analog board with digital setup

TragikRemix

TragikRemix

I am NOT a Gear Whore. ;)
i know this has been discussed, but i couldnt find the threads or a decent link or anything..

now; how would implement an analog mixer with a digital setup?

i was looking at consoles like the Toft/trident ATB, and wondering how people use these in conjuction with digital setups.

here's what i was thinking;

mics -> channels 1-16 on board -> each channel has direct out to interface

but then what? thats just for the preamps right? i guess this is where a patchbay might be useful?

or is it;
mics-> preamps into digital interface -> outs of interface back into console as 'summing'? -> back into interface as 2 ch stereo mix.

can someone clear this up for me, or provide a link to where it was already done?
 
with that setup i would go with the m-audio delta 1010 rack since your board has the preamps all you are getting is the converter and thats all you need...besides cables.
 
i already have a digi002r that i plan on keeping, and just using all line's in, and the line ins on my ada8000, until i have the money to upgrade to an HD1 setup :)
 
a TYPICAL setup, without mentioning of patching/routing bullshit would look like this:

source--->input to console--->A/D converter--->hard drive/DAW--->D/A converter--->input BACK to console--->analog summing buss
 
so then you would be using twice the amount of channels?

or set up a patchbay and unplug then replug things?

and you would have direct outs going to the a/d converter correct?

is that the uhh channel insert jack? because i didnt see anything that said direct out, like i was lookin for.
 
Tragic,

Most "reasonable" consoles have the following in/outs on each channel...........: Mic In (XLR), Line IN, Inserts, Tape Send, Tape Return. Terminology may vary but that's about the norm.

You connect the Tape Send to "go to" your interface/recorder and the interface/recorder "comes back" to the Tape Return, all "permanently" connected. Each channel on the console has a switch which allows you to be either sending OR receiving on that particular channel.

From looking at the ATB, I think they are calling the "Tape Sends", "DIR OUT" and the "Tape Return", "Mon"......ie: you are monitoring the recorded sound. The photo is blurry so Im not 100% sure, BUT it does have the correct number of "ins/outs" on each channel to match with the normal configurations.

Inserts are normally used to "insert" a compressor (or some other dynamic processor) into the specific channel.

:cool:
 
oooh gotcha.

yeah, i couldnt read what it said in the pic either.

that makes perfect sense.

so then when you are 'summing' you would be sending each track thru a different output and into the board again.

so, channels mic pre and sends are for tracking.

then the interfaces outputs and the channels return are for mixing and summing.

that makes everything alot simpler.
 
My understanding of the term "summing"..........think sum = adding. So when you are mixing down recorded tracks either to send out to one of the "Sub Groups" or the main "Stereo Mix" channel, you are adding individual tracks together or "summing" them.

To get a better "general" understanding, it might be an idea if you d/load the *pdf User Guide for Soundcraft's Spirit Studio mixer here........ http://www.soundcraft.com/product_sheet.asp?product_id=92 ...........the Toft ATB is similar enough that you should get an idea of what it can do, options for connections, etc. Mackie 8 buss mixers are also similar but I'm sitting at my S/craft as I type this so that's what I'm more familiar with.

"In Line"/"8 buss" consoles are designed so that each channel's circuits, can, at the press of a switch, be split into two seperate channels, one being for initial tracking and the other for monitoring the already recorded tracks.......in this configuration, the EQ section and Aux Sends, etc., are usually split and there is a rotary fader for the monitor path. OK, it does reduce the available EQ functions to some degree but the one advantage with this idea is that, if you have the capabilities to have recorded more tracks than you have channel on your console, you can "split" sufficent channels to accomodate these additional tracks........this is why manufacturers will often say for example, that their 16 channel mixer has up to 32 channels available for mixdown.

Confusing ain't it :D

These consoles are designed to offer various methods of working, so within the circuitry there are numerous options available, usually at the press of a switch and while the flexibility is admirable, for someone not used to them they can be bloody confusing, I've had my S/craft for a few years and there's still aspects of it that I'm either not comfortable with or not even familiar with but it works the way I need it to so that's all that matters.

:cool:
 
ausrock said:
Tragic,

Most "reasonable" consoles have the following in/outs on each channel...........: Mic In (XLR), Line IN, Inserts, Tape Send, Tape Return. Terminology may vary but that's about the norm.

You connect the Tape Send to "go to" your interface/recorder and the interface/recorder "comes back" to the Tape Return, all "permanently" connected. Each channel on the console has a switch which allows you to be either sending OR receiving on that particular channel.

From looking at the ATB, I think they are calling the "Tape Sends", "DIR OUT" and the "Tape Return", "Mon"......ie: you are monitoring the recorded sound. The photo is blurry so Im not 100% sure, BUT it does have the correct number of "ins/outs" on each channel to match with the normal configurations.

Inserts are normally used to "insert" a compressor (or some other dynamic processor) into the specific channel.

:cool:
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this, except:

"Each channel on the console has a switch which allows you to be either sending OR receiving on that particular channel".

The thing is, the Toft ATB has "Mon" control on each channel, which is like a second "mix" you can set up. In the master monitor control section, you can pick to monitor mix "A" which is the main channels, or mix "B" the Monitor channels. This allows you to use the preamps/channel strip to go to tape, but to also monitor the tape returns as a different mix at the same time. There is a switch somewhere that will "flip" the Tape Return and Line In inputs to go between Mix A and B. One way, the Line In goes to the "Mon" and the Tape Return goes to the Main Channel strip. Flip that switch and the Line Input goes to the Main Channel and the Tape Return goes to the "Mon" section on the main channel.

Kind of cool concept. It is called an "inline" mixer. Instead of having the monitor channels on the right hand side of the console, they just put them on each channel, and allow them to double up to the main buss at mix time.
 
Hey Ed,

About time you got here :) . I think I may have clarified the inline thing a bit in that last post of mine but unfortunately, I haven't seen the ATB close up to know exactly what it's functionality is. Damn, I'd love to put a 32 ATB in place of my S/craft, the poor thing is getting a bit long in the tooth and has a couple of little bugs in it, I tend to find "work arounds" but I guess I can dream.

:cool:
 
thanks alot guys.

thats a pretty cool idea, like you said.

i'm liking the board alot, and i've never used it or heard it. supposed to be really nice sounding though, and i'm seriously looking into it.

any other boards out there that are similar, maybe something that's availible used?
i know alot of people use the soundcraft ghosts. are they nice sounding?

i saw a guy has one for 1500 in the ads.. not bad at all, less than half the price of the new atb 16 channel..
 
As mentioned above, inline consoles are a good way of acheiving sends and returns and adding more channels in less space. Split designs are also great, but take up more room. One thing to watch for when purchasing an inline console is how the console is designed. Some consoles (more affordable ones like Ghosts and Mackie 8 bussers...) offer the return on rotary pots with limited and/or shared EQ and limited routing. For many people this still works out just fine. Other nicer inline consoles though will offer returns with faders, better routing, and better channel options (inserts, EQ's, routing etc...).
 
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