Another beginners MIDI Question

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HomeMadeHitShow

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Another question

I am recording MIDI using a MicroKorg through an M-audio interface to a PC using ACID to record.

I have found that when I try and record using anything other than standard MIDI I get a slight delay, I can understand this.

However when I record using standard MIDI and then switch to a SFZ sound fount or other software syth I find the key hit are slightly late, even though they are on time using the standard MIDI sounds.

I can fix this by moving the file slightly earlier to sync up but if for some reason I go back to standard MIDI then I end up out of time again ?

Any thoughts on this would be great ?

Thanks again.

Tony
 
The reason that the software synth sounds are "late" is that your audio latency is on the high side. This is a common issue if you're trying to play a softsynth in real time with a system that can't hack it (older machine, no ASIO or WDM drivers available, etc.).

If you can't improve the latency, the alternative is to record using the on-board MIDI sounds. Later, switch the MIDI track to drive the desired softsynth instead. The latency is only an issue when you try to play the softsynths in real time.
 
Thanks Alchuck, that's kinda what I thought but that doesn't explain they delay during playback (when I'm just playing it ?) or the fact that the actual MIDI notes are slightly late ...... or does it ? is it all timing issues between PC, and ears etc ?

Thanks

Tony
 
HomeMadeHitShow said:
Thanks Alchuck, that's kinda what I thought but that doesn't explain they delay during playback (when I'm just playing it ?) or the fact that the actual MIDI notes are slightly late ...... or does it ? is it all timing issues between PC, and ears etc ?

Thanks

Tony
Click to expand...

The same will happen with a softsynth. Adjusting latency will solve all this stuff. Try to adjust to a latency around 5 milliseconds. In a program like Cakewalk it is under Options> audio> mixing latency buffer size or something like that.
 
Good stuff David.

Here's the weirdness though. The built in MIDI monitors accurately without latency but records slightly late. If I playback with built in MIDI the timing is correct, even though the MIDI file is late. If I playback with a softsynth then the sound is late, matching the MIDI file. It all seems backwards.

Tony
 
HomeMadeHitShow said:
Good stuff David.

Here's the weirdness though. The built in MIDI monitors accurately without latency but records slightly late. If I playback with built in MIDI the timing is correct, even though the MIDI file is late. If I playback with a softsynth then the sound is late, matching the MIDI file. It all seems backwards.

Tony
Click to expand...
I think this is correct.

Explain built in midi? do you mean the synth that is built in to a soundcard like a soundblaster?

The midi is relatively easy stuff, not a whole lot of latency UNLESS you monitor the audio of it. A softsynth could have latency problems i.e. you play a key and you hear it a 1/4 later, that is latency. I think most of the problem is HEARING it, it might record correctly but you hear it late.

Midi as in Soundblaster cards or a midi synth usually has very few latency issues. A soundfont could for several reasons. What software are you recording with?
 
Another thought:

Midi doesnt record like a tape recorder. It kind of quantizes stuff even if you dont want it to. There is something called PPQ ( parts per quarter?) that divides up a quarter note. In cakewalk I think it is 960 max. If by some chance you have it set to something insanely low, it wont record where you think it will. I am not sure about this, I will test it as I am curious myself.

EDIT: scratch that idea. Even if you have it set to 48, you could barely tell.


EDIT AGAIN: I just messed with my buffer settings. If they are slow its a giant mess!!!!!

In Sonar, there is something called input monitoring. When I listen to a midi synth ( like a hardware Roland) through input monitoring with a buffer setting of 15ms or so, I hear the keyboard after I play it. If I monitor through phones in the Roland it is fine. Find your buffer settings and get em low and it should be better.
 
I'm using ACID to record right now, which is what I am familiar with for non-MIDI. It has various buffer settings etc. but non seem to make much difference.

By standard MIDI I mean just that the Standard MIDI wavetable thingy built into my soundcard. I understand why there would be less latency but not why the midi file is recorded slightly late. It's not a quantize thing.

In the end it's not worth worrying about, I can record and nudge it back into place and I can record then add a soft synth later. I'm mainly using this for piano sounds.

Tony
 
My guess is that you are seeing the crapiness of your sound card (I can have my software play everything late if I use the onboard soundcard). The KX project drivers or ASIO for all
 
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