att: LIGHT! .... (re-finish doubt)

A

AlfredB

New member
Hi there!

I have a rather nice ´71 Gretsch Clipper (the rarer 2 PUP model) - which is just a dream to play ... but she is suffering from binding-rot (basically the binding is just crumbling off!).

(here's a pic)

http://foro.audiomusica.com//user_files/17980.jpg


So a good friend of mine (luthier down here in Chile where I live) was carefully taking the binding off ... with the following results:

http://foro.audiomusica.com//user_files/17981.jpg




Now my Q:

how would you proceed...


a.)

FULL refinish, probably "organic style" e.g. tung oil or french polish - so it would probably be looking very "new" - I discard a paint-job - as it probably wont be done really well down here



b.)

minimal re-finish - with touch up pens or those "luthier's fill-sticks" you have to heat up - and then polishing it up... -my doubt here is if it really looks nice at the end (i'd hate if it looked like a street with patched up potholes )


any thoughts from you knowledgable folks out there?

cheers & thx!
alfred
 
AlfredB said:
So a good friend of mine (luthier down here in Chile where I live) was carefully taking the binding off ...
Click to expand...



Sorry if he is a friend, but NO, he was NOT IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM careful in removing the binding.

That is a really fucking shitty ass job of removing that binding. IF he had ever done it before, he would have avoided that. That old cellulose binding just does that, and any competent repair person should know how to deal with it. He obviously did not.

More to the point, a properly conservative approach would have been to leave the binding which was in good shape alone and piece in new binding where it was needed. It would not have looked perfect, but you retain more of the look and value of the instrument that way. If done well, it can all but disappear.

IF it is done right, you can simply replace the binding with new, which does not need finish as it is already a plastic.

So, first order of business is, your friend should be paying for someone competent to fix his fuck up, period.

As to how I would do it, it is hard to say without seeing it in person, and the tape on the sides makes it that much harder to say. It looks like the sides are a single color, not blended like the sunburst on the top. This makes the sides RELATIVLY easy. You need to match the color in all the chips, and then drop fill them to get it roughly level. There is, unfortunately, no way to get it to look right without overspraying it, however, with is going to make it LOOK new. You could also well have collectors complaining about the overspray, but at this point it is better to do so than not.

The real problems come in on the top. I can't see from that shot, but I assume that the top has the same kind of chipping, which is all but impossible to fix as the sunburst is colors blending together. The color is not the same every where, which makes it all but impossible to match.

It is possible, after, the color has been matched and the finish is built up to level to do some french polishing instead of overspraying, but I am never satisfied with the result.

I would NOT recommend a refinish, even if you could get it done right. The other materials you mentioned are not acceptable as a guitar finish, as they do not provide the necessary protection from the elements, particularly in an environment as humid as I assume Chile is.

I assume your friend is a builder, right? Take this as a good lesson. Builders are not repair people, and repair people are not builders. We do different things. I am a builder, but I have three of the best repair folks in the world working in my shop, and I can tell you that I can't do what they do, and they have a much harder time doing what I do than I. It is a very different set of skills, and you need to find the right person for the job.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
Thx light - for the straight shot ...


just to make sure I got it right:

x put on the new binding,
x fill in the chips with black lacquer sticks (the burn-in ones) -
x level/polish everything,
x mask off binding and
x overspray black

I think the original finish is polyurithane NOT lacquer - does this matter for the burn in process?


cheers, and again thx for sharing your knowledge
alfred
 
AlfredB said:
Thx light - for the straight shot ...


just to make sure I got it right:

x put on the new binding,
Click to expand...


Yup.


AlfredB said:
x fill in the chips with black lacquer sticks (the burn-in ones) -
Click to expand...


Doing it right, no. You need to brush (or spray) a little lacquer, and then fill with clear, which is the only way to get the right look.
[/quote]


AlfredB said:
x level/polish everything,
Click to expand...

Well, level it all, yes. But polishing doesn't happen until after it has been over-sprayed/wet sanded.


AlfredB said:
x mask off binding and
x overspray black
Click to expand...

No, if you are overspraying, you are overspraying clear, and if you are spraying it anyway, you want to get the binding. Binding doesn't NEED it, but it is good to have it if you can.


AlfredB said:
I think the original finish is polyurithane NOT lacquer - does this matter for the burn in process?
Click to expand...


If it is the original finish on any American guitar from that era, it is nitrocellulose lacquer. Burning in is something which has no place in professional guitar finish repair. Furniture guys do it some times, but shellac sticks (which is what they are, shellac) never looks very good. If you have a small area on a 4 foot table top, it's fine, but a guitar is subject to closer scrutiny.

Also, you can not just overspray or drop fill with lacquer. You need to soften the surrounding lacquer first, for which we use a solvent called Butylcellosolve (also called lacquer retarder or epoxy reducer). If you don't, you get lap lines.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top