... the middle arpeggio is more difficult to sing in something like this. If you can sing the lines then you know the music is in the head (and hence the heart, to get corny for a moment), not just in the fingers.

Since you mentioned difficulty getting trustable print music... we used the Beethoven Complete Piano Sonatas ed by Heinrich Schenker in my conservatory harmony class and it's good.

Tim

 

[DavidK]

Nice job! Very impressive for a few months of playing Comments:

You dont have to play this music so metronome-like. It should be rubato, which means to steal. Some rhythm is needed, but you can be a lot more free when you are comfortable.

It does need tuning but someone said that the soundboard is too fragile and may crack if tuned,

You might consider throwing the piano away then Seriously, my piano is out of tune too, and I dont play it much because of it. I wouldnt dream of recording it; its, errr, ummm, out of tune. I would rather hear you play a 40 dollar Walmart casio than the best Bosendorfer if the piano is out of tune. The phasing that has been mentioned isnt phasing, its just an out of tune axe.

Keep up the good work, I love the piece too. Its one of the few legit piano pieces I learned in college.